6 weeks between remap and engine failure: coincidence?
Discussion
I had my G21 320d remapped (stage 1) at 70k miles. Apart from a NOx sensor going, it ran well, had no problems and had been serviced regularly.
However about 6 weeks after the remap the engine went on me. I got low oil pressure warnings and the engine rapidly deteriorated within minutes. A garage has confirmed the bottom end has gone and it needs a new engine, which is proving horribly expensive, even with a used engine.
What are the chances this failure was a direct result of the remap? Just looking for opinions really and any advice, although I suspect it doesn't matter either way if it was the remap or not as I've still got to replace the engine.
However about 6 weeks after the remap the engine went on me. I got low oil pressure warnings and the engine rapidly deteriorated within minutes. A garage has confirmed the bottom end has gone and it needs a new engine, which is proving horribly expensive, even with a used engine.
What are the chances this failure was a direct result of the remap? Just looking for opinions really and any advice, although I suspect it doesn't matter either way if it was the remap or not as I've still got to replace the engine.
ky situation to be in but I doubt you've got any recompenseNo it wasn't low on oil and the garage that has the car said the engine looked really clean and well looked after. It's not been taken apart or even removed so I'm not sure what caused the loss of oil pressure or what damage has been done. Currently debating whether to pay to get it opened up to see if it can be reconditioned, or to just buy a used engine.
I guess one question I have is whether I should get the map removed when the engine is replaced. Don't fancy destroying another one.
I guess one question I have is whether I should get the map removed when the engine is replaced. Don't fancy destroying another one.
mikey_p said:
No it wasn't low on oil and the garage that has the car said the engine looked really clean and well looked after. It's not been taken apart or even removed so I'm not sure what caused the loss of oil pressure or what damage has been done. Currently debating whether to pay to get it opened up to see if it can be reconditioned, or to just buy a used engine.
I guess one question I have is whether I should get the map removed when the engine is replaced. Don't fancy destroying another one.
Yes, Id get the remap removed tbh.I guess one question I have is whether I should get the map removed when the engine is replaced. Don't fancy destroying another one.
Was it a reputable remap company or one of these laptop characters doing cheapies?
Dog Biscuit said:
mikey_p said:
No it wasn't low on oil and the garage that has the car said the engine looked really clean and well looked after. It's not been taken apart or even removed so I'm not sure what caused the loss of oil pressure or what damage has been done. Currently debating whether to pay to get it opened up to see if it can be reconditioned, or to just buy a used engine.
I guess one question I have is whether I should get the map removed when the engine is replaced. Don't fancy destroying another one.
Yes, Id get the remap removed tbh.I guess one question I have is whether I should get the map removed when the engine is replaced. Don't fancy destroying another one.
Was it a reputable remap company or one of these laptop characters doing cheapies?
A lot of remaps work by just injecting more fuel from the injectors, problem is if the remap didn't include testing the injectors(leak down test) then most likely was injecting too much fuel and leaking into cylinder. On older cars always best to check injector rates are in specification before a remap.
bigdom said:
It's suffered oil starvation, not sure how a stage 1 map would cause that as its really in safe parameters.
I've had tuned cars since the 90's starting with Sierra Cosworths, personally I've never had any issues. Have you had the car from new?
No. I've had it just over 2 years. Bought it at about 60k miles, so done about 10k miles over the last 2 years.I've had tuned cars since the 90's starting with Sierra Cosworths, personally I've never had any issues. Have you had the car from new?
I know short journeys aren't great, especially for diesel engines, and it does get used quite regularly for school runs that are only a few minutes long (we bike if there's time). But then it does get used for longer drives too (including the 3.5 hour journey in which it broke down on the return leg).
These latest engines are strong, mines perfect at 154k now. Doubt stage 1 would do it, what is it +10-20% bhp/torque, what I wouldn't like is multiple dyno runs on a diesel. Maybe unrelated oil starvation issue or Dyno/thrashing has destroyed a bearing, v rare, v unlucky.....has it had 20k servicing with all the small miles?
mikey_p said:
No. I've had it just over 2 years. Bought it at about 60k miles, so done about 10k miles over the last 2 years.
I know short journeys aren't great, especially for diesel engines, and it does get used quite regularly for school runs that are only a few minutes long (we bike if there's time). But then it does get used for longer drives too (including the 3.5 hour journey in which it broke down on the return leg).
Those short journeys don't do it much good at all. When you say regular oil changes, once a year or to the longline schedule. Dirty oil has always killed engines, and this looks like correlation rather than causation. Its a mute point now, but <12k pa, its really a job for petrol, even then, those short journeys will wreck the oil.I know short journeys aren't great, especially for diesel engines, and it does get used quite regularly for school runs that are only a few minutes long (we bike if there's time). But then it does get used for longer drives too (including the 3.5 hour journey in which it broke down on the return leg).
Edited by bigdom on Sunday 7th June 23:37
bigdom said:
mikey_p said:
No. I've had it just over 2 years. Bought it at about 60k miles, so done about 10k miles over the last 2 years.
I know short journeys aren't great, especially for diesel engines, and it does get used quite regularly for school runs that are only a few minutes long (we bike if there's time). But then it does get used for longer drives too (including the 3.5 hour journey in which it broke down on the return leg).
Those short journeys don't do it much good at all. When you say regular oil changes, once a year or to the longline schedule. Dirty oil has always killed engines, and this looks like correlation rather than causation. Its a mute point now, but <12k pa, its really a job for petrol, even then, those short journeys will wreck the oil.I know short journeys aren't great, especially for diesel engines, and it does get used quite regularly for school runs that are only a few minutes long (we bike if there's time). But then it does get used for longer drives too (including the 3.5 hour journey in which it broke down on the return leg).
Edited by bigdom on Sunday 7th June 23:37
cliffords said:
Have you spoken to the people who did the remapping about the outcome?
I did speak to them about it, as I briefly considered recovering the car to them to inspect it for repair. I didn't suggest the remap could have caused the engine failure but mentioned the timeline (so it was kind of inferred). They just said they could look at it and then provide a quote for repair or replacement. I had a loss of trust though, so decided not to send the car there. Others will have their own in-built schedule but ever since I got my first diseasel and saw the oil after a year I always do 6k changes & run an oil-change of oil through the engine prior to refilling.
Even good quality oil is cheap enough to throw away for a bit more confidence when bought in quantity rather than just enough for the job.
ETA.
What was said above about diesel injection rates raises a valid point, might be worth checking oil for diesel contamination, as that would cause your issue.
Even good quality oil is cheap enough to throw away for a bit more confidence when bought in quantity rather than just enough for the job.
ETA.
What was said above about diesel injection rates raises a valid point, might be worth checking oil for diesel contamination, as that would cause your issue.
Luck of the draw unfortunately.
Always a risk with a remap - if its not done well, it can have dire consequences.
Whenever I've had remaps done, I've always had it in my head that it may go bang - doesn't help in your situation unfortunately.
Modern diesel maps are getting more complicated - I had my N47 done years ago, however with my more recent N57, there were all kinds of obscure tables - I had recently software updated the car so presumably there were additional parameters the tuner was not expecting.
In my case I was lucky and the company I used were prepared to take their time with it.
If a remap is done properly then all it can really do is highlight an existing issue - yes there will be more strain on the engine, but if its done within safe tolerances then I wouldn't have thought it would have caused an issue unless it was a below par tune.
There are so many variables these days with parts on engines - back in the day if you had a BAM engine for example you would expect the same set of parts on every engine. I've seen N57s with a plethora of different EGRs, intakes.etc - all of which can affect the tune.
In your case, only an engine tear down will give an indication as to what happened, I know on the previous N47 engines it was not unheard of for the timing chain guides to break up and restrict the oil pickup resulting in low oil pressure.
Always a risk with a remap - if its not done well, it can have dire consequences.
Whenever I've had remaps done, I've always had it in my head that it may go bang - doesn't help in your situation unfortunately.
Modern diesel maps are getting more complicated - I had my N47 done years ago, however with my more recent N57, there were all kinds of obscure tables - I had recently software updated the car so presumably there were additional parameters the tuner was not expecting.
In my case I was lucky and the company I used were prepared to take their time with it.
If a remap is done properly then all it can really do is highlight an existing issue - yes there will be more strain on the engine, but if its done within safe tolerances then I wouldn't have thought it would have caused an issue unless it was a below par tune.
There are so many variables these days with parts on engines - back in the day if you had a BAM engine for example you would expect the same set of parts on every engine. I've seen N57s with a plethora of different EGRs, intakes.etc - all of which can affect the tune.
In your case, only an engine tear down will give an indication as to what happened, I know on the previous N47 engines it was not unheard of for the timing chain guides to break up and restrict the oil pickup resulting in low oil pressure.
mikey_p said:
In line with the schedule, so probably not enough. I've never been the hottest at car maintenance (that might change now)
With short journeys <15 minutes the car never gets near operating temperature, it causes fuel dilution in your oil. This can exacerbate wear and tear.I've recently had a similar dilema, as I'm buying a diesel to add to the household. The model in question pretty much doesn't come in petrol. I've skipped the twin turbo version, and stuck with the single turbo one, as the short journeys are about 12 miles each way. This appears to be the safer option.
Since the 90's, i've changed oil as follows, a mate owns a performance car business as he was always banging on about regular changes.
Fast Car: 5k or 12 months
Fast Bike: 3k or 12 months
Commuter Car: Every 10k
Commuter Bike: Every 5k
As others have mentioned, oil is cheap, but often overlooked, but we had these adverts in the 80's - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ua_IImR6ajA
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