A110 Vs 997 C2S or other alternatives
Discussion
Having a look at potential second cars, always fancied a 911 and so I've been looking at top end 996s. That lead me to 997s... And man maths occuring that I could stretch to an A110. This is obviously a pretty different car, but wondering if anyone has experience of both.
I'm looking for something that feels special that I could keep for a while, just using for fun duties and no commuting or anything long distance other than the odd weekend.
The engine and gearbox in the A110 put me off a bit. But then the heaviness of the 911 is a downside too - but charismatic engine and manual box is very appealing.
Anyone have/had both and can comment on how special they feel longer term? Also not necessarily always on great roads, as round me there aren't many. For context I had a FK8 type R which lost it's specialness as just felt like a civic 90% of my driving around town. But I had a 987 Cayman which felt an event even if just commuting in traffic - looking for that feeling back.
I'm looking for something that feels special that I could keep for a while, just using for fun duties and no commuting or anything long distance other than the odd weekend.
The engine and gearbox in the A110 put me off a bit. But then the heaviness of the 911 is a downside too - but charismatic engine and manual box is very appealing.
Anyone have/had both and can comment on how special they feel longer term? Also not necessarily always on great roads, as round me there aren't many. For context I had a FK8 type R which lost it's specialness as just felt like a civic 90% of my driving around town. But I had a 987 Cayman which felt an event even if just commuting in traffic - looking for that feeling back.
Not tried a 997, but I had a 24 hour test drive in a 996 and there's no way I'd take one instead of the A110. Awful heavy gearchange for starters.
My A110 still feels special after 7 years; I've not done that many miles, but I've enjoyed them all, even if it's just going to the office.
My A110 still feels special after 7 years; I've not done that many miles, but I've enjoyed them all, even if it's just going to the office.
Your conditions have a very clear solution:
Lightness + charismatic + manual + never boring = Elise/Exige
Loving both A110 and Elise, which I still have!
Not catched through a 911 after driving. If any, a GT3 touring or perhaps a T could be interesting, but none of the various other models.
Lightness + charismatic + manual + never boring = Elise/Exige
Loving both A110 and Elise, which I still have!
Not catched through a 911 after driving. If any, a GT3 touring or perhaps a T could be interesting, but none of the various other models.
I have a 997 gen 2 C4s PDK and was seriously thinking of changing to an Alpine A110 - so I had an extended (8 hr) test drive.
Couldn't do it in the end. Loved the light and nimble handling of the A110 but realised I'd miss everything else about the 997 gen 2. Better steering position and steering feel, better brake feel, much more stable at high speeds, real exhaust sound (mine's slightly modified), better build quality inside and out and just overall drama and specialness of a 911.
The piped fake exhaust sounds in the Alpine cabin are almost comical.
If I had the money for a 3rd (weekend) car that I didn't have to rely on, then I'd buy an Apline - but not in place of anything else.
Couldn't do it in the end. Loved the light and nimble handling of the A110 but realised I'd miss everything else about the 997 gen 2. Better steering position and steering feel, better brake feel, much more stable at high speeds, real exhaust sound (mine's slightly modified), better build quality inside and out and just overall drama and specialness of a 911.
The piped fake exhaust sounds in the Alpine cabin are almost comical.
If I had the money for a 3rd (weekend) car that I didn't have to rely on, then I'd buy an Apline - but not in place of anything else.
I had a 996C4 for 2 or 3 years, a 997C2S for 2 years, a 991.2T for 3 years and a smattering of Boxsters and Cayman. I now have an A110 (over 4 years and counting) and a 718 Spyder.
None of the 911s were 'special' and in fact, I didn't think the 996 or 997 were a particularly good drive. I felt they were good 'do everything' type of sportscars but not fun. The A110 replaced the 991, which was by far the best of the 911s I owned. The 991 was incredibly competent but that was probably its biggest issue really - you had to be going mad speeds for it to come alive so for the most part it just felt a bit frustrating.
The fact that the Alpine has stayed with me for so long and still feels like an event every time I go out in it speaks volumes to me. It's not perfect but it is far better at being a fun road car, especially on British roads, than any of the 911s I owned. Where the 911 does certainly win though is in practicality, with a large front 'boot' and plenty of space behind the front seats. Having said all that, what I want/prefer out of a car isn't necessarily what you want/prefer so you just need to drive some and see what floats your boat.
None of the 911s were 'special' and in fact, I didn't think the 996 or 997 were a particularly good drive. I felt they were good 'do everything' type of sportscars but not fun. The A110 replaced the 991, which was by far the best of the 911s I owned. The 991 was incredibly competent but that was probably its biggest issue really - you had to be going mad speeds for it to come alive so for the most part it just felt a bit frustrating.
The fact that the Alpine has stayed with me for so long and still feels like an event every time I go out in it speaks volumes to me. It's not perfect but it is far better at being a fun road car, especially on British roads, than any of the 911s I owned. Where the 911 does certainly win though is in practicality, with a large front 'boot' and plenty of space behind the front seats. Having said all that, what I want/prefer out of a car isn't necessarily what you want/prefer so you just need to drive some and see what floats your boat.
wax lyrical said:
A110Wienerwald said:
Fully agree.
But can be removed easily
...but then the engine & exhaust sound is completely non-existent. I assume some people put a sports exhaust on? But can be removed easily
Thanks for all the replies, have booked in a test drive next week! Very excited for it the more I think about it.
Next question, for my use case as a weekend car that I want to feel special every drive, I'm a little confused which models to look at.
Base - will I just always think I wish I had the higher spec/power? Found in my 2.7 Cayman I loved so dearly that there was always that nagging thought, despite the big plus being real world useability.
GT - or alternatively will the extra power leave me a little frustrated as other cars (e.g. M4) have where it is simply not that useable with today's speed limits and traffic? As mentioned I'm not in an area where truly mega roads are on the doorstep.
S - initially discounted these as it seems the journalist consensus is it's not as good on the road due to added stiffness. But considering I don't really care about comfort for this, will it actually keep it feeling more special and focused? I'd also probably do track work (perhaps only once a year).
Will of course sit in and try to test the different types, but interested in longer term owners views.
Next question, for my use case as a weekend car that I want to feel special every drive, I'm a little confused which models to look at.
Base - will I just always think I wish I had the higher spec/power? Found in my 2.7 Cayman I loved so dearly that there was always that nagging thought, despite the big plus being real world useability.
GT - or alternatively will the extra power leave me a little frustrated as other cars (e.g. M4) have where it is simply not that useable with today's speed limits and traffic? As mentioned I'm not in an area where truly mega roads are on the doorstep.
S - initially discounted these as it seems the journalist consensus is it's not as good on the road due to added stiffness. But considering I don't really care about comfort for this, will it actually keep it feeling more special and focused? I'd also probably do track work (perhaps only once a year).
Will of course sit in and try to test the different types, but interested in longer term owners views.
Sporky said:
Hard to answer for anyone else, but I've never felt my Pure needed more power. I've also never wished it had a firmer ride.
+1, although the standard suspension can struggle slightly on undulating roads 2up and with luggage. But like power can be solved with a remap, suspension can be solved by aftermarket options too and with something like the ASTs you can get close to OE low speed ride quality with much better control when pressing on. Equally you could fit softer aftermarket suspension to an S.I would say one big consideration is pre/post "facelift" in IIRC 2022 when they changed the infotainment and the newer cars get carplay (easily spotted by the righthandmost piano key button on the dash is blank on the early cars and a power button on the later cars). The downside is the later cars are "connected" if that bothers you although there was still no change to ADAS systems or anything else like that.
I just want to point what a difference ~50hp makes between the Pure and GT.
Assuming that both cars are 1100kg in weight and one is coming with 250hp while the other one comes with 300hp.
I'm not going to put complicated physics here. Just the basic power to weight ratio for an indication.
Pure has 0.22hp/kg and GT has 0.27hp/kg. So the difference is 0.05hp/kg. It's really very little. But somehow it means 0.3s on 0-100kph acceleration (because of the differences in torque and power curves).
Assuming that both cars are 1100kg in weight and one is coming with 250hp while the other one comes with 300hp.
I'm not going to put complicated physics here. Just the basic power to weight ratio for an indication.
Pure has 0.22hp/kg and GT has 0.27hp/kg. So the difference is 0.05hp/kg. It's really very little. But somehow it means 0.3s on 0-100kph acceleration (because of the differences in torque and power curves).
Safak said:
I just want to point what a difference ~50hp makes between the Pure and GT.
Assuming that both cars are 1100kg in weight and one is coming with 250hp while the other one comes with 300hp.
I'm not going to put complicated physics here. Just the basic power to weight ratio for an indication.
Pure has 0.22hp/kg and GT has 0.27hp/kg. So the difference is 0.05hp/kg. It's really very little. But somehow it means 0.3s on 0-100kph acceleration (because of the differences in torque and power curves).
That a massive over simplification, you have to compare the power graph to determine if that extra 50hp is useful or not, as its only a peak measurement.Assuming that both cars are 1100kg in weight and one is coming with 250hp while the other one comes with 300hp.
I'm not going to put complicated physics here. Just the basic power to weight ratio for an indication.
Pure has 0.22hp/kg and GT has 0.27hp/kg. So the difference is 0.05hp/kg. It's really very little. But somehow it means 0.3s on 0-100kph acceleration (because of the differences in torque and power curves).
For most drivers for road use, there is a minute difference in real world performance, maybe worth the extra if you want to go on track.
springfan62 said:
That a massive over simplification, you have to compare the power graph to determine if that extra 50hp is useful or not, as its only a peak measurement.
For most drivers for road use, there is a minute difference in real world performance, maybe worth the extra if you want to go on track.
And even then, only if you care about "winning" at track days. More power also means working the brakes, tyres and cooling system harder. I get wanting enough power to get past stuff (I ran a 120bhp caterham for a number of years and it got very tedious being stuck behind people who were slower than you on a lap but wouldn't lift enough on a straight to let you past), but the standard car has plenty.For most drivers for road use, there is a minute difference in real world performance, maybe worth the extra if you want to go on track.
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