Greenland and Donald Trump

[Wacky Racer]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/m0028msr/is-...

Well worth a watch if you have the time.

Thoughts?

[crofty1984]

I don't think it's a likelyhood but say USA invade Greenland militarily and Europe says "Yes, we are now at open war with America".
Could America win a war with all of Europe? They are massively more powerful than any one country, but what about the continent?
Who (individual nation or alliance of countries) could beat the USA in a war?

[Jordan247]

crofty1984 said:

I don't think it's a likelyhood but say USA invade Greenland militarily and Europe says "Yes, we are now at open war with America".
Could America win a war with all of Europe? They are massively more powerful than any one country, but what about the continent?
Who (individual nation or alliance of countries) could beat the USA in a war?

I suspect USA could easily beat Europe in a War.

The tricky part would be that the UK (and I'm sure other European countries) are a big part of the US defence industry supply chain.

Perhaps its time to reconsider RAF Fairford, Lakenheath, Mildenhall and 5 Eyes.

[clarkey]

I imagine our F-35, KC-135, etc would suddenly develop some faults and stop working.
Not the slightest chance Europe would go to war with the USA. Highly likely that NATO is going to collapse however!

[aeropilot]

clarkey said:

I imagine our F-35, KC-135, etc would suddenly develop some faults and stop working.
Not the slightest chance Europe would go to war with the USA. Highly likely that NATO is going to collapse however!

Yes, if USA effectively invade Greenland and take it over by force, then yes, not a chance Denmark and other European countries would go to war with USA, but as you say, that would be the end of NATO, and Putin must be rubbing his hands together that this is what comes to pass.

(oh and the UK doesn't have any KC-135's )

[Zetec-S]

crofty1984 said:

I don't think it's a likelyhood but say USA invade Greenland militarily and Europe says "Yes, we are now at open war with America".
Could America win a war with all of Europe? They are massively more powerful than any one country, but what about the continent?
Who (individual nation or alliance of countries) could beat the USA in a war?

The US spends more on their military than all of Europe combined. More than twice as much I believe.

It's navy and strategic bomber fleet alone would give it the opportunity to strike targets in Europe, with Europe having limited options to strike back at the mainland US. Also bear in mind the US has significant armed forces based across Europe, so the question would be what would happen to those? Would they be withdrawn before things went "really bad", or if it was a relatively fast decline in relations could the US use them before Europe had a chance to neutralise their effectiveness.

Also bear in mind the US would be fighting as one entity, as opposed to multiple European countries/armies, each with their own priorities and agendas.

[WH16]

There is no need to take it 'militarily', but if they did neither Denmark nor wider Europe would have the capability or inclination to take it back This is just more TDS by the media. It is his typical escalate to de-escalate MO. Wind everyone up with some outlandish claim then settle on some reasonable compromise.

[nikaiyo2]

crofty1984 said:

I don't think it's a likelyhood but say USA invade Greenland militarily and Europe says "Yes, we are now at open war with America".
Could America win a war with all of Europe? They are massively more powerful than any one country, but what about the continent?
Who (individual nation or alliance of countries) could beat the USA in a war?

How would my nanna do against Mike Tyson ?

I think the US would beat Europe with ease.

They have 70 Arleigh Burke-class destroyers, the UK, France & Italy combined have 19 similar ships.

It feels like a bizzare conversation to be having. To even think that the US might attempt to take Greenland by force. I get deposing Maduro, it makes sense and likely the world is well served by that action, but to invade Greenland, utter madness.

Edited by nikaiyo2 on Tuesday 6th January 14:06

[BikeBikeBIke]

nikaiyo2 said:

It feels like a bizzare conversation to be having. To even think that the US might attempt to take Greenland by force. I get deposing Maduro, it makes sense and likely the world is well served by that action, but to invade Greenland, utter madness.

Yup, America has no need to invade Greenland they get everything the need from Greenland as things are they have unlimited scope to put bases there and use the land.

In the unlikely event America did invade Greenland the administration that follows could just give it back.

Most of all Trump is a second term President and is destined to spend his last two years as a lame duck. There will be no invasion.

Still, it's got us all talking, which is why he keeps saying this nonsense.

[aeropilot]

Zetec-S said:

The US spends more on their military than all of Europe combined. More than twice as much I believe.

It's navy and strategic bomber fleet alone would give it the opportunity to strike targets in Europe, with Europe having limited options to strike back at the mainland US. Also bear in mind the US has significant armed forces based across Europe, so the question would be what would happen to those? Would they be withdrawn before things went "really bad", or if it was a relatively fast decline in relations could the US use them before Europe had a chance to neutralise their effectiveness.

Also bear in mind the US would be fighting as one entity, as opposed to multiple European countries/armies, each with their own priorities and agendas.

This is the biggest single factor that would cripple any European response, as NATO completely relies on USA command and control, so with that immediately removed by the USA (not to mention USA forces stationed within European countries!!) the European countries would not be able to coordinate any response...even if they wanted to. The big question would be what would Canada do, as it would be hemmed in on 3 sides by USA if they did take it over.....and would Canada stay in NATO given that situation?
Greenland, and Denmark is fecked basically, they are pretty powerless to do anything about it if Trump decides to just walk in.
The Greenland people saying they want independence hasn't helped, as how did they expect to defend themselves once independant, not that it makes much difference if they decide to stay part of Denmark, as Denmark can't defend them either from the USA.

[AbbeyNormal]

Greenland need to play the Donald at his own game.

Offer it to him at the bargain price of two trillion dollars. Also tell the Donald that they are upping the cost of the airbase rental because they are fed up of Denmark / Greenland taxpayers being ripped off by free loading countries. Tell them it will cost them 100 million per month starting in six months as they are clearly desperate for it.

The art of the deal..

[J4CKO]

I suspect a deal will be done, it will stop short of full invasion but the US will get what they want in their new role as school bully.

Really not a good look for the US one way or the other.

Americans really like to paint themselves as the "good guys" in every scenario, not looking like that now.

[BikeBikeBIke]

J4CKO said:

I suspect a deal will be done, it will stop short of full invasion but the US will get what they want

What specifically do you think they want that they don't already have?

[aeropilot]

J4CKO said:

I suspect a deal will be done, it will stop short of full invasion but the US will get what they want in their new role as school bully.

Really not a good look for the US one way or the other.

But, its not a new role to them, if ones knows enough about their attitudes during and after WW1, and then during and after WW2.
The USA did everything they could to make sure the old European colonial superpowers would be destroyed as part of the deal to help out.......leaving them free to replace them with their own version of a 'colonial superpower'......(meet the new boss, same as the old boss) but they read the room massively wrong when it came to dealing with the USSR, and hence why we ended up with the post 1945 Cold War (even though Churchill had warned them)

[isaldiri]

J4CKO said:

I suspect a deal will be done, it will stop short of full invasion but the US will get what they want in their new role as school bully.

Really not a good look for the US one way or the other.

Americans really like to paint themselves as the "good guys" in every scenario, not looking like that now.

you might want to look harder at how the US actually has behaved over the years. it's not 'new' and as far as whether it's a good look, it's pretty much the 'same old' either way.

[S600BSB]

Make America great again. Starting with the midterms in November.

[Superflow]

This liberation will certainly get more votes for the President in the midterms.

[pinchmeimdreamin]

BikeBikeBIke said:

J4CKO said:

I suspect a deal will be done, it will stop short of full invasion but the US will get what they want

What specifically do you think they want that they don't already have?

All of its Resources ( gotta keep his donors happy )

[aeropilot]

Superflow said:

This liberation will certainly get more votes for the President in the midterms.

Yep, all part of his calculations.

Again, the noise over Greenland over the coming months will stir up the MAGA numpties into a rah-rah-rah frenzy again.

By the end of this year though, we should start to see who is being lined up as the next Don in the MAGA-mafia, I presume its going to be Vance.

[BikeBikeBIke]

pinchmeimdreamin said:

BikeBikeBIke said:

J4CKO said:

I suspect a deal will be done, it will stop short of full invasion but the US will get what they want

What specifically do you think they want that they don't already have?

All of its Resources ( gotta keep his donors happy )

So why invade? Just offer every inhabitant $1,000,000. Much easier than an invasion.