Who looks after an infirm patient?
Discussion
My elderly stepmother is unwell. The medics think it is her heart, but they ve just found a urinary infection which may be to blame.
A month ago, she could walk a mile with shopping. In the last week she has become unable to walk, dress or feed herself.
Yesterday, some sort of acute response carer visited, did little and said, I will come for five days, after that you have to pay for a carer .
It appears that she should be in a hospital, but the NHS is trying to keep her at home, despite her being unable to look after herself.
This seems odd to me. Long-term care for chronic health issues I can understand, perhaps. But this appears to be an acute condition and I would have thought the NHS should be dealing with it. But I must confess to knowing little about these things.
Anyone know about this?
A month ago, she could walk a mile with shopping. In the last week she has become unable to walk, dress or feed herself.
Yesterday, some sort of acute response carer visited, did little and said, I will come for five days, after that you have to pay for a carer .
It appears that she should be in a hospital, but the NHS is trying to keep her at home, despite her being unable to look after herself.
This seems odd to me. Long-term care for chronic health issues I can understand, perhaps. But this appears to be an acute condition and I would have thought the NHS should be dealing with it. But I must confess to knowing little about these things.
Anyone know about this?
I have a friend, 90 years old, been a full time carer for his bedridden wife for 3 years.
They get 3 5 minute carer appointments daily, that is it.
Recently he was diagnosed with diabetes, 2 months after that a doctor came out, his legs were swollen. Weeping sores, did absolutely f
k all.
Been in and out of hospital all week, may have heart issues too but the GP that visited did fk all.
Complaint going in, another consultant and the hospital appears to be backing the complaint, this Gzp should not be practicing, but I ain't holding my breath when push comes to shove.
Country is fked tbh.
They get 3 5 minute carer appointments daily, that is it.
Recently he was diagnosed with diabetes, 2 months after that a doctor came out, his legs were swollen. Weeping sores, did absolutely f
k all. Been in and out of hospital all week, may have heart issues too but the GP that visited did f
k all. Complaint going in, another consultant and the hospital appears to be backing the complaint, this Gzp should not be practicing, but I ain't holding my breath when push comes to shove.
Country is f
ked tbh. Furbo said:
Ongoing suggests long-term. Which I might expect not to be paid for, if she has savings. But an acute condition that they are supposed to be resolving?
And you may well be correct. Good luck with getting the argument resolved in the timeframe required - which is the issue at hand.
If she's in A&E she's there problem to solve. At home she has to solve the problem on her own.
You could escalate to the manager of the carer who came round as they will be following a procedure of sorts
It's an absolute nightmare and tbh the path of least resistance will be to pay yourself then you've got some control.
The NHS, local authority, doctor, hospice all have roles to play but you won't know what services could be provided and who can coordinate until it is too late.
When my dad came out of hospital he had a week of visits from the Reablement Service (part of Adult Services) who were like district nurses.
We were then supposed to organise a carer to take over but this would be an impossible task for us considering our lack of experience and knowledge in such matters and the complete lack of available carers,
Adult Services stated that they would organise a carer... If we agree to enter into a contract with your care provider, you will be charged a one-off fee of £296 and then £6 per week thereafter to cover our administration costs.
This was stated as if we would never agree to paying these charges but considering a carer was going to cost around £1K per month or even £1K a week I immediately took them up on the offer.
Not surprisingly Adult Services with all their resources could not find or arrange a carer and so the Reablement Service continued.
During this time he was assessed for carer charges according to his income and these were reasonable.
As my dad deteriorated further a live in carer was arranged who would travel down from Manchester to his location at Southampton but they cancelled and he died later that day.
When my dad came out of hospital he had a week of visits from the Reablement Service (part of Adult Services) who were like district nurses.
We were then supposed to organise a carer to take over but this would be an impossible task for us considering our lack of experience and knowledge in such matters and the complete lack of available carers,
Adult Services stated that they would organise a carer... If we agree to enter into a contract with your care provider, you will be charged a one-off fee of £296 and then £6 per week thereafter to cover our administration costs.
This was stated as if we would never agree to paying these charges but considering a carer was going to cost around £1K per month or even £1K a week I immediately took them up on the offer.
Not surprisingly Adult Services with all their resources could not find or arrange a carer and so the Reablement Service continued.
During this time he was assessed for carer charges according to his income and these were reasonable.
As my dad deteriorated further a live in carer was arranged who would travel down from Manchester to his location at Southampton but they cancelled and he died later that day.
We’re currently going through something similar with my 91 year old aunt. She was diagnosed with dementia about 18 months ago and, despite having cataracts removed from both eyes, she is now registered as being blind. The local NHS and council have been doing everything they can to try and ensure that she stays at home. This is obviously not working as she has had several falls in the last month, culminating in a severe fall while getting into bed and suffering a broken leg.
My cousins (her daughters) are doing everything they possibly can to get the NHS/council to find a place in a nursing/care home for her, but because she does not own her own house, there is nothing happening. If she did own a property, there are a number of places within a 5 mile radius, that could take her quite quickly, but as it stands, we’re screwed! While in hospital, she has contracted an infection and I know how these can impact on the elderly as her sister (my late mother) had a number of UTI’s in the months leading up to her death.
You have my sympathy OP. It is a crap situation to be in. It seems incredibly unfair that you can pay taxes all of your working life and yet, when you need health/social care the most, you are largely on your own.
It is obvious that the current social care system is in crisis and is not fit for purpose. However, the amount of money needed to fix it makes me wonder if it will ever happen.
My cousins (her daughters) are doing everything they possibly can to get the NHS/council to find a place in a nursing/care home for her, but because she does not own her own house, there is nothing happening. If she did own a property, there are a number of places within a 5 mile radius, that could take her quite quickly, but as it stands, we’re screwed! While in hospital, she has contracted an infection and I know how these can impact on the elderly as her sister (my late mother) had a number of UTI’s in the months leading up to her death.
You have my sympathy OP. It is a crap situation to be in. It seems incredibly unfair that you can pay taxes all of your working life and yet, when you need health/social care the most, you are largely on your own.
It is obvious that the current social care system is in crisis and is not fit for purpose. However, the amount of money needed to fix it makes me wonder if it will ever happen.
Mr.Chips said:
We re currently going through something similar with my 91 year old aunt. She was diagnosed with dementia about 18 months ago and, despite having cataracts removed from both eyes, she is now registered as being blind. The local NHS and council have been doing everything they can to try and ensure that she stays at home. This is obviously not working as she has had several falls in the last month, culminating in a severe fall while getting into bed and suffering a broken leg.
My cousins (her daughters) are doing everything they possibly can to get the NHS/council to find a place in a nursing/care home for her, but because she does not own her own house, there is nothing happening. If she did own a property, there are a number of places within a 5 mile radius, that could take her quite quickly, but as it stands, we re screwed! While in hospital, she has contracted an infection and I know how these can impact on the elderly as her sister (my late mother) had a number of UTI s in the months leading up to her death.
You have my sympathy OP. It is a crap situation to be in. It seems incredibly unfair that you can pay taxes all of your working life and yet, when you need health/social care the most, you are largely on your own.
It is obvious that the current social care system is in crisis and is not fit for purpose. However, the amount of money needed to fix it makes me wonder if it will ever happen.
https://www.nhs.uk/social-care-and-support/money-work-and-benefits/nhs-continuing-healthcare/My cousins (her daughters) are doing everything they possibly can to get the NHS/council to find a place in a nursing/care home for her, but because she does not own her own house, there is nothing happening. If she did own a property, there are a number of places within a 5 mile radius, that could take her quite quickly, but as it stands, we re screwed! While in hospital, she has contracted an infection and I know how these can impact on the elderly as her sister (my late mother) had a number of UTI s in the months leading up to her death.
You have my sympathy OP. It is a crap situation to be in. It seems incredibly unfair that you can pay taxes all of your working life and yet, when you need health/social care the most, you are largely on your own.
It is obvious that the current social care system is in crisis and is not fit for purpose. However, the amount of money needed to fix it makes me wonder if it will ever happen.
Well, the problem has gone away it seems.
The old dear has had a heart valve issue for some time. She became very ill at home, but the ambulances she called kept refusing to take her into hospital because "it's your heart dear, and you are on the list".
It turns out she also had a UTI, which wasn't detected, that infected her liver and legs and one arm. Don't ask me how that works, I don't know. A bit like sepsis perhaps? Anyway, whatever it is has now affected her heart too.
I spoke to a doctor this morning, who said that the original heart issue knocked her sideways and made her susceptible to the UTI, which has worked its way through her vital organs.
She is now on EoLC and won't be leaving hospital, they estimate that she has 24-48 hours left. A month or two ago she could still walk a mile with shopping.
So the answer to my question appears to be: The NHS, but only once it is too late.
The old dear has had a heart valve issue for some time. She became very ill at home, but the ambulances she called kept refusing to take her into hospital because "it's your heart dear, and you are on the list".
It turns out she also had a UTI, which wasn't detected, that infected her liver and legs and one arm. Don't ask me how that works, I don't know. A bit like sepsis perhaps? Anyway, whatever it is has now affected her heart too.
I spoke to a doctor this morning, who said that the original heart issue knocked her sideways and made her susceptible to the UTI, which has worked its way through her vital organs.
She is now on EoLC and won't be leaving hospital, they estimate that she has 24-48 hours left. A month or two ago she could still walk a mile with shopping.
So the answer to my question appears to be: The NHS, but only once it is too late.
Furbo said:
Well, the problem has gone away it seems.
The old dear has had a heart valve issue for some time. She became very ill at home, but the ambulances she called kept refusing to take her into hospital because "it's your heart dear, and you are on the list".
It turns out she also had a UTI, which wasn't detected, that infected her liver and legs and one arm. Don't ask me how that works, I don't know. A bit like sepsis perhaps? Anyway, whatever it is has now affected her heart too.
I spoke to a doctor this morning, who said that the original heart issue knocked her sideways and made her susceptible to the UTI, which has worked its way through her vital organs.
She is now on EoLC and won't be leaving hospital, they estimate that she has 24-48 hours left. A month or two ago she could still walk a mile with shopping.
So the answer to my question appears to be: The NHS, but only once it is too late.
Sorry to hear that, but its not unusual sadly.The old dear has had a heart valve issue for some time. She became very ill at home, but the ambulances she called kept refusing to take her into hospital because "it's your heart dear, and you are on the list".
It turns out she also had a UTI, which wasn't detected, that infected her liver and legs and one arm. Don't ask me how that works, I don't know. A bit like sepsis perhaps? Anyway, whatever it is has now affected her heart too.
I spoke to a doctor this morning, who said that the original heart issue knocked her sideways and made her susceptible to the UTI, which has worked its way through her vital organs.
She is now on EoLC and won't be leaving hospital, they estimate that she has 24-48 hours left. A month or two ago she could still walk a mile with shopping.
So the answer to my question appears to be: The NHS, but only once it is too late.
Furbo said:
Well, the problem has gone away it seems.
The old dear has had a heart valve issue for some time. She became very ill at home, but the ambulances she called kept refusing to take her into hospital because "it's your heart dear, and you are on the list".
It turns out she also had a UTI, which wasn't detected, that infected her liver and legs and one arm. Don't ask me how that works, I don't know. A bit like sepsis perhaps? Anyway, whatever it is has now affected her heart too.
I spoke to a doctor this morning, who said that the original heart issue knocked her sideways and made her susceptible to the UTI, which has worked its way through her vital organs.
She is now on EoLC and won't be leaving hospital, they estimate that she has 24-48 hours left. A month or two ago she could still walk a mile with shopping.
So the answer to my question appears to be: The NHS, but only once it is too late.
Wow, that's awful, sorry to read all that. Hope she gets decent EoLC for her remaining time.The old dear has had a heart valve issue for some time. She became very ill at home, but the ambulances she called kept refusing to take her into hospital because "it's your heart dear, and you are on the list".
It turns out she also had a UTI, which wasn't detected, that infected her liver and legs and one arm. Don't ask me how that works, I don't know. A bit like sepsis perhaps? Anyway, whatever it is has now affected her heart too.
I spoke to a doctor this morning, who said that the original heart issue knocked her sideways and made her susceptible to the UTI, which has worked its way through her vital organs.
She is now on EoLC and won't be leaving hospital, they estimate that she has 24-48 hours left. A month or two ago she could still walk a mile with shopping.
So the answer to my question appears to be: The NHS, but only once it is too late.
My initial thought was dehydration, but a worthy lesson for others reading this thread. My father in law is reasonably well for a 90 yr old. Frail, bladder/bowel issues, but ok.
Then he suddenly went very confused, couldn't tell the difference between a dinner plate and a phone. Thought his car had too many pedals. Put ice cream in the oven. Then he went almost completely unresponsive and was sleeping non-stop.
Turns out it was all dehydration. Ambulance arrived, gave him a saline drip and a lot of water with electrolytes and within 3 hours he was markedly better. The following morning he was 100% his (new) normal self. But they advised that he would likely not have lasted 24hrs without that input!
During warm weather, it is literally a killer.
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