NYC or Toronto Dec 2026
Discussion
Currently thinking of going to either NY or Toronto the week before Christmas, with wife and two teenagers (will be 18 and 16). Any views on which might be best/most fun?
We did New York a few years ago in the summer, so have already done a lot of the main sights (Empire State Building, Central Park, boat cruise etc), but obviously there is plenty more stuff to do. Toronto has appeared on the radar as flights a bit limited to NYC using 241 voucher but can get the exact dates we want for Toronto.
Any advice gratefully received.
We did New York a few years ago in the summer, so have already done a lot of the main sights (Empire State Building, Central Park, boat cruise etc), but obviously there is plenty more stuff to do. Toronto has appeared on the radar as flights a bit limited to NYC using 241 voucher but can get the exact dates we want for Toronto.
Any advice gratefully received.
Jader1973 said:
Don t go anywhere near the US while the Nazis are in charge.
How to make yourself look like a raving moron with one easy post... 
Back on topic, I dislike (and mostly avoid) cities in general so no opinion on Toronto vs NY cities themselves, but there are some good places to see in the wider Toronto area - Niagara Falls is worth seeing (probably iced up in Dec?), Niagara-on-the-lake is a very nice historic town, plenty of good scenery around area, historic forts etc.
Edited by GravelBen on Wednesday 21st January 20:03
GravelBen said:
Jader1973 said:
Don t go anywhere near the US while the Nazis are in charge.
How to make yourself look like a raving moron with one easy post... Back on topic, I dislike (and mostly avoid) cities in general so no opinion on Toronto vs NY cities themselves, but there are some good places to see in the wider Toronto area - Niagara Falls is worth seeing (probably iced up in Dec?), Niagara-on-the-lake is a very nice historic town, plenty of good scenery around area, historic forts etc.
Edited by GravelBen on Wednesday 21st January 20:03
GravelBen said:
How to make yourself look like a raving moron with one easy post...
Back on topic, I dislike (and mostly avoid) cities in general so no opinion on Toronto vs NY cities themselves, but there are some good places to see in the wider Toronto area - Niagara Falls is worth seeing (probably iced up in Dec?), Niagara-on-the-lake is a very nice historic town, plenty of good scenery around area, historic forts etc.
Except there are 4.5 million fewer visitors when compared to last year, so maybe not as moronic as you suggest.Back on topic, I dislike (and mostly avoid) cities in general so no opinion on Toronto vs NY cities themselves, but there are some good places to see in the wider Toronto area - Niagara Falls is worth seeing (probably iced up in Dec?), Niagara-on-the-lake is a very nice historic town, plenty of good scenery around area, historic forts etc.
Edited by GravelBen on Wednesday 21st January 20:03
I quite like the US, but there's not a hope in hell I'd visit for tourism currently.
TGCOTF-dewey said:
Except there are 4.5 million fewer visitors when compared to last year, so maybe not as moronic as you suggest.
I quite like the US, but there's not a hope in hell I'd visit for tourism currently.
By all means make your own choices about whether you think their administration (or your attitude to them) is likely to impact a potential visit, no issue with that - there would certainly be places in the USA I would avoid if I went there any time soon, but other parts I'd be more inclined to visit than England.I quite like the US, but there's not a hope in hell I'd visit for tourism currently.
But I stand by my opinion that the previous poster's drivel about nazis makes them look like a moron.
Edited by GravelBen on Wednesday 21st January 22:40
GravelBen said:
TGCOTF-dewey said:
Except there are 4.5 million fewer visitors when compared to last year, so maybe not as moronic as you suggest.
I quite like the US, but there's not a hope in hell I'd visit for tourism currently.
By all means make your own choices about whether you think their administration (or your attitude to them) is likely to impact a potential visit, no issue with that - there would certainly be places in the USA I would avoid if I went there any time soon, but other parts I'd be more inclined to visit than England.I quite like the US, but there's not a hope in hell I'd visit for tourism currently.
But I stand by my opinion that the previous poster's drivel about nazis makes them look like a moron.
Edited by GravelBen on Wednesday 21st January 22:40
Rather than moronic, I think you have your head in the sand.
1. Powerful and Continuing Nationalism
Fascist regimes tend to make constant use of patriotic mottos, slogans, symbols, songs, and other paraphernalia. Flags are seen everywhere, as are
flag symbols on clothing and in public displays.
2. Disdain for the Recognition of Human Rights
Because of fear of enemies and the need for security, the people in fascist regimes are persuaded that human rights can be ignored in certain cases
because of "need." The people tend to look the other way or even approve of torture, summary executions, assassinations, long incarcerations of
prisoners, etc.
3. Identification of Enemies/Scapegoats as a Unifying Cause
The people are rallied into a unifying patriotic frenzy over the need to eliminate a perceived common threat or foe: racial , ethnic or religious
minorities; liberals; communists; socialists, terrorists, etc.
4. Supremacy of the Military
Even when there are widespread domestic problems, the military is given a disproportionate amount of government funding, and the domestic
agenda is neglected. Soldiers and military service are glamorized.
5. Rampant Sexism
The governments of fascist nations tend to be almost exclusively male-dominated. Under fascist regimes, traditional gender roles are made more
rigid. Opposition to abortion is high, as is homophobia and anti-gay legislation and national policy.
6. Controlled Mass Media
Sometimes to media is directly controlled by the government, but in other cases, the media is indirectly controlled by government regulation, or
sympathetic media spokespeople and executives. Censorship, especially in war time, is very common.
7. Obsession with National Security
Fear is used as a motivational tool by the government over the masses.
8. Religion and Government are Intertwined
Governments in fascist nations tend to use the most common religion in the nation as a tool to manipulate public opinion. Religious rhetoric and
terminology is common from government leaders, even when the major tenets of the religion are diametrically opposed to the government's policies
or actions.
9. Corporate Power is Protected
The industrial and business aristocracy of a fascist nation often are the ones who put the government leaders into power, creating a mutually
beneficial business/government relationship and power elite.
10. Labor Power is Suppressed
Because the organizing power of labor is the only real threat to a fascist government, labor unions are either eliminated entirely, or are severely
suppressed .
11. Disdain for Intellectuals and the Arts
Fascist nations tend to promote and tolerate open hostility to higher education, and academia. It is not uncommon for professors and other
academics to be censored or even arrested. Free expression in the arts is openly attacked, and governments often refuse to fund the arts.
12. Obsession with Crime and Punishment
Under fascist regimes, the police are given almost limitless power to enforce laws. The people are often willing to overlook police abuses and even
forego civil liberties in the name of patriotism. There is often a national police force with virtually unlimited power in fascist nations.
13. Rampant Cronyism and Corruption
Fascist regimes almost always are governed by groups of friends and associates who appoint each other to government positions and use
governmental power and authority to protect their friends from accountability. It is not uncommon in fascist regimes for national resources and
even treasures to be appropriated or even outright stolen by government leaders.
14. Fraudulent Elections
Sometimes elections in fascist nations are a complete sham. Other times elections are manipulated by smear campaigns against or even
assassination of opposition candidates, use of legislation to control voting numbers.
TGCOTF-dewey said:
So these are the features of Fascism...give me an example of just one not rampant in the US currently.
Rather than moronic, I think you have your head in the sand.
I don't disagree in the slightest, and I'm also very much in the camp of not going to the USA until a suitable regime change has taken place, but for my part I didn't comment on that aspect as I didn't really want to sRather than moronic, I think you have your head in the sand.
t up the guy's holiday thread.InitialDave said:
I don't disagree in the slightest, and I'm also very much in the camp of not going to the USA until a suitable regime change has taken place, but for my part I didn't comment on that aspect as I didn't really want to st up the guy's holiday thread.
Fair point, but I did wait until he said flights booked.t up the guy's holiday thread.
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