What to change when doing the turbo

[TV200]

I’m going to book my car (73k miles 2013 2.2 diesel Honda CRV) in for a new turbo and actuator and oil pipes (it’s having issues when under load and I’d rather be able to rely on it then risk pumping oven cleaner in to the turbo). Should I be looking at getting anything else done at the same time due to the turbo being out- EGR, DPF etc? I’d rather pay a bit more now that pay for the work to be done twice! Thoughts? Thanks.

[Heaveho]

Has the turbo itself actually been diagnosed as having specific issues? On the information given, and at the mileage covered, unless the turbo has been condemned by someone in the know, it seems a quite extreme approach to go about replacing it and everything connected based on a hunch. If it's struggling, it could be one of many things, seized actuator, faulty blowoff valve, dodgy boost solenoid, loose hose, split intercooler.

I'd want somewhere to check what boost it's making, check for play in the impeller etc, as well as the rest of the things mentioned, before spending what will be a small fortune firing the parts cannon at it. Is there any black or blue smoke, increased oil or fuel consumption etc?

I have a modified Mitsubishi Evo, owned it for 22 years, no stranger to turbo anomalies.

Sorry if all this stuff has already been checked, but if it hasn't you might be throwing money at this for no result.

[ssray]

If you are going to replace the turbo then what risk is there using Mr muscle in the turbo?
It may save over 1k

[stevieturbo]

As has been said, what exactly happened ?

What you suggest would be a damned expensive parts cannon to replace all those parts without a hell of a good reason.

That said, if the turbo did st itself and dump a load of oil into the DPF ( and perhaps CAT if also fitted ), it may well screw it up. Not sure if that can be cleaned or if it might self clean after a while.
Even a load of oil in the exhaust will smoke like F for quite some time, but would clear up.

Can't see any of that harming EGR though

[TV200]

I appreciate and agreee with the comments - thanks. However...
The car has a turbo overpressure warning, however it only comes on in extremes - so towing a caravan or on a multi hour journey with a roof box and bike racks. The car is excellent otherwise and generally will drive with no issues. However, the last error was last August when on day 1 of a three week caravan holiday it decided to stop working. This caused huge issues - not helped by the AA european rescue being such a bunch of muppets that they ended up paying me compensation. A couple of years earlier it did the same after driving from the south of france to make a ferry - that time I limped back home and reset the error. Both of these really took the sheen off the holidays.

So its not terminal at the moment. I don't have the space and time to work on the car at the moment, and wouldn't want to do a fix such as the Mr Muscle one as I need to know the fix has worked rather than risk a low probability of it reoccuring when on holiday with my wife and two young kids (again!). The car must be worth around £8k, if I was to replace it, rather than roll the dice I'd buy something in warranty at £20k+. The car has been professionally undersealed, apart from the shock absorbers, it has new discs and pads all around and I'm happy to service it generally. So firing a parts cannon seems extreme, but if it gave me a car which was otherwise relaible for a couple of thousand it'd be cheaper than the depreciation on a newer car. I've been quoted about £1200 for a new turbo and a good bit of that must be labour getting to the turbo and taking it off - therefore it seems sensible (to me) to wonder if the DPF and EGR (and indeed anything else) is more accessible and would be minimal extra labour, whether to consider changing it.

[Heaveho]

By overpressure, I assume it means overboost. If so, in my experience, unlikely to be specifically an actual turbo issue, and more likely to be a sticking wastegate, actuator, or faulty boost solenoid. Generally if the actual turbo is the issue, it won't make target boost pressure due to an internal fault. Whereabouts in the country are you?

[TV200]

I believe it’s the actuator, but caused by carbon in the variable vane turbo.
I’m near Newbury, West Berkshire.

[TV200]

Sorry and yes, overboost not overpressure.

[paddy1970]

Carbon fouling of the vanes is a classic culprit. It causes the vanes to stick, the actuator overcorrects or can't reach its target position, and you get an overboost fault — exactly what he's describing. The fact it happens under sustained high load (towing, roof box on long motorway runs) rather than normal driving fits perfectly, because that's when the turbo is working hardest and vane position is most critical.

[Heaveho]

Yes, sorry, fair comment, forgot to take into account the possibility of it being a vv turbo.

Edited by Heaveho on Tuesday 10th February 14:08

[stevieturbo]

over boost, over pressure, same odds.

And you now say it doesn't work, what exactly doesn't work ? the car doesn't drive at all ? Or it doesn't make any boost at all ? Could be as simple as a hose coming off.

Really, you need to get it to a competent garage and let them diagnose and state what needs done.

Replacing parts that do not need replaced, doesn't really guarantee anything. And fitting aftermarket non OEM parts can often be a worse option that leaving good working OEM parts where they are.

Like you wouldn't just randomly rebuild an entire engine these days, just because it might make the car last another year or two....and even then, it might not depending on who did it

[TV200]

It works fine- just not when it’s towing or in a rush. So maybe just have the turbo replaced then and see if the garage raises any other issues…

[Heaveho]

TV200 said:

It works fine- just not when it s towing or in a rush. So maybe just have the turbo replaced then and see if the garage raises any other issues

I still think you're in danger of throwing money at something you don't need to. If it's only carbon build up on the vanes, it'll happen again on another turbo unless you change your driving style. By that I mean just drive the thing harder, more of the time. Decent fuel and regular high revs tends to help stop crap build up. If you're already committed to what seems like a large expense to cure the problem, you may as well attempt a small expense cure and have the turbo cleaned. You are in the potential position of saving a small fortune but with no downsides if it doesn't work, given you were already planning on a large expenditure anyway. Cleaning vv turbos seems to be a well known and easily achievable possibility.

[TV200]

Since the issue can up in August I’ve run through a few bottles of turbo cleaner and only use premium fuel. I also use it more for motorway runs. However as the issue came up after driving for about 7hours towing, there is no way to know if it’s worked- a new turbo would of course provide certainty! A professional clean seems to be little more than spraying water into the engine to clear the turbo, that doesn’t fill me with confidence and costs 1/3 of the cost of a new turbo anyway.
The only alternative is to change the car which seems even more extreme!

[TV200]

Unless there is somewhere which actually removes the turbo to clean it- but a reconditioned turbo is about £400, so the majority of the cost is the labour, oil change and oil pipes which would presumably still need doing?

[Heaveho]

TV200 said:

Unless there is somewhere which actually removes the turbo to clean it- but a reconditioned turbo is about £400, so the majority of the cost is the labour, oil change and oil pipes which would presumably still need doing?

Yeah, all fair comment. That's not expensive for a decent quality replacement turbo. You're the best one placed to understand the compromise of costs versus potential inconvenience to you, and it sounds like you're prepared to deal with that, so if you're happy to keep the car, as you obviously are, go for it. Good luck. Let us know the outcome.