What to look for in an AV receiver
Discussion
I've had a 2004-era TEAC AG-5D receiver providing sound for my TV for 20-odd years, but it has finally packed up and won't switch on.
So I need to source a replacement. Budget isn't much, so it'll be secondhand.
It's a pretty simple setup at the moment.
A Panasonic plasma TV, connected to the amp via an optical cable (the amp is too old to have HDMI sockets). Rear surround speakers. Centre speaker, Front speaker outputs go to a Yamaha active sub, and then on to the front speakers themselves. Blue ray player connects to the TV via HDMI, as does the Amazon Firestick.
Then for audio, there is a Pioneer CD player connected by RCA, and a NAD turntable connected via a pre-amp and RCA.
Obviously technology has marched on since my last purchase, and there is a sea of new acronyms that I know nothing about. So the question is, what tech or connectivity is essential, and which can be safely ignored? Should i bestringing everything via HDMI now? Do i need Atmos/DTS/Dolby Vision, or is my other kit all too old to actually make use of any of that stuff?
So I need to source a replacement. Budget isn't much, so it'll be secondhand.
It's a pretty simple setup at the moment.
A Panasonic plasma TV, connected to the amp via an optical cable (the amp is too old to have HDMI sockets). Rear surround speakers. Centre speaker, Front speaker outputs go to a Yamaha active sub, and then on to the front speakers themselves. Blue ray player connects to the TV via HDMI, as does the Amazon Firestick.
Then for audio, there is a Pioneer CD player connected by RCA, and a NAD turntable connected via a pre-amp and RCA.
Obviously technology has marched on since my last purchase, and there is a sea of new acronyms that I know nothing about. So the question is, what tech or connectivity is essential, and which can be safely ignored? Should i bestringing everything via HDMI now? Do i need Atmos/DTS/Dolby Vision, or is my other kit all too old to actually make use of any of that stuff?
Just go for one of the main brands such as Denon and Yamaha and google reviews based on what you find on ebay.
There's nothing else you would benefit from in terms of tech ... HDMI arc is probably all an AVR will have extra but as you're using a plasma TV, it won't have this feature anyway.
Generally most systems will have sources connected via HDMI and then HDMI from AVR to TV ... in your case, I'd suggest you stick with optical from TV to AVR.
There's nothing else you would benefit from in terms of tech ... HDMI arc is probably all an AVR will have extra but as you're using a plasma TV, it won't have this feature anyway.
Generally most systems will have sources connected via HDMI and then HDMI from AVR to TV ... in your case, I'd suggest you stick with optical from TV to AVR.
Assuming your TV has HDMI connectivity but isn't 4k then something like this is all you need.
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/188737501351?_skw=denon...
- Note to add this is not my listing, just the first one I found on ebay
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/188737501351?_skw=denon...
- Note to add this is not my listing, just the first one I found on ebay
My main requirement beyond the right number of HDMI/etc was a compressor to try and deal with modern cinema habit of having really quiet vocal and very loud effects. I think Denon call it dynamic compression.
Volume Normalisation is similar but seems to be more about having the same output volume for different inputs, mines not got that but would be interested in having that too next time I change.
Volume Normalisation is similar but seems to be more about having the same output volume for different inputs, mines not got that but would be interested in having that too next time I change.
I'd start at around a Denon avr-x3500H level (my latest amp) . At that "entry point" you get all you need including a phono stage. The lower models omit the phono.
I'd go second hand, unless you like a shock - the AVR market has changed from good value to "cash in on the few without soundbars".
I'd go second hand, unless you like a shock - the AVR market has changed from good value to "cash in on the few without soundbars".
wombleh said:
My main requirement beyond the right number of HDMI/etc was a compressor to try and deal with modern cinema habit of having really quiet vocal and very loud effects. I think Denon call it dynamic compression.
Volume Normalisation is similar but seems to be more about having the same output volume for different inputs, mines not got that but would be interested in having that too next time I change.
apple tv has a button to fix low vocal channelVolume Normalisation is similar but seems to be more about having the same output volume for different inputs, mines not got that but would be interested in having that too next time I change.
dolby digital/atmos sources seam to suffer less from this
Dave Hedgehog said:
depends if you want to future proof it, some hdmi 2.1 4k 120hz (8k/60) ports are must imo
I do want to future proof to some extent, but as I've not even taken the leap to 4K yet, I think worrying about 8K connectivity can wait a while.I'm discovering that the secondhand market for AV receivers is a bit of a minefield. Ebay has hundreds for "parts only" which implies they are not tremendously reliable, and there are also quite a few people selling really old stuff (like 2008 or earlier vintage) who still want 50% of the price they paid nearly 20 years ago.
There's an Onkyo TX-NR676E about 2 hours drive from me that i might go and have a look at this weekend, but I can't find any reviews of it.
Start by shortlisting what you actually need. The way I see it, your current is 1080p, so you could opt for a 1080p receiver with HDMI support rather than going 4K, Dolby Vision, 120Hz, yadda yadda yadda. HDMI CEC is handy but in your case not essential.
You're running a 5.0 speaker system if the two front channel speaker wires go through the Yamaha sub first. A newer receiver will have a dedicated subwoofer output via RCA. You could continue as you are, or you could take the option to run the sub via the RCA output. This will give you the bass from the Low Frequency Effects channel (LFE) that you're missing at the moment. It also provides the option to take some of the bass duties away from the speakers and send that to the sub instead. This improves vocal clarify for the centre channel and makes the rest of the speakers a bit more dynamic.
It sounds a bit complicated written out like this, but if you get the set-up mic with the receiver, then a wizard feature takes care of everything for you. It even does some Room EQ. This is measuring the effect of the room on the sound of each speaker, then adjusting a digital graphic equaliser (parametric EQ) to compensate.
The Apple TV you'll have set to 1080p to match the TV resolution. The best sound from that is Dolby Digital (DD) 5.1 in your case. You could keep the ATV connected to the TV or route it through a newer AVR. The advantages here are a bit limited. It's largely HDMI control and having an independent memory for lip-sync adjustment, buy your Panny plasma might do that anyway.
The biggest change for you would be putting the Blu-ray player through the AVR. That's because of the sound. Blu-ray has lossless surround sound encoded as either Dolby True HD or DTS Master Audio HD. Both these are a big step up from DD and DTS that optical can carry. You'll have a lot of fun re-watching your Blu-rays with this new and bigger sound.
The analogue inputs are straightforward enough. What's quite important for you is that the AVR makes a decent job of playing music. I like Yamaha for that. My last five AVRs have been Yamaha. I've played around with Denon, Marantz, Sony, Pioneer, Onkyo, Anthem, ARCAM, TAG, Lexicon, and even Harman Kardon.
If you're interested, I have a Yamaha RX-A1010 that would tick all your boxes. It has the original packaging, remote, and the set-up mic. DM me if you don't get sorted elsewhere.
You're running a 5.0 speaker system if the two front channel speaker wires go through the Yamaha sub first. A newer receiver will have a dedicated subwoofer output via RCA. You could continue as you are, or you could take the option to run the sub via the RCA output. This will give you the bass from the Low Frequency Effects channel (LFE) that you're missing at the moment. It also provides the option to take some of the bass duties away from the speakers and send that to the sub instead. This improves vocal clarify for the centre channel and makes the rest of the speakers a bit more dynamic.
It sounds a bit complicated written out like this, but if you get the set-up mic with the receiver, then a wizard feature takes care of everything for you. It even does some Room EQ. This is measuring the effect of the room on the sound of each speaker, then adjusting a digital graphic equaliser (parametric EQ) to compensate.
The Apple TV you'll have set to 1080p to match the TV resolution. The best sound from that is Dolby Digital (DD) 5.1 in your case. You could keep the ATV connected to the TV or route it through a newer AVR. The advantages here are a bit limited. It's largely HDMI control and having an independent memory for lip-sync adjustment, buy your Panny plasma might do that anyway.
The biggest change for you would be putting the Blu-ray player through the AVR. That's because of the sound. Blu-ray has lossless surround sound encoded as either Dolby True HD or DTS Master Audio HD. Both these are a big step up from DD and DTS that optical can carry. You'll have a lot of fun re-watching your Blu-rays with this new and bigger sound.
The analogue inputs are straightforward enough. What's quite important for you is that the AVR makes a decent job of playing music. I like Yamaha for that. My last five AVRs have been Yamaha. I've played around with Denon, Marantz, Sony, Pioneer, Onkyo, Anthem, ARCAM, TAG, Lexicon, and even Harman Kardon.
If you're interested, I have a Yamaha RX-A1010 that would tick all your boxes. It has the original packaging, remote, and the set-up mic. DM me if you don't get sorted elsewhere.
Lucid_AV said:
Start by shortlisting what you actually need. The way I see it, your current is 1080p, so you could opt for a 1080p receiver with HDMI support rather than going 4K, Dolby Vision, 120Hz, yadda yadda yadda. HDMI CEC is handy but in your case not essential.
You're running a 5.0 speaker system if the two front channel speaker wires go through the Yamaha sub first. A newer receiver will have a dedicated subwoofer output via RCA. You could continue as you are, or you could take the option to run the sub via the RCA output. This will give you the bass from the Low Frequency Effects channel (LFE) that you're missing at the moment. It also provides the option to take some of the bass duties away from the speakers and send that to the sub instead. This improves vocal clarify for the centre channel and makes the rest of the speakers a bit more dynamic.
It sounds a bit complicated written out like this, but if you get the set-up mic with the receiver, then a wizard feature takes care of everything for you. It even does some Room EQ. This is measuring the effect of the room on the sound of each speaker, then adjusting a digital graphic equaliser (parametric EQ) to compensate.
The Apple TV you'll have set to 1080p to match the TV resolution. The best sound from that is Dolby Digital (DD) 5.1 in your case. You could keep the ATV connected to the TV or route it through a newer AVR. The advantages here are a bit limited. It's largely HDMI control and having an independent memory for lip-sync adjustment, buy your Panny plasma might do that anyway.
The biggest change for you would be putting the Blu-ray player through the AVR. That's because of the sound. Blu-ray has lossless surround sound encoded as either Dolby True HD or DTS Master Audio HD. Both these are a big step up from DD and DTS that optical can carry. You'll have a lot of fun re-watching your Blu-rays with this new and bigger sound.
The analogue inputs are straightforward enough. What's quite important for you is that the AVR makes a decent job of playing music. I like Yamaha for that. My last five AVRs have been Yamaha. I've played around with Denon, Marantz, Sony, Pioneer, Onkyo, Anthem, ARCAM, TAG, Lexicon, and even Harman Kardon.
If you're interested, I have a Yamaha RX-A1010 that would tick all your boxes. It has the original packaging, remote, and the set-up mic. DM me if you don't get sorted elsewhere.
Thanks for that, ots of good info there.You're running a 5.0 speaker system if the two front channel speaker wires go through the Yamaha sub first. A newer receiver will have a dedicated subwoofer output via RCA. You could continue as you are, or you could take the option to run the sub via the RCA output. This will give you the bass from the Low Frequency Effects channel (LFE) that you're missing at the moment. It also provides the option to take some of the bass duties away from the speakers and send that to the sub instead. This improves vocal clarify for the centre channel and makes the rest of the speakers a bit more dynamic.
It sounds a bit complicated written out like this, but if you get the set-up mic with the receiver, then a wizard feature takes care of everything for you. It even does some Room EQ. This is measuring the effect of the room on the sound of each speaker, then adjusting a digital graphic equaliser (parametric EQ) to compensate.
The Apple TV you'll have set to 1080p to match the TV resolution. The best sound from that is Dolby Digital (DD) 5.1 in your case. You could keep the ATV connected to the TV or route it through a newer AVR. The advantages here are a bit limited. It's largely HDMI control and having an independent memory for lip-sync adjustment, buy your Panny plasma might do that anyway.
The biggest change for you would be putting the Blu-ray player through the AVR. That's because of the sound. Blu-ray has lossless surround sound encoded as either Dolby True HD or DTS Master Audio HD. Both these are a big step up from DD and DTS that optical can carry. You'll have a lot of fun re-watching your Blu-rays with this new and bigger sound.
The analogue inputs are straightforward enough. What's quite important for you is that the AVR makes a decent job of playing music. I like Yamaha for that. My last five AVRs have been Yamaha. I've played around with Denon, Marantz, Sony, Pioneer, Onkyo, Anthem, ARCAM, TAG, Lexicon, and even Harman Kardon.
If you're interested, I have a Yamaha RX-A1010 that would tick all your boxes. It has the original packaging, remote, and the set-up mic. DM me if you don't get sorted elsewhere.
The front speaker outputs go to the sub, where i assume its internal processing knocks out some of the bass notes from the signal before sending it on to the speakers themselves. It's got an adjustment on the front that lets you adjust which frequencies it plays, and which go to the speakers. But I will try your recommendation and see if there is an improvement.
I've got an Onkyo TX-NR626 which arrived today, so i will try setting it up tonight and see how it goes. No setup microphone unfortunately...
boyse7en said:
The front speaker outputs go to the sub, where i assume its internal processing knocks out some of the bass notes from the signal before sending it on to the speakers themselves. It's got an adjustment on the front that lets you adjust which frequencies it plays, and which go to the speakers. But I will try your recommendation and see if there is an improvement.
IDK which Yam sub you have, but I had a loo at the manual for the 315 and 215 subs. They don't have frequency filtering on the High-Level out sockets. The front controls only influence the Yamaha amp driving the sub. For a set-up mic, try eBay.
Dave Hedgehog said:
depends if you want to future proof it, some hdmi 2.1 4k 120hz (8k/60) ports are must imo
I'm not so sure...My receiver, bought in 2020, has 8k ports. 6 years later and still no-one seems to have any plans to release native 8k sources. The only use I'm aware of is very high spec PC rigs that can handle 8k, but how many people have such a gaming PC in the same room as their home cinema? Of course 8k TVs exist, and the Sony PS5 has an option to upscale its graphics to 8k instead of upscaling them to 4k, but you might as well upscale at the TV end.
So 8k ports are one of those things that there's no harm in having them but I wouldn't make it part of any decision as they might never be used as 8k ports.
donkmeister said:
Dave Hedgehog said:
depends if you want to future proof it, some hdmi 2.1 4k 120hz (8k/60) ports are must imo
I'm not so sure...My receiver, bought in 2020, has 8k ports. 6 years later and still no-one seems to have any plans to release native 8k sources. The only use I'm aware of is very high spec PC rigs that can handle 8k, but how many people have such a gaming PC in the same room as their home cinema? Of course 8k TVs exist, and the Sony PS5 has an option to upscale its graphics to 8k instead of upscaling them to 4k, but you might as well upscale at the TV end.
So 8k ports are one of those things that there's no harm in having them but I wouldn't make it part of any decision as they might never be used as 8k ports.
Lucid_AV said:
boyse7en said:
The front speaker outputs go to the sub, where i assume its internal processing knocks out some of the bass notes from the signal before sending it on to the speakers themselves. It's got an adjustment on the front that lets you adjust which frequencies it plays, and which go to the speakers. But I will try your recommendation and see if there is an improvement.
IDK which Yam sub you have, but I had a loo at the manual for the 315 and 215 subs. They don't have frequency filtering on the High-Level out sockets. The front controls only influence the Yamaha amp driving the sub. For a set-up mic, try eBay.
ChatGPT reckons the best way is to connect from Amp sub pre-out with a single RCA to the Subwoofer, set the High Cut adjustment to exactly halfway, and then let the amp sort out the filtering
boyse7en said:
Lucid_AV said:
boyse7en said:
The front speaker outputs go to the sub, where i assume its internal processing knocks out some of the bass notes from the signal before sending it on to the speakers themselves. It's got an adjustment on the front that lets you adjust which frequencies it plays, and which go to the speakers. But I will try your recommendation and see if there is an improvement.
IDK which Yam sub you have, but I had a loo at the manual for the 315 and 215 subs. They don't have frequency filtering on the High-Level out sockets. The front controls only influence the Yamaha amp driving the sub. For a set-up mic, try eBay.
ChatGPT reckons the best way is to connect from Amp sub pre-out with a single RCA to the Subwoofer, set the High Cut adjustment to exactly halfway, and then let the amp sort out the filtering
That Yam IS a bit old, and its wowefully underpowered (internal amps). You can get a LOT of sub for your money off FB Marketplace and Ebay these days.
Griffith4ever said:
That Yam IS a bit old, and its wowefully underpowered (internal amps). You can get a LOT of sub for your money off FB Marketplace and Ebay these days.
Mine is an SW90 - probably around the year 2000 / 2001!! Hooked up to a Yam RX-V677. What sort of subs should I (we) be looking for - any recommendations to look out for?S6PNJ said:
Griffith4ever said:
That Yam IS a bit old, and its wowefully underpowered (internal amps). You can get a LOT of sub for your money off FB Marketplace and Ebay these days.
Mine is an SW90 - probably around the year 2000 / 2001!! Hooked up to a Yam RX-V677. What sort of subs should I (we) be looking for - any recommendations to look out for?Anything from REL (quake, storm etc), Gemini (small, but very musical), B&W ASWxx, Monitor audio, .... the list is long. best bet is to see whats in range on FB marketplace, or Ebay collect only, then start looking up specs / reviews / one vs the other, and the likes.
Earth moving, prob head 10" min, pref 12" (and you can go 15" of you are mad for it). More subtle, 7-8" or so.
There is just so much choice. Room size is a thing too. I have a B&W ASW700 which is a 12" beast (1000w amp), but a tiny Gemini sub is better in that room. Had a much larger living room in the previous house.
I'd say that's fair.
My main system has an 8" slim 150w sub, and TBH it doesn't really add much below the main speakers (floorstanders with 6.5" woofers)
I pulled out a cheap old big cab 10" or 12" to test before selling it, cost half as much when new but I was amazed at how much deeper the bass was.
If you REALLY want to make it heard, a 15" Trace Elliot bass cabinet can do wonders. I used to live in a maisonette and that was the nuclear option whenever my downstairs neighbour wouldn't turn his crap stereo down
Never try to out-bass a bassist.... Especially when your weapon of choice is a £100 midi system.
My main system has an 8" slim 150w sub, and TBH it doesn't really add much below the main speakers (floorstanders with 6.5" woofers)
I pulled out a cheap old big cab 10" or 12" to test before selling it, cost half as much when new but I was amazed at how much deeper the bass was.
If you REALLY want to make it heard, a 15" Trace Elliot bass cabinet can do wonders. I used to live in a maisonette and that was the nuclear option whenever my downstairs neighbour wouldn't turn his crap stereo down
Never try to out-bass a bassist.... Especially when your weapon of choice is a £100 midi system.I ve had pioneer av amps for the past 30 years.
I bought a pioneer sc-lx86 new and it s still doing sterling service on an almost daily basis-
You can pick used pioneer av amps up for not very much these days- look for the air studios and THX
Certified ones.
https://www.whathifi.com/pioneer/sc-lx86/review
I bought a pioneer sc-lx86 new and it s still doing sterling service on an almost daily basis-
You can pick used pioneer av amps up for not very much these days- look for the air studios and THX
Certified ones.
https://www.whathifi.com/pioneer/sc-lx86/review
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