Recovering legal fees when in the right
Discussion
A friend runs a business but the landlord decided his business wasn't appropriate for the business premises lease. This was disputed and eventually went to solicitors on both sides. Eventually the landlord accepted they were wrong and the business use was legitimate but not before my friend incurred £20k of legal fees.
He is glad to put it behind him but is there any avenue to recover these legal fees from the landlord or are they simply sunk costs associated with running a business?
Many thanks.
He is glad to put it behind him but is there any avenue to recover these legal fees from the landlord or are they simply sunk costs associated with running a business?
Many thanks.
Scarletpimpofnel said:
A friend runs a business but the landlord decided his business wasn't appropriate for the business premises lease. This was disputed and eventually went to solicitors on both sides. Eventually the landlord accepted they were wrong and the business use was legitimate but not before my friend incurred £20k of legal fees.
He is glad to put it behind him but is there any avenue to recover these legal fees from the landlord or are they simply sunk costs associated with running a business?
Many thanks.
Depends how the landlord accepted. Did they sign anything between each other to close it off or just agree to give up?He is glad to put it behind him but is there any avenue to recover these legal fees from the landlord or are they simply sunk costs associated with running a business?
Many thanks.
Perhaps it could be argued breach of contract if the landlord has accepted the business use was permitted but you’d need to go to court to get that proven, so yet more solicitors…
I d say any cost recovery would be highly unlikely, if the dispute had not seen the inside of a property tribunal or a court hearing.
The lease may make provision for such a situation (again, highly unlikely) but it would be worth a quick read to double check and if unsure, maybe ask the Solicitor your friend used to force the backdown of the opposing party, for their opinion on recovering costs.
The lease may make provision for such a situation (again, highly unlikely) but it would be worth a quick read to double check and if unsure, maybe ask the Solicitor your friend used to force the backdown of the opposing party, for their opinion on recovering costs.
Edited by ADJimbo on Sunday 30th November 23:00
silentbrown said:
I'd have thought any reputable solicitor would have told your friend about the (lack of?) prospects of recovering costs from the outset.
They should have done, but sometimes it does and can get missed. I was just advising the OP to advise his friend to ask the question as a belt-and-braces exercise.
Sometimes the silliest of questions delivers the shrewdest of results.
Scarletpimpofnel said:
Thanks all for your responses. He will be asking his solicitor shortly about recovery of his costs.
It seems very unfair to me that someone can wrongly come after you and then when they admit they re wrong you are left with a load of costs.
Whilst you're right it does seem generally that as soon as Solicitor's /Lawyers get involved that end result is inevitable.It seems very unfair to me that someone can wrongly come after you and then when they admit they re wrong you are left with a load of costs.
I'm still involved ( as LPA /Litigation" friend") with a case of a will being challenged ( wrongly ) and even after "winning" in court and potentially then having to reclaim against the person for costs the most we can recover is limited to 70% - not that I want to actually do that but the other Executors do.
1. the easiest way to make a small fortune is start with a large one and sue someone.
2. If it has got to a point where he has incurred £20k in fees the landlord has probably incurred similar, so if I was the friend I would look for new premises quick smart before the landlord finds a bone-fide reason to kick him out, or several gentlemen from the Chartered Institute of Troublemakers & Violent Evictors, currently with Big Ron as the Senior Master of the Lodge
2. If it has got to a point where he has incurred £20k in fees the landlord has probably incurred similar, so if I was the friend I would look for new premises quick smart before the landlord finds a bone-fide reason to kick him out, or several gentlemen from the Chartered Institute of Troublemakers & Violent Evictors, currently with Big Ron as the Senior Master of the Lodge
Scarletpimpofnel said:
A friend runs a business but the landlord decided his business wasn't appropriate for the business premises lease. This was disputed and eventually went to solicitors on both sides. Eventually the landlord accepted they were wrong and the business use was legitimate but not before my friend incurred £20k of legal fees.
He is glad to put it behind him but is there any avenue to recover these legal fees from the landlord or are they simply sunk costs associated with running a business?
Many thanks.
i think this is one of the reasons why people often settle early rather than drag things out, even when they know they're "in the right". it's because the legal costs can exceed the value of the amount being claimed. It's highly frustrating and possibly why there used to be so many "no Win, No Fee" ambulance chasing firms around.He is glad to put it behind him but is there any avenue to recover these legal fees from the landlord or are they simply sunk costs associated with running a business?
Many thanks.
Scarletpimpofnel said:
A friend runs a business but the landlord decided his business wasn't appropriate for the business premises lease. This was disputed and eventually went to solicitors on both sides. Eventually the landlord accepted they were wrong and the business use was legitimate but not before my friend incurred £20k of legal fees.
He is glad to put it behind him but is there any avenue to recover these legal fees from the landlord or are they simply sunk costs associated with running a business?
Many thanks.
Your solicitor should have made it a condition of settling the claim that the landlord would pay your legal costs. Why didn't they?He is glad to put it behind him but is there any avenue to recover these legal fees from the landlord or are they simply sunk costs associated with running a business?
Many thanks.
They should also have considered at a very early point in the dispute making a `Part 36 Offer' to settle - for example, they could have made a Part 36 offer to settle on the basis that your use of the property was legitimate (which appears to have been what actually happened).
Had they done so, and your landlord had accepted the offer, then you would automatically have been entitled to your legal costs, even though no court proceedings had been issued.
I would say yes.
You have a right to quiet enjoyment of the property.
The landlord sought to interrupt that right and you incurred costs defending it.
Personally I would get me lawyer to write setting out the claim. If they deny it then I would issue in the small claims court ( not using the lawyer ) for £10k which is the small claim limit.
Your only exposure is the court fee
You have a right to quiet enjoyment of the property.
The landlord sought to interrupt that right and you incurred costs defending it.
Personally I would get me lawyer to write setting out the claim. If they deny it then I would issue in the small claims court ( not using the lawyer ) for £10k which is the small claim limit.
Your only exposure is the court fee
ADJimbo said:
silentbrown said:
I'd have thought any reputable solicitor would have told your friend about the (lack of?) prospects of recovering costs from the outset.
They should have done, but sometimes it does and can get missed. I was just advising the OP to advise his friend to ask the question as a belt-and-braces exercise.
Sometimes the silliest of questions delivers the shrewdest of results.
Pro Bono said:
Scarletpimpofnel said:
A friend runs a business but the landlord decided his business wasn't appropriate for the business premises lease. This was disputed and eventually went to solicitors on both sides. Eventually the landlord accepted they were wrong and the business use was legitimate but not before my friend incurred £20k of legal fees.
He is glad to put it behind him but is there any avenue to recover these legal fees from the landlord or are they simply sunk costs associated with running a business?
Many thanks.
Your solicitor should have made it a condition of settling the claim that the landlord would pay your legal costs. Why didn't they?He is glad to put it behind him but is there any avenue to recover these legal fees from the landlord or are they simply sunk costs associated with running a business?
Many thanks.
They should also have considered at a very early point in the dispute making a `Part 36 Offer' to settle - for example, they could have made a Part 36 offer to settle on the basis that your use of the property was legitimate (which appears to have been what actually happened).
Had they done so, and your landlord had accepted the offer, then you would automatically have been entitled to your legal costs, even though no court proceedings had been issued.
Jeremy-75qq8 said:
I would say yes.
You have a right to quiet enjoyment of the property.
The landlord sought to interrupt that right and you incurred costs defending it.
Personally I would get me lawyer to write setting out the claim. If they deny it then I would issue in the small claims court ( not using the lawyer ) for £10k which is the small claim limit.
Your only exposure is the court fee
MCOL I assume is an option in this case?You have a right to quiet enjoyment of the property.
The landlord sought to interrupt that right and you incurred costs defending it.
Personally I would get me lawyer to write setting out the claim. If they deny it then I would issue in the small claims court ( not using the lawyer ) for £10k which is the small claim limit.
Your only exposure is the court fee
I was wondering if complaining to the landlord's trade bodies would have any value in forcing their hand or causing them some pain!?
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