RE: Alpine previews 'ground-breaking' A110 platform
RE: Alpine previews 'ground-breaking' A110 platform
Yesterday

Alpine previews 'ground-breaking' A110 platform

We still can't see the finished car - but what's underneath the new A110 doesn't sound half bad


Alpine, as a brand, has grown a burgeoning reputation for finesse chiefly off the back of one exceptional sports car - which ain’t bad going when you consider that the A110 never really achieved Porsche-worrying sales volumes, and was followed up with two EVs, one of them SUV-shaped. Still, the dealer network has grown to 170 retailers globally since 2018, and last year the firm exceeded 10,000 registrations for the first time in its history. A speck in the ocean, of course, when measured against Porsche’s reported 280k grand total - but moving in the right direction, at least. 

Whether or not the next-generation A110 helps Alpine to immediately attract significantly more buyers remains to be seen; it will launch as a battery-powered model exclusively, and thus far electric sports cars have not been greeted enthusiastically (you may have heard). Nevertheless, the car is well-timed insofar as it will have a direct rival in the shape of Porsche’s own 718-replacing coupe, and while we're yet to see the newcomer, Alpine has already confirmed that it will deliver a Spider and 2+2 variants in coming years, which is vital for further growing the model lineup. 

As you might expect, you need a cutting-edge, flexible architecture to properly underpin a range of differently configured EVs, and in the Alpine Performance Platform, pictured for the first time, it believes it has developed a doozy. To prove its wider point, Renault has already introduced the 5 Turbo 3E (arguably the world’s most exciting EV) on a variant of the same modular foundation, albeit with in-wheel electric motors. The A110 won’t get those, but it will get much the same bonded and riveted aluminium construction, said to have delivered the right mix of stiffness and lightness that the coupe certainly requires. 

Mass, you won’t be surprised to hear, is again a preoccupation - not just its total amount, but where it goes. Alpine claims to have respected the 40:60 front-to-rear balance of a ‘true sports car’ with the positioning of its dual, 800V high-density battery packs, and has developed an all-new 3-in-1, dual-motor e-axle to go at the back. No word on capacity or power yet, though Alpine is claiming ‘exceptional torque and performance with ultrafast control, thanks to its SIC inverter’, not to mention something called the Alpine Dynamic Model, another EV ECU that is said to oversee everything from battery management to the (unspecified) active aerodynamics. 

Also in its box of tricks is Alpine Active Torque Vectoring (not a surprise, given the presence of two e-motors on the rear axle), which adapts the power delivery every 10 milliseconds for the ‘very best dynamic performance’. Aiding and abetting it in ‘lightweight feel’ will be two new aluminium suspension setups, as well as new integrated brake and steering systems. There’s also the prospect of an F1-inspired driving position, i.e. ‘low-slung, with a vertical steering wheel and all the key instruments within easy sight and reach’, which sounds just the ticket, too. 

“Our ambition is to become the leading French sports speciality brand in the world, offering the best driver’s cars of the EV era,” noted Philippe Krief, Alpine CEO. “Just as today the Alpine A110 is the foundation of our brand, showcasing our commitment to deliver high-technology products, we will offer the first true EV sports car to the market. It will be true to Alpine's DNA and outperform the best of today’s combustion sports cars, thanks to the Alpine Performance Platform.” The kicker? Tacked on mention of the firm’s ability to ‘react in real time to market evolutions’ - a window left ajar for petrol power? As Porsche has learned, never say never. 


Author
Discussion

leggerito

Original Poster:

95 posts

12 months

Yesterday (09:43)
quotequote all
Proportions look near perfect. Would love to try the EV but would love to buy the ICE.

RandomCarChat

1,142 posts

70 months

Yesterday (09:55)
quotequote all
Excited to see what this is like, the previous car is one of the best cars i've ever driven.

Chassis certainly looks like a step up from the original car. Good to see they have left plenty of room out back for potential ICE?

Original car was much more tightly packaged at the rear.




Global Nomad

94 posts

104 months

Yesterday (10:06)
quotequote all
about time we got a new format for where the battery pack goes. Raised seating/body with skateboard architecture has become a lazy default. With battery density going up, and weight reducing potentially, we should start seeing more innovation. can clearly see where the structure (compared to previous generation - thanks for pic) allows for removal of roof.

Sway

33,494 posts

217 months

Yesterday (10:08)
quotequote all
Are they not the two worst places to concentrate the mass, outside the wheelbase at either end?

samoht

6,965 posts

169 months

Yesterday (11:02)
quotequote all
Yes, it will come with a petrol engine, not EV-only

Philippe Krief said:
And before you ask, yes, the platform is designed to accommodate an internal combustion engine
https://www.autocar.co.uk/car-news/new-cars/alpine-confirms-a110-get-ice-successor-alongside-incoming-ev

Jon_S_Rally

4,297 posts

111 months

Yesterday (11:17)
quotequote all
The chassis looks good. Glad they haven't put the batteries under the floor to keep a more traditional weight balance and avoid the car being too tall. Looking forward to seeing the final car. Given how good the A110 was, I hope this delivers a genuinely engaging driving experience, as that seems to be a real issue with most EVs. I also hope they don't go too mad with power. There are more than enough billion-horsepower EVs out there. I want to see something that's driver-focused, not statistic focused.

RandomCarChat

1,142 posts

70 months

Yesterday (11:37)
quotequote all
samoht said:
Now that is good news, I wonder what engine they will use. The full hybrid E-Tech 160 maybe with the power turned up?

They have real potential to eat Porsche's lunch if they can get the ICE and EV versions to market before Porsche sort out the 718 replacement debacle.

ducnick

2,125 posts

266 months

Yesterday (11:45)
quotequote all
Renault really are on good form these days. The new Renault 5 and 4’s look great. They have in my option hit a bit of a sweet spot balancing ev powertrain with physical buttons, that no other manufacturer seems to be interested in occupying.
The alpine always looked great and I’m sure this new one will be a cracker too.
I just hope they can keep it up and stick to what makes them better than similar priced cars in each segment. Make them lighter, give them sufficient power but not too much, can’t keep them easy to operate with proper physical tactile controls.

zbc

991 posts

174 months

Yesterday (12:12)
quotequote all
It looks like it could be the basis of a beautiful car. I've been tempted a couple of times but never took the plunge. I can't see even a tentative release date anywhere though, maybe my reading is failing me? Any ideas?

Kawasicki

14,133 posts

258 months

Yesterday (12:27)
quotequote all
Sway said:
Are they not the two worst places to concentrate the mass, outside the wheelbase at either end?
Worst for what? - What’s your target?

Personally I’m thrilled that they are not using under floor batteries. Setting up high in a sports car makes no sense. I must say that the batteries seem to be mounted quite high… so that needs careful vehicle dynamics tuning.

Panamax

8,157 posts

57 months

Yesterday (12:30)
quotequote all
"we will offer the first true EV sports car to the market."

Ooops, somebody forgot about the MG Cyberster which, whether or not you want one, is a whole lot more "sports car" than a 2-door closed coupe.

Sway

33,494 posts

217 months

Yesterday (12:36)
quotequote all
Kawasicki said:
Sway said:
Are they not the two worst places to concentrate the mass, outside the wheelbase at either end?
Worst for what? - What s your target?

Personally I m thrilled that they are not using under floor batteries. Setting up high in a sports car makes no sense. I must say that the batteries seem to be mounted quite high so that needs careful vehicle dynamics tuning.
My understanding was that having the masses extend past the wheelbase (irrespective of height, but worse when they're higher) increases instability and driver predictability (especially when the driver is centrally located in the wheelbase)?

edoverheels

546 posts

128 months

Yesterday (13:25)
quotequote all
Jon_S_Rally said:
The chassis looks good. Glad they haven't put the batteries under the floor to keep a more traditional weight balance and avoid the car being too tall. Looking forward to seeing the final car. Given how good the A110 was, I hope this delivers a genuinely engaging driving experience, as that seems to be a real issue with most EVs. I also hope they don't go too mad with power. There are more than enough billion-horsepower EVs out there. I want to see something that's driver-focused, not statistic focused.
+1

fooman

1,057 posts

87 months

Yesterday (13:35)
quotequote all
Sway said:
My understanding was that having the masses extend past the wheelbase (irrespective of height, but worse when they're higher) increases instability and driver predictability (especially when the driver is centrally located in the wheelbase)?
More true in an ICE vehicle where it's difficult to balance out that weight from a lump of an engine. In an EV the weight placement is more flexible so you can get that magical 40:60 split without having to hoick the engine behind the front axle.

I think this is probably the most exciting EV design in the works from a complete package point of view.

Sway

33,494 posts

217 months

Yesterday (13:38)
quotequote all
fooman said:
Sway said:
My understanding was that having the masses extend past the wheelbase (irrespective of height, but worse when they're higher) increases instability and driver predictability (especially when the driver is centrally located in the wheelbase)?
More true in an ICE vehicle where it's difficult to balance out that weight from a lump of an engine. In an EV the weight placement is more flexible so you can get that magical 40:60 split without having to hoick the engine behind the front axle.

I think this is probably the most exciting EV design in the works from a complete package point of view.
thumbup I'd agree in terms of excitement, although I'll put a tentative nod towards the Caterham concept too.

CountyLines

4,366 posts

26 months

Yesterday (13:41)
quotequote all
Top of that rear battery is at drivers head height. Wouldn't have expected that.

edoverheels

546 posts

128 months

Yesterday (13:50)
quotequote all
Wouldn't there have been a bit more space for battery behind the seat of the driver and low down?
Trying to pack it all into a small footprint.
Really looking forward to it.

jimmytheone

1,883 posts

241 months

Yesterday (14:00)
quotequote all
Sway said:
Kawasicki said:
Sway said:
Are they not the two worst places to concentrate the mass, outside the wheelbase at either end?
Worst for what? - What s your target?

Personally I m thrilled that they are not using under floor batteries. Setting up high in a sports car makes no sense. I must say that the batteries seem to be mounted quite high so that needs careful vehicle dynamics tuning.
My understanding was that having the masses extend past the wheelbase (irrespective of height, but worse when they're higher) increases instability and driver predictability (especially when the driver is centrally located in the wheelbase)?
Porsche seem to have done ok hanging a 6 pot out the back for some time

Sway

33,494 posts

217 months

Yesterday (14:03)
quotequote all
jimmytheone said:
Sway said:
Kawasicki said:
Sway said:
Are they not the two worst places to concentrate the mass, outside the wheelbase at either end?
Worst for what? - What s your target?

Personally I m thrilled that they are not using under floor batteries. Setting up high in a sports car makes no sense. I must say that the batteries seem to be mounted quite high so that needs careful vehicle dynamics tuning.
My understanding was that having the masses extend past the wheelbase (irrespective of height, but worse when they're higher) increases instability and driver predictability (especially when the driver is centrally located in the wheelbase)?
Porsche seem to have done ok hanging a 6 pot out the back for some time
They've spent the entire time doing very clever engineering to ensure it doesn't drive like the engine is hanging out it's arse!

samoht

6,965 posts

169 months

Yesterday (14:41)
quotequote all
Kawasicki said:
Sway said:
Are they not the two worst places to concentrate the mass, outside the wheelbase at either end?
Worst for what? - What s your target?

Personally I m thrilled that they are not using under floor batteries. Setting up high in a sports car makes no sense. I must say that the batteries seem to be mounted quite high so that needs careful vehicle dynamics tuning.
Splitting the battery apart like this will give increased polar moment of inertia, i.e. resistance to turning.

I think I'm with conventional wisdom that lower MoI is better for a sports car, my RX-7 was nice how it rotated (small engine set well back), although I have heard respected people say the opposite. Putting the greater part of the battery over the rear wheels and the lesser part over the front isn't dissimilar to reversing a classic front engined transaxle gearbox layout like a Daytona.


I can't understand how high up the batteries look in these images. It looks like when I've seen an old petrol sports car converted to EV in the aftermarket, not what you'd do with a clean sheet at all. When you look at modern supercars, the dry-sump engine is really low, it's like peering down a well to find.

This image from Lotus shows how to architect an EV sports car

battery weight is low down without making the driver sit on it like they're riding a horse, and just ahead of the driven wheels - perfect. I'm hoping Caterham's Project V will do this, not the Alpine thing...