Why Do So Many Children Have SEN?

[The Mad Monk]

Just listened to a piece on BBC Radio 4 Today programme about the number of children with various mental health problems which prevents them a normal school on a normal timetable.

What is the cause of this?

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c23mdz2728zo

Edited by The Mad Monk on Friday 20th March 08:55

[Tigerj]

I suspect this will get moved to NP&E

There are a few arguments for the increase. Including;

Better recognition of these needs over time.

That a diagnosis removes the benefit cap for the whole family.

That’s with increasing class sizes it forces a more personalised education for a child without going private.

[AndyAudi]

I m sorry to those with genuine troubles but, in my experience

Previously there was a social stigma with getting a label, now there s an incentive for what it brings.

Human nature to want to get what s best for child if that s allowances financial or otherwise to help them get ahead.

ETA - recognition now where undiagnosed before a big part too

[ATG]

Yeah, we used to label LOTS of kids as thick or weird and write them off.

Dyslexia is an obvious and uncontentious example of something that used to go undiagnosed, crippling people's education, that is now recognised and better supported.

Autism, Asperger's, ADHD were also all clearly being widely under diagnosed and many kids with mild symptoms/conditions could struggle on through education anyway. But lots couldn't, and even those who could would clearly have benefitted from better understanding themselves and being better understood.

I would be very surprised if there were actually many more kids with these conditions now than a generation ago.

[dundarach]

Better understanding.

Better teaching.

Everyone's special, including those diagnosing.

Being a parent is really hard.

Dealing with a child with any form of need, without being able to blame something else is even harder.


Money

[Shooter McGavin]

I went to school in the 80s, SEN kids were (unkindly) referred to as thickos or divs.

When I look back there were several at my primary school who were well in need of SEN provision but didn't get it, they were just lobbed in the mainstream with the rest of us.

So, it's increased recognition of these needs, rather than some great societal change.

However there are 10 million more people in the UK than when I was a kid, so there will be an uptick in numbers because of general population growth.

Also, delving into the article a bit deeper, the "numbers" here are the amount of children with an EHCP.

As I understand it getting one of these is the only way you actually get a school to offer any kind of different provision for a SEN child.

Therefore every parent/child affected by SEN usually wants one, so (my understanding, not through personal experience) is that it can be quite tough to get one because ultimately it means the awarding local authority then has to cough up money from its budget to cover the needs in the EHCP.

More info here: https://www.bbc.co.uk/bitesize/articles/zfqmvj6

Notably the Govt has changes in mind beginning from 2029: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cwyke5n1z4po

Edited by Shooter McGavin on Friday 20th March 11:37

[krisdelta]

There are several contributing factors to there being being increasing levels of diagnosis in my view, better understanding of neural differences, having to manage this (mostly) in faily rigid educational settings with 30 ish children in each class.

This means resourcing is the only real lever to meet individual needs, so children achieve "expected level", unless you change the format of schooling to accomodate - which is no small undertaking. So in this structure, the schools also encourage diagnosis to provide resourcing so they can get all children to the expected level.

There may be some edge cases where this impacts benefits for families in need as indicated above, but for the vast majority it's not beyond the realms of logic and reason that parents want their children to succeed in education so they can become independant and have choices in their adult lives.

It makes sense to me that intervention early so children arrive at adulthood educated and equipped for work is going to cost less than supporting them through adult life on benefits

[_Rodders_]

There's definitely been a switch from not wanting a child labelled, to absolutely wanting a diagnosis.

And it's not actually that easy to get a diagnosis.

[Sporky]

I wonder if increasing class sizes has made it harder fir a lot of children with (for example) autism and/or ADHD, who would have coped much better in smaller classes.

[blueg33]

Better understanding, better diagnosis.

Realisation that with that understanding and diagnosis you can improve a childs life opportunities

My personal example is my daughter.

Always was difficult to get to go to school, didn't fit in, was in class very poor at most subjects.

In her sats she was top of the class and got a place at Grammar school - no one knew how that happened

She really struggled with senior school, wouldnt go in, couldn't cope with other students, teachers even afraid to go to the toilet

Age 17 diagnosed with Aspergers syndrome, EHCP obtained and measure put in at school

She started to go in, got 4 x A levels at A* in tough subjects like chemistry and biology,

Offered a place at uni - with support based around her condition - got a 1st and is now prepping her Phd working on developing the use of lizard venoms in medicine and drugs

Without the diagnosis and support she would have been classed as "slow" or "retarded" and would never be in a position to add what she can to society.

[Scabutz]

Sporky said:

I wonder if increasing class sizes has made it harder fir a lot of children with (for example) autism and/or ADHD, who would have coped much better in smaller classes.

This has been my experience with my own, not just the class sizes but the move to these super schools with 2k+ kids in, both mine have suspected autism (waiting on a diag) and struggled and ended up at an online school.

Getting a label is easier than it was, getting help though is incredibly hard.

[arfur]

The Kenilworth Lions are supporting a SEN related Mental Health concert for the Kenilworth school next week https://www.ksn.org.uk/

This is from the school as part of the information pack for the concert :

"Kenilworth Lions President’s Charity for 2025/26

This year, our President Lion Bill Wanley, has chosen to partner with Kenilworth School on The Kenilworth School Mental Health Project.

There are over 400 children on the Special Education Needs (SEN) register at Kenilworth School and 28% of these struggle with mental health issues.

We are collaborating with the Inclusion Team at Kenilworth School who will use our funds to enable the school to work with a range of other organisations focused on wellbeing and mental health issues"

This is a normal secondary school and is in a generally "nice" area where the average age is a lot higher than most of the country (nice place to retire and live).

When I read that over 400 students were affected .. Found that a bit hard to comprehend

Arf

[Sporky]

Scabutz said:

This has been my experience with my own, not just the class sizes but the move to these super schools with 2k+ kids in, both mine have suspected autism (waiting on a diag) and struggled and ended up at an online school.

I was very fortunate to go to small schools. And home was a quiet stable place.

[Sheepshanks]

arfur said:

.
This is a normal secondary school and is in a generally "nice" area where the average age is a lot higher than most of the country (nice place to retire and live).

When I read that over 400 students were affected .. Found that a bit hard to comprehend

I wonder if the average age of the parents is higher - maybe having children later is a possible factor?

[Sporky]

Sheepshanks said:

I wonder if the average age of the parents is higher - maybe having children later is a possible factor?

I think I read that an older father does increase the likelihood of an autistic child.

[Jamescrs]

I think it's definitely a case of better recognition, when I was at school in the mid 80's to mid 90's the recognition was poor and unless you were particularly difficult or showing extreme signs there was no recognition or assistance, I know certainly in my high school those who were recognised were all boys because it is now found that girls are much better at masking things like Autism in public settings.

My eldest daughter is going on 14 and is diagnosed Autistic but she is extremely intelligent and performs well at school and tries not to be noticed so doesn't get the support she needs but at home when she is in her safe space it's a different story.

The about it is that now I know much more about the diagnosis and the signs which have led to her being diagnosed, in all probability I would also be diagnosed as Autistic but at 45 and well established in my own career and life there seems little point for me to bother now.

[ATG]

Sporky said:

Sheepshanks said:

I wonder if the average age of the parents is higher - maybe having children later is a possible factor?

I think I read that an older father does increase the likelihood of an autistic child.

It would stick out like a sore thumb if it were a statistically significant material risk, so I'm guessing the correlation doesn't exist, because someone would be shouting about it if it were.

[98elise]

ATG said:

Yeah, we used to label LOTS of kids as thick or weird and write them off.

Dyslexia is an obvious and uncontentious example of something that used to go undiagnosed, crippling people's education, that is now recognised and better supported.

Autism, Asperger's, ADHD were also all clearly being widely under diagnosed and many kids with mild symptoms/conditions could struggle on through education anyway. But lots couldn't, and even those who could would clearly have benefitted from better understanding themselves and being better understood.

I would be very surprised if there were actually many more kids with these conditions now than a generation ago.

This. Kids were just labelled something else. Thick, weird, slow, disruptive, etc. We now understand the situation better.

Its not that different to thinking we had no cases of say cancer until we discovered cancer.

[ATG]

Sporky said:

Scabutz said:

This has been my experience with my own, not just the class sizes but the move to these super schools with 2k+ kids in, both mine have suspected autism (waiting on a diag) and struggled and ended up at an online school.

I was very fortunate to go to small schools. And home was a quiet stable place.

My kid goes to a state primary school with a total of 50 pupils. Unsurprisingly quite a few kids have moved to the school from larger ones because our school is able to provide more individual support. Small school, small class sizes means more individual attention and, funnily enough, better education. If anyone wonders why private schools produce better outcomes than state education, look at the size of the classes. When you spend roughly 4 times as much per pupil to educate them, you can afford very much smaller class sizes and much more individual attention.

[Sheepshanks]

ATG said:

Sporky said:

Sheepshanks said:

I wonder if the average age of the parents is higher - maybe having children later is a possible factor?

I think I read that an older father does increase the likelihood of an autistic child.

It would stick out like a sore thumb if it were a statistically significant material risk, so I'm guessing the correlation doesn't exist, because someone would be shouting about it if it were.

I'm not going to read a load of research papers but a quick scan does suggest it's true, and that it also impacts grandchildren.