D-Day commemoration overlooks sacrifice in other theatres?
Discussion
Every year we see a diminishing number of veterans returning to Arromanches to remember those who didn't come back. Its close proximity makes it relatively easy for the veterans and press to get there.
Do we however, remember D-Day to the detriment of sacrifice in other theatres and operations?
'SAS Rogue Heroes' bought aspects of earlier operations into the public eye, but how many could could even name where Operations Torch, Husky and Dragoon occurred?
Who in this country knows anything the war outside of Europe?
Do we however, remember D-Day to the detriment of sacrifice in other theatres and operations?
'SAS Rogue Heroes' bought aspects of earlier operations into the public eye, but how many could could even name where Operations Torch, Husky and Dragoon occurred?
Who in this country knows anything the war outside of Europe?
I don’t think so: D-Day was the largest amphibious assault in history and led directly to the liberation of France.
It was a huge achievement (especially in the context of it’s only recent antecedent Gallipoli) and led to a two front war for Germany: from that point on not only could not win (the eastern front was a log jam which German manpower and materiel couldn’t supply) but it accelerated.
With all due respect to those posting around peripheral conflicts (North Africa etc), D-Day was the real deal and the reich was doomed after its success.
It was a huge achievement (especially in the context of it’s only recent antecedent Gallipoli) and led to a two front war for Germany: from that point on not only could not win (the eastern front was a log jam which German manpower and materiel couldn’t supply) but it accelerated.
With all due respect to those posting around peripheral conflicts (North Africa etc), D-Day was the real deal and the reich was doomed after its success.
GliderRider said:
Every year we see a diminishing number of veterans returning to Arromanches to remember those who didn't come back. Its close proximity makes it relatively easy for the veterans and press to get there.
Do we however, remember D-Day to the detriment of sacrifice in other theatres and operations?
'SAS Rogue Heroes' bought aspects of earlier operations into the public eye, but how many could could even name where Operations Torch, Husky and Dragoon occurred?
Who in this country knows anything the war outside of Europe?
You could say the same about almost any events in history. Napoleonic wars are only remembered through Waterloo or the Battle of Trafalgar.Do we however, remember D-Day to the detriment of sacrifice in other theatres and operations?
'SAS Rogue Heroes' bought aspects of earlier operations into the public eye, but how many could could even name where Operations Torch, Husky and Dragoon occurred?
Who in this country knows anything the war outside of Europe?
World War one mainly seems to concentrate the Somme.
Ridgemont said:
I don t think so: D-Day was the largest amphibious assault in history and led directly to the liberation of France.
It was a huge achievement (especially in the context of it s only recent antecedent Gallipoli) and led to a two front war for Germany: from that point on not only could not win (the eastern front was a log jam which German manpower and materiel couldn t supply) but it accelerated.
With all due respect to those posting around peripheral conflicts (North Africa etc), D-Day was the real deal and the reich was doomed after its success.
Pretty much my view.It was a huge achievement (especially in the context of it s only recent antecedent Gallipoli) and led to a two front war for Germany: from that point on not only could not win (the eastern front was a log jam which German manpower and materiel couldn t supply) but it accelerated.
With all due respect to those posting around peripheral conflicts (North Africa etc), D-Day was the real deal and the reich was doomed after its success.
D-Day was a phenomenal military operation, on a scale and complexity never seen before or since.
It was effectively what the entire war had been building up to for the Allies since they were pushed out of the continent in the spring of 1940. All the political wrangling, the military grand strategy, the industrial effort, the boffins, the mass mobilisation and so on, was securing the situation, arranging forces and gaining expertise to launch D-Day. It leant on virtually every bit of knowledge gained in every theatre, every environment and every sort of combat up to that point.
Yes, the Axis was already fatally wounded and bleeding out by the middle of 1944. In a Churchillian sense, D-Day wasn't the end of the beginning. But it was the beginning of the end.
Memories fade and histories compress with time. Most campaigns get completely forgotten other than as regimental mess dinners on Army bases. I think D-Day gets pretty much the commemoration and prominence it deserves.
100SRV said:
I didn't realise until the other week that Rome was liberated on 5/6/1944 so agree, it does tend to overshadow other events of note.
VJ day doesn't get the attention that VE day does either.
It was actually poetic justice that the liberation of Rome was overshadowed by D-Day as the American army commander involved prioritised glory hunting over encircling and destroying the German 10th army. VJ day doesn't get the attention that VE day does either.
Ridgemont said:
I don t think so: D-Day was the largest amphibious assault in history and led directly to the liberation of France.
It was a huge achievement (especially in the context of it s only recent antecedent Gallipoli) and led to a two front war for Germany: from that point on not only could not win (the eastern front was a log jam which German manpower and materiel couldn t supply) but it accelerated.
With all due respect to those posting around peripheral conflicts (North Africa etc), D-Day was the real deal and the reich was doomed after its success.
I would question how peripheral the North African campaign was given the strategic importance and being a prerequisite for everything that came afterward, but you are correct that D-Day represented victory and hence that is why it is remembered most.It was a huge achievement (especially in the context of it s only recent antecedent Gallipoli) and led to a two front war for Germany: from that point on not only could not win (the eastern front was a log jam which German manpower and materiel couldn t supply) but it accelerated.
With all due respect to those posting around peripheral conflicts (North Africa etc), D-Day was the real deal and the reich was doomed after its success.
A true peripheral campaign imo would be Burma. The only strategic priority in the region was to secure India. Everything else was mainly trying to futilely restore Imperial prestige after the fall of Singapore.
I think the theatre that is most ignored in comparison to its importance is the Eastern Front.
80% of German combat casualties were on the Eastern front and their Axis allies lost hundreds of thousands on top of that. Many of the battles were on an a massive scale and often barely known in the West.
80% of German combat casualties were on the Eastern front and their Axis allies lost hundreds of thousands on top of that. Many of the battles were on an a massive scale and often barely known in the West.
gt40steve said:
We shouldn't move towards celebrating D-Day less.
We need to remember the other campaigns more.
Completely agree, we have many relatively young ex members of the armed services who struggle every day with the effects of what they experienced while serving and they also need to be remembered. We need to remember the other campaigns more.
gruffalo said:
gt40steve said:
We shouldn't move towards celebrating D-Day less.
We need to remember the other campaigns more.
Completely agree, we have many relatively young ex members of the armed services who struggle every day with the effects of what they experienced while serving and they also need to be remembered. We need to remember the other campaigns more.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Armed_Forces_Day_(Un...
TGCOTF-dewey said:
We do, end of this month, it's called Armed Forces day.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Armed_Forces_Day_(Un...
And we have Pride Month. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Armed_Forces_Day_(Un...
Seems like a twisted set of priorities
TGCOTF-dewey said:
We do, end of this month, it's called Armed Forces day.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Armed_Forces_Day_(Un...
"It is a chance to show your support for the men and women who make up the Armed Forces community" https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Armed_Forces_Day_(Un...
By getting them pinged for a weekend duty.
dai1983 said:
TGCOTF-dewey said:
We do, end of this month, it's called Armed Forces day.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Armed_Forces_Day_(Un...
"It is a chance to show your support for the men and women who make up the Armed Forces community" https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Armed_Forces_Day_(Un...
By getting them pinged for a weekend duty.
I think D Day was so symbolic of the tide turning and the defeat of the axis becoming inevitable, therefore it is commemorated more.
I also think with the other things mentioned Operation Torch for instance, whilst important in the grand scheme of things less symbolic. What separates it from Operation Slapstick or Anvil for instance.
Maybe the horrid nature of the Far East means that it was harder to commemorate, my old neighbour sadly no longer with us had been a prisoner of the Japanese and would never talk about it, i think the western front was an order of magnitude less horrible. I remember he went on an Antarctic cruise and it was ruined for him as there was a lot of Japanese people on board.
I also think with the other things mentioned Operation Torch for instance, whilst important in the grand scheme of things less symbolic. What separates it from Operation Slapstick or Anvil for instance.
Maybe the horrid nature of the Far East means that it was harder to commemorate, my old neighbour sadly no longer with us had been a prisoner of the Japanese and would never talk about it, i think the western front was an order of magnitude less horrible. I remember he went on an Antarctic cruise and it was ruined for him as there was a lot of Japanese people on board.
GliderRider said:
Who in this country knows anything the war outside of Europe?
Most definitely it's an age thing, modern history or really any history isn't taught in schools anymore The young have an appalling knowledge of history generally
For me my father was in the RAF at the end of the war, I had two uncles in the Navy and one in the army who went to Korea as a national serviceman
My grandfather was in the Accrington Pals and lost his leg on the first day of the battle to the Somme
For me it's living history as I knew all the above although they are all gone now
For my son I have ensured he knows his family history and he has a keen interest in it
We have visited war graves, battlefields and attended the last post ceremony at Ypres as examples
When I die the living history in our family almost dies with me as my son did know his grandad
We really aren't teaching our youth enough about their history imo
Oh and apparently the brits helped the Americans win the war, a bit, and might have had a couple of soldiers at D-Day
Edited by Earthdweller on Sunday 7th June 11:23
BikeBikeBIke said:
I don't really accept the premise that all the other areas get neglected. There are endless books, films, documentaries and YouTube vids on every aspect of the war. It all gets massive exposure.
(I speak as the Grandson of someone who was 1st Army - Africa, Italy rather than DDay.)
My dad was 1st army -firstly Tunisia then one of the D day dodgers fighting through the 'meat grinder' of the Italian campaign(I speak as the Grandson of someone who was 1st Army - Africa, Italy rather than DDay.)
Operation Husky, the invasion of Sicily was on the same scale as d day, but largely forgotten now. My father took part and was wounded during the fighting. https://www.iwm.org.uk/history/second-world-war/it...
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