More Govt meddling ...

[Terminator X]

Reduced drink drive limit, autonomous braking systems in cars etc

https://www.gov.uk/government/news/thousands-of-li...

Can't see any link to the consultation though.

Imho reduced drink driving limit will just be more pain for pubs as drink drivers will drink no matter what the limit is. I'll just stay home if having one drink takes you over the limit.

TX.

[AlexGSi2000]

We should just put a ban on driving really - all the roads currently in use could then be redeveloped for affordable housing.

[Night Owl]

AlexGSi2000 said:

We should just put a ban on driving really - all the roads currently in use could then be redeveloped for affordable housing.

That is the aim in the long run.

[Opapayer]

I don’t really see how it’s such a problem.

Drink driving limits being lowered si a good thing IMO. It makes it even clearer that you really shouldn’t have anything to drink before getting behind the wheel. The argument over “drink drivers will do it anyway” is facetious in the extreme. That’s true of every law and if we just gave up and abolished the law, then it would be the definition of anarchy.

More training for learners again can only be a good thing, if it reduces the KSI in that age range, even by a small amount. Young drivers are an astonishingly over represented range in the deaths and serious injury category.

Equally, graduated driving licences seems like a decent idea too. At the moment it’s sort of happening by default given the cost of insurance on higher powered / sporty cars, but there are plenty of ways around it if you really want to try. Regulating it amd making the rules clearer on both sides is a good thing. Motorbikes have been graduated for years now. That’s a very niche mode of transport though and more for a hobby than a primary mode (cue a load of grey haired beardies in their 60s telling me how it’s not true and completely missing the point over youngsters).

[alscar]

Commendable ideas but as usual with HMG target setting ,65% less deaths and serious injuries by 2035 is no doubt doomed to fail if these are the only suggested measures.
Why not make all drivers subject to having eye tests every 2 years or altered to be on a matrix according to age than just select the over 70’s for instance ?

[worsy]

I'd be supportive of lowering the DD limit but I think more so if the consequence was 6 points and a fine at that lower limit. Keeping a ban at 35+

[pteron]

I've no real horse in this race, but something that struck me as someone who prefers evidence driven legislation (perish the thought) - the headlines I saw were reporting that most of the European peers have lower drink driving limits and the UK should follow suit 'cos it's better innit.

But the UK's roads are already significantly safer than many of the comparable countries, half the death rate of France, Belgium etc for instance.

Is drink driving (other than emotive stories in the press) really such a problem?

[vaud]

No issue with many of these to be honest.

• New measures will also target the growing problem of illegal number plates, including ghost plates designed to fool camera systems, while also cracking down on uninsured drivers and vehicles without a valid MOT.

Fine. In fact, good.

• A consultation will explore the use of preventative technology, such as alcohol interlock devices and new powers to suspend driving licences for those suspected of drink or drug driving offences.

Good. Countries that use them: "US, Canada, Australia, Sweden, Finland, France, Belgium, the Netherlands, Poland, and Italy, with new EU rules requiring a standardized interface for them on all new vehicles since 2022 to encourage wider adoption, especially for professional fleets.". If it's good enough for socialist, nanny states like the US...

• Consultation on mandatory eyesight testing for those over 70 will be launched, while options for cognitive testing will also be developed to protect all road users.

Good. Should be mandatory for all. Maybe every 5 years for <70 and every 2 years >70. As for cognitive functions, there is no way my grandfather should have been driving for the last 5 years of his life. I've never been more scared as a passenger.


Note that some countries use alcohol interlock rehabilitation programmes as an alternative to driving bans. So if you get caught for being just over, it is possibly disproportionately expensive for society if they lose their job, etc. Interlocks provide another option for a judge? Blow clean for 2 years and then it's removed?

Edited by vaud on Wednesday 7th January 09:53

[HTP99]

From what I've read, lowering the DD limit in Scotland, has had no effect whatsoever on lowering accident rates, however I guess general convictions have likely gone up so it makes it look like a win!

[Wills2]

HTP99 said:

From what I've read, lowering the DD limit in Scotland, has had no effect whatsoever on lowering accident rates, however I guess general convictions have likely gone up so it makes it look like a win!

This is the issue all they are doing now via reducing speed limits and these kinds of measures is just bringing in more and more people into the criminal justice system, it's not changing anything for the better or making anything safer, drunk and reckless drivers will still be drunk and reckless...

I do not drink and drive not even half a pint but that's not the point, we'll get to the situation whereby trace amounts of alcohol from the night before will result in a ban, they are hell bent on legislating the country to a stand still.

[Red9zero]

I did a fair few miles over Christmas and New Year and saw one check point set up to check for drink drivers. That was pretty much the only time I saw and Police over that period. Apparently they caught a couple of drink drivers, but the rest were for vehicle defects. They can lower the limit all they want, but especially in the countryside, who is going to enforce it ? FWIW I have reported our neighbour countless times for drink driving, even with video evidence of her crawling out of her car to her gate, and nothing ever happens.

[alscar]

Wills2 said:

I do not drink and drive not even half a pint but that's not the point, we'll get to the situation whereby trace amounts of alcohol from the night before will result in a ban, they are hell bent on legislating the country to a stand still.

Likewise and yes agree with you.
That’s one reason why having some form of limit is still needed just in case that Sherry trifle puts you over !
I don’t include benders the night before and then driving early the next day in that though.

[Red9zero]

ryanmitchell said:

Honestly, sometimes it feels like stopping private cars altogether would solve a lot. The space taken up by roads could be transformed into much needed, affordable housing instead.

Having driven into Bristol this morning, that may well be the plan

[raspy]

Terminator X said:

Reduced drink drive limit, autonomous braking systems in cars etc

https://www.gov.uk/government/news/thousands-of-li...

Can't see any link to the consultation though.

Imho reduced drink driving limit will just be more pain for pubs as drink drivers will drink no matter what the limit is. I'll just stay home if having one drink takes you over the limit.

TX.

They wouldn't need to "meddle" if people didn't cause accidents that end up harming and killing people. Think about it for a second.

[Evercross]

Opapayer said:

I don't really see how (reducing drink-drive limit) is such a problem.

Because it is performative nonsense. Scotland did this in 2014.

Here's a peer-reviewed academic study of the effect it had (clue - none!)

On the back of that evidence, supporting this move in the belief that it is changing outcomes proves you are an idiot. Any time or money spent on this change is wasted.

On a wider note - it is a failure of our society that we seem to have engendered a belief system that states the appearance of change when you aren't making any actual difference is a good thing, and that to argue against well-intentioned performative change (with no outcome change) makes you a bad person.

Edited by Evercross on Wednesday 7th January 10:37

[RandomCarChat]

Doesn't this always come back to the age old issue of enforcement?

You can lower limits and bring new rules in all you want but if there isn't anyone to catch them it's just a waste of time.

[Evercross]

RandomCarChat said:

Doesn't this always come back to the age old issue of enforcement?

You can lower limits and bring new rules in all you want but if there isn't anyone to catch them it's just a waste of time.

Exactly this. The study also pointed out that increased availability of alternative transport would have a much greater effect on reducing drink driving, especially in rural areas.

All stick and no carrot.

[Over over under steer]

Having spent the last month living in Sydney, Australia, I feel the cumulative effect of small seemingly sensible changes on the population. This place feels fundamentally like people have fewer liberties than in the UK. Some examples I ve noted:

1) All car seats must have two anchor points, ISOFIX not enough, and your seat installation must be assessed by a third party and you re given a pass to confirm it s safe. No ability to move car seats between cars without risking voiding insurance and tickets.

2) two stages of P plates post passing your test, adding further bureaucracy to the process.

3) Double demerits over Christmas for driving offences - because why not.

4) LED massive billboards on most of the northern beaches reminding you that you must not drink alcohol on them after 8pm.


All these items will have come into effect in response to a public incident, or based on something sensible, but the fundamental thing is that adults are treated as less free, less able to make independent choices. It s a lovely place but it s mental.

In short, changes like OP has mentioned is another step in the direction of Aus, and one we should not welcome.

[CMTMB]

ryanmitchell said:

Honestly, sometimes it feels like stopping private cars altogether would solve a lot. The space taken up by roads could be transformed into much needed, affordable housing instead.

Interesting first post. Are you sure this is the forum for you?

[JD]

CMTMB said:

ryanmitchell said:

Honestly, sometimes it feels like stopping private cars altogether would solve a lot. The space taken up by roads could be transformed into much needed, affordable housing instead.

Interesting first post. Are you sure this is the forum for you?

Isn’t it just a bot, repurposing the first reply in the thread?