Where do you start with EVs?
Discussion
I'm expecting to be mocked a bit for this but when I started looking at EVs, I felt overwhelmed by where to start.
EVs make most sense (as a tool, anyway) if charged on cheap overnight rates.
That makes the rest of your electricity pricy unless you've got solar panels/battery storage/both.
Then you've got to pay someone to put in an EV charger.
I struggle to know how people pay for all these things in one go, and while I see the long term plan I don't know if there's a sensible stepwise progression people make. If you can't afford all these things in one go, where do you start,?
I used to laugh at people who bought plug in hybrids and never plugged them in, but I can now see why people might do that- they intend to sort out the house to match it and they never do.
I'm thinking of moving in the next year or so, so I don't fancy oodles of solar/battery/charger expense for a house I might not be in.
Do people just finance these things on a second mortgage, or do people do this another way?
Sorry if this sounds thick or anti-EV. It's not meant to be; I'm just not sure where to start.
EVs make most sense (as a tool, anyway) if charged on cheap overnight rates.
That makes the rest of your electricity pricy unless you've got solar panels/battery storage/both.
Then you've got to pay someone to put in an EV charger.
I struggle to know how people pay for all these things in one go, and while I see the long term plan I don't know if there's a sensible stepwise progression people make. If you can't afford all these things in one go, where do you start,?
I used to laugh at people who bought plug in hybrids and never plugged them in, but I can now see why people might do that- they intend to sort out the house to match it and they never do.
I'm thinking of moving in the next year or so, so I don't fancy oodles of solar/battery/charger expense for a house I might not be in.
Do people just finance these things on a second mortgage, or do people do this another way?
Sorry if this sounds thick or anti-EV. It's not meant to be; I'm just not sure where to start.
Like those above, I ran mine of the supplied granny charger for the first year. Just got the faster charger fitted down the line when I had the funds.
I didn't find the day rate electricity was noticeably more expensive than the cheap rate, so no/negligible loss there. Instead I saved hundreds a month on fuel costs.
So outlay - car.
Charge - granny charger
Electricity costs - no change for house use
Petrol - saved hundreds a month.
I didn't find the day rate electricity was noticeably more expensive than the cheap rate, so no/negligible loss there. Instead I saved hundreds a month on fuel costs.
So outlay - car.
Charge - granny charger
Electricity costs - no change for house use
Petrol - saved hundreds a month.
Yes it can all be a bit overwhelming, it's hard to get your head around until you get some experience yourself, as well as the potential costs.
1) Charger - as said, unless you have a long commute you can use a three-pin charger, ~£150 or £0 if you get one with your car as I have (twice).
2) Electricity tariff. If you do nothing and charge at normal rate of 25p/kWh, that's still about half the fuel cost of petrol or diesel.
Once you get some usage under your belt you can put together a spreadsheet and decide if it's worth going to an EV specific tariff. The 'surcharge' on day rates is only 4-5p a kWh, and the overnight saving is ~18p a unit. This means that if you could say run the dishwasher or laundry overnight then you probably end up paying the same for domestic electricity, before you consider the savings on charging the car.
3) Solar panels, battery storage - may be worthwhile on their own merits, but not necessary for EV ownership.
So broadly as said, you can just buy an EV and plug it in at home and it'll start saving you money on running costs right away. The rest you can safely defer and make a decision on once you have more experience.
If you share your expected usage pattern (length of journeys, weekly mileage) and rough budget then people may be able to make suggestions of what sort of car to look at.
1) Charger - as said, unless you have a long commute you can use a three-pin charger, ~£150 or £0 if you get one with your car as I have (twice).
2) Electricity tariff. If you do nothing and charge at normal rate of 25p/kWh, that's still about half the fuel cost of petrol or diesel.
Once you get some usage under your belt you can put together a spreadsheet and decide if it's worth going to an EV specific tariff. The 'surcharge' on day rates is only 4-5p a kWh, and the overnight saving is ~18p a unit. This means that if you could say run the dishwasher or laundry overnight then you probably end up paying the same for domestic electricity, before you consider the savings on charging the car.
3) Solar panels, battery storage - may be worthwhile on their own merits, but not necessary for EV ownership.
So broadly as said, you can just buy an EV and plug it in at home and it'll start saving you money on running costs right away. The rest you can safely defer and make a decision on once you have more experience.
If you share your expected usage pattern (length of journeys, weekly mileage) and rough budget then people may be able to make suggestions of what sort of car to look at.
Solar and battery are not useful for EV. On the other hand, EV is useful for house consumption using the likes of IOG and running your entire consumption off 7p for electricity or a quarter of the current tariff. As others say, start with a granny if your consumption is low, then graduate to a dedicated charger. Also 2nd hand EV probably make a lot of sense right now otherwise have a look at the leases from time to time.
OP,
Two years ago my electricity direct debit was £60 per month.
Then, a year ago we started our life with an EV.
Our direct debit is now £80 per month. Electricity is more expensive anyway, but that £80 now includes about 1600 miles per month in the EV.
You can probably do your own maths here, but I don’t think you’ll take too long.
Two years ago my electricity direct debit was £60 per month.
Then, a year ago we started our life with an EV.
Our direct debit is now £80 per month. Electricity is more expensive anyway, but that £80 now includes about 1600 miles per month in the EV.
You can probably do your own maths here, but I don’t think you’ll take too long.
blearyeyedboy said:
Thanks all. My commute is about 20-25 miles round trip most days so not loads.
Any value in installing an outdoor 16A (blue) socket rather than a 3-pin outdoors one? Or am I overthinking this?
i think legally now you can only constantly draw 10A from a 3 pin socket to charge an EVAny value in installing an outdoor 16A (blue) socket rather than a 3-pin outdoors one? Or am I overthinking this?
I would imagine a properly installed 16A socket would allow for 16A to be drawn but I would also imagine as its for an EV the relevant regs and kit would also have to be applied which is half the cost of an EV charger
good chargers can be had for reasonable money
https://www.electricalcounter.co.uk/ohme-ohme-epod...
I would sort out the charger first then get a car, only because getting a granny charger our every time is a PITA
Edited by Dave Hedgehog on Friday 27th February 13:46
I got a charger installed at home.
I don't charge that often at home, say 10kWh/month, as I can charge at work.
Even with so little charging on IOG I'm paying about 15p/kWh every month just by setting my dishwasher and washing machine to run at night.
I wanted the convenience of having a charger available but I could have just used the granny charger that came with the car.
I don't charge that often at home, say 10kWh/month, as I can charge at work.
Even with so little charging on IOG I'm paying about 15p/kWh every month just by setting my dishwasher and washing machine to run at night.
I wanted the convenience of having a charger available but I could have just used the granny charger that came with the car.
Most EV, like most new cars, but especially EV are financed / lease but also crucially salary sacrifice, so a tax efficient lease on potentially expensive cars so they are monthly payments from your paycheck with nothing up front and typically no additional costs.
So long as the install is pretty standard you can get a dedicated charger install for around £1,000 - less if you qualify for one of the grants its less, savings over fuel or public charging that can be recouped in months.
Something like IOG is pretty cheap with 5/6 hours overnight at 7p to charge the car and you can also programme all your appliances etc to take advantage.
No mocking, it can be a minefield!
So long as the install is pretty standard you can get a dedicated charger install for around £1,000 - less if you qualify for one of the grants its less, savings over fuel or public charging that can be recouped in months.
Something like IOG is pretty cheap with 5/6 hours overnight at 7p to charge the car and you can also programme all your appliances etc to take advantage.
No mocking, it can be a minefield!
A granny charger should give you at least 4 miles an hour, and up to 7-8 with very efficient cars. So at least a 50-60 mile top up every night during the week, and full charge over the weekend. Just make sure your socket is decent. Did this with my i3 for 18 months before we had a second EV and a proper charger. It was painless.
It depends on your mileage but there's not always a need for a home charger. You could use a proper 3 pin wall socket and pay for an electrician to check it over.
Everyone is different and for some, like me, I owned my old car outright. So the cost of paying fuel to now paying for a car is about the same. I saved up for a home charger which meant I had to use the 3 pint for a few months.
Everyone is different and for some, like me, I owned my old car outright. So the cost of paying fuel to now paying for a car is about the same. I saved up for a home charger which meant I had to use the 3 pint for a few months.
blearyeyedboy said:
Thanks all. My commute is about 20-25 miles round trip most days so not loads.
Any value in installing an outdoor 16A (blue) socket rather than a 3-pin outdoors one? Or am I overthinking this?
My commute is 22 miles round trip. The worst case on a freezing winter day is that it uses 8kWh. Our 3 pin granny charger charges the car at 2kW so, so worst case is I can charge it back up in 4 hours ready to go again the next day. Any value in installing an outdoor 16A (blue) socket rather than a 3-pin outdoors one? Or am I overthinking this?
Biggest issue with granny charging is that if you do a long trip, you need to either plan your charging a bit to make sure you give it long enough to charge to 100% before the trip, and time after the trip to charge again back to give you enough range for use the next day; or you make a bit of use of rapid chargers and give yourself the extra charge that way.
Our car came with £500 of free rapid charging, so granny charging plus the odd bit of rapid charging when we do have a longer journey is no bother at all. Eventually we’ll get a full speed charger, but not in any great rush to do it.
We actually found that, despite no specific effort to use power at night, our average per-kWh electricity price excluding the car dropped when we swapped to an EV tariff. When the day-time rate is only 2p/kWh more expensive, and the overnight rate is 20p/kWh cheaper, you only have you use 10% of your electricity on the cheap rate to break even.
We ran ours for nearly a year on a standard 3-pin socket before bothering with a dedicated EV charger, but we keep our cars in a garage which makes that easier.
ETA: We bought nearly new with cash, intending to keep the car for 10-15 years (which is our usual approach to family cars). Depreciation can't work out worse than about £150 a month and will probably be around £100.
We ran ours for nearly a year on a standard 3-pin socket before bothering with a dedicated EV charger, but we keep our cars in a garage which makes that easier.
ETA: We bought nearly new with cash, intending to keep the car for 10-15 years (which is our usual approach to family cars). Depreciation can't work out worse than about £150 a month and will probably be around £100.
Edited by kambites on Friday 27th February 17:50
samoht said:
2) Electricity tariff. If you do nothing and charge at normal rate of 25p/kWh, that's still about half the fuel cost of petrol or diesel.
That all depends on the car, our Q4 doing 2.5 miles per kWh works out at 11.5p per mile with 15% charge lossesA petrol car doing 40 mpg is 12p per mile at today's petrol price.
- edit* petrol price was wrong
Edited by TheRainMaker on Friday 27th February 17:52
blearyeyedboy said:
Loads ot questions
Nothing wrong with asking questions.It will all depend on how many miles you do, how efficient your car is and how much electricity you use throughout the day.
We do have battery storage and solar, but before that, our average cost per kWh was 18p using Intelligent Octopus Go.
For the charger, we had to upgrade quite a bit to be compliant with modern regs, which included two new consumer units. I think the total cost for the first charger was around £2100 all in, but our garage is quite a distance from the house.
You 100% do not need Solar or a Battery system to have an EV, and even if you did have solar, you wouldn't charge your car from it anyway.
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