Discussion
Ok, you guys need to give me the Elise side of the argument.
Either I tune my S1 and keep it or I go and buy a Chimaera. Both make sense to me but I'd like to hear you guys' thoughts.
It's currently got a 135 engine and AVO suspension (which I like so lets not go into that!) and I want more power and probably better brakes. I'll need new springs too (dampers have plenty of scope for adjustment to compensate) so spring rates and sellers would be appreciated.
So: Do I tune the K? If so, what kits should I look at and what can I expect from them. Approx costs?
Put in a V-tec? How much work and how much?
Put in something else? (VW engine or other?)
Will I need to uprate the gearbox/driveshafts/hubs or anything else?
Bear in mind I drive the car every day.
Many thanks in advance
Either I tune my S1 and keep it or I go and buy a Chimaera. Both make sense to me but I'd like to hear you guys' thoughts.
It's currently got a 135 engine and AVO suspension (which I like so lets not go into that!) and I want more power and probably better brakes. I'll need new springs too (dampers have plenty of scope for adjustment to compensate) so spring rates and sellers would be appreciated.
So: Do I tune the K? If so, what kits should I look at and what can I expect from them. Approx costs?
Put in a V-tec? How much work and how much?
Put in something else? (VW engine or other?)
Will I need to uprate the gearbox/driveshafts/hubs or anything else?
Bear in mind I drive the car every day.
Many thanks in advance
This has been flogged like the proverbial tinkers nag on SELOC mate.
Have a search over there and you'll find recent threads on all of the above.
http://forums.seloc.org
>> Edited by S Works on Monday 17th October 17:14
Have a search over there and you'll find recent threads on all of the above.
http://forums.seloc.org
>> Edited by S Works on Monday 17th October 17:14
The NA Honda / Audi options are likely going to cost >£10k. Tuning the K series - you could spend a fortune trying to achieve what you want, spend sensibly and start here www.dvapower.com
There are other options though. There are a few converted cars up for sale at the moment. For example there is a 265BHP Audi conversion on SELOC for £16500
>> Edited by StuartB on Tuesday 18th October 10:38
There are other options though. There are a few converted cars up for sale at the moment. For example there is a 265BHP Audi conversion on SELOC for £16500
>> Edited by StuartB on Tuesday 18th October 10:38
I dont think Turbo Technics do them any more - too expensive - you can have a new engine in there for that - £7-9.5K for the TT kit
BBR Turbo...nope...never heard of anyone with one at all...turbo + K series = bang !
either sell your car and buy a pre-done car - some of TT, Audi, Honda cars come up from time to time here and on SELOC...or save up
tuning the K up to about 160bhp is not too bad...up to 180bhp (with DTHTBs/ECU etc) adds another few grand and is about the limit of price/bhp/reliablity ratio for most people
BBR Turbo...nope...never heard of anyone with one at all...turbo + K series = bang !
either sell your car and buy a pre-done car - some of TT, Audi, Honda cars come up from time to time here and on SELOC...or save up
tuning the K up to about 160bhp is not too bad...up to 180bhp (with DTHTBs/ECU etc) adds another few grand and is about the limit of price/bhp/reliablity ratio for most people
Why buy a Chimaera? 
I have an S1 which is mildy tuned (160bhp) but otherwise standard which was far quicker round Croft than a Chim. And it was faster down the straights as well as the corners. I was getting up to about 115 so unless you wanna be doing license losing speeds I can't see why the Chim would be a better option than the Elise. The only thing it does better is noises and 100mph+. The noise is something else tho! 
All IMHO of course. Really depends on what you want to do with the car.
Drop me an email to dan@judeperformance.co.uk if you wanna have a chat about upgrading the Elise.
HTH
Dan
Jude Performance Services Ltd
www.judeperformance.co.uk
I have an S1 which is mildy tuned (160bhp) but otherwise standard which was far quicker round Croft than a Chim. And it was faster down the straights as well as the corners. I was getting up to about 115 so unless you wanna be doing license losing speeds I can't see why the Chim would be a better option than the Elise. The only thing it does better is noises and 100mph+. The noise is something else tho! All IMHO of course. Really depends on what you want to do with the car.
Drop me an email to dan@judeperformance.co.uk if you wanna have a chat about upgrading the Elise.
HTH
Dan
Jude Performance Services Ltd
www.judeperformance.co.uk
>The only thing it does better is noises and 100mph+
and the boot - used to be able to take the Mrs away for the week in the Chim, not so in the Elise ...
and the bills - I found TVR services *start* at £750, the Elise doesnt even register. How do you make a small fortune owning a TVR ... start with a LARGE fortune
and the boot - used to be able to take the Mrs away for the week in the Chim, not so in the Elise ...
and the bills - I found TVR services *start* at £750, the Elise doesnt even register. How do you make a small fortune owning a TVR ... start with a LARGE fortune
Aye, but the V8 (like the K) is a fairly straightforward engine and is easy enough to DIY.
The Elise is purely a road car as a Chim would be. I'm not too bothered by absolutely speed point to point (if I was I'd buy an Evo) but I'm more into, what could cringingly be described as 'driving nirvana'.
The Chim is surprisingly neat and nimble. It's no Elise, but it's surprising. I really don't know - the Chim's not a bad handler, has a fair old thump and is quite practical. The Elise is probably as quick, has better handling and steering but loses out on practicality and no four cylinder can match a V8.
Maybe I need a Chim, then after that, I need a S2 Exige so I've covered all the bases..........
The Elise is purely a road car as a Chim would be. I'm not too bothered by absolutely speed point to point (if I was I'd buy an Evo) but I'm more into, what could cringingly be described as 'driving nirvana'.
The Chim is surprisingly neat and nimble. It's no Elise, but it's surprising. I really don't know - the Chim's not a bad handler, has a fair old thump and is quite practical. The Elise is probably as quick, has better handling and steering but loses out on practicality and no four cylinder can match a V8.
Maybe I need a Chim, then after that, I need a S2 Exige so I've covered all the bases..........
having had both, why do you want the Chimaera? Aside from it being more practical?
I see you mention you arent worried about the speed side of things. Which is handy.
Even doing your own servicing (bye bye resale) its still more expensive on parts. Not to mention as an everyday car fuel economy. Ok, so I dont give a sh1t about running costs personally but its still worth a mention.
If you want a practical sporty car that sounds glorious and is spacious and comfortable, the Chimaera is probably the better choice. If you want a sports car that handles beautifully, is cheap to run and point to point is one of the quickest without electronic trickery, the elise is the one. What are your reasons for wanting to swap?
I see you mention you arent worried about the speed side of things. Which is handy.
Even doing your own servicing (bye bye resale) its still more expensive on parts. Not to mention as an everyday car fuel economy. Ok, so I dont give a sh1t about running costs personally but its still worth a mention.
If you want a practical sporty car that sounds glorious and is spacious and comfortable, the Chimaera is probably the better choice. If you want a sports car that handles beautifully, is cheap to run and point to point is one of the quickest without electronic trickery, the elise is the one. What are your reasons for wanting to swap?
Tuscan,
tuning the K used to be a hit and miss thing. People were charging a lot for their "secrets" and were getting mixed results. Mostly good power but not lasting long enough, they would go pop!
Then somebody (who BTW was screwed by a tuner and paid dearly) made a thorough analysis and gathered all what was known about the K (no, he didn't discover or invent things).
Now the recipy is out there.
Now, going to Seloc would be the best way to get all the information you need to swap engines. Most people there are pro-swap. If that's what you want to do, go for it.
But some of us want to keep the K.
I gave it a shot and now am very happy with 220 BHP / 158 ft/lbs, revs all the time to 8.6K (wher I set the limiter), and in short the car feels like what it should have been in the first case. Cost? about £3.5K, and yes, I had to take off the engine and put it back.
My engine is warranted against any failure, well, except wear. And when that happens, I will go down the 1.9 or 2.0 route, still the K.
Now, any pro K post tends to get slagged immediately, but my message is that it can be done, and swapping engines falls into a different perspective. Mainly if you're looking for 300+ BHP.
See ya at KH Ali, finally we'll see what an S2 can do with a good driver at the wheel.
tuning the K used to be a hit and miss thing. People were charging a lot for their "secrets" and were getting mixed results. Mostly good power but not lasting long enough, they would go pop!
Then somebody (who BTW was screwed by a tuner and paid dearly) made a thorough analysis and gathered all what was known about the K (no, he didn't discover or invent things).
Now the recipy is out there.
Now, going to Seloc would be the best way to get all the information you need to swap engines. Most people there are pro-swap. If that's what you want to do, go for it.
But some of us want to keep the K.
I gave it a shot and now am very happy with 220 BHP / 158 ft/lbs, revs all the time to 8.6K (wher I set the limiter), and in short the car feels like what it should have been in the first case. Cost? about £3.5K, and yes, I had to take off the engine and put it back.
My engine is warranted against any failure, well, except wear. And when that happens, I will go down the 1.9 or 2.0 route, still the K.
Now, any pro K post tends to get slagged immediately, but my message is that it can be done, and swapping engines falls into a different perspective. Mainly if you're looking for 300+ BHP.
See ya at KH Ali, finally we'll see what an S2 can do with a good driver at the wheel.
Shnozz said:
having had both, why do you want the Chimaera? What are your reasons for wanting to swap?
Well it's like 'back in the day' the Elan would have been the faster, more nimble choice, but there's just something about a big Healey, with a thumping great engine in the front.
My musical analogy would be we're comparing Clapton (Elise) with Led Zep (TVR). One's neater, more technically accurate, one's more brutish and, indeed, hairier. Just different answers to the same question.
I'm not convinced that a lack of service history is going to affect resale that much, not on what would be, probably, a six year old Chim. Any private buyer (I avoid trade-ins if I can) would look round my garage and see that the car would be better looked after by me than by probably any garage - but that's an aside.
I think, what I need is to own both. Only after owning, not just driving, each can I establish fully which is my preference. I have to say, though, that the Chimaera will have to be very good.
(And Ali, stop being modest! If you drive the Exige like you drove the 111S, there's not going to be a great deal keeping up!)
>> Edited by tuscan_thunder on Thursday 20th October 09:16
tuscan_thunder said:
having had both, why do you want the Chimaera? What are your reasons for wanting to swap?
Well it's like 'back in the day' the Elan would have been the faster, more nimble choice, but there's just something about a big Healey, with a thumping great engine in the front.
My musical analogy would be we're comparing Clapton (Elise) with Led Zep (TVR). One's neater, more technically accurate, one's more brutish and, indeed, hairier. Just different answers to the same question.
I'm not convinced that a lack of service history is going to affect resale that much, not on what would be, probably, a six year old Chim. Any private buyer (I avoid trade-ins if I can) would look round my garage and see that the car would be better looked after by me than by probably any garage - but that's an aside.
I think, what I need is to own both. Only after owning, not just driving, each can I establish fully which is my preference. I have to say, though, that the Chimaera will have to be very good.
(And Ali, stop being modest! If you drive the Exige like you drove the 111S, there's not going to be a great deal keeping up!)
>> Edited by tuscan_thunder on Thursday 20th October 09:16
furry muff. If you want Led Zepplin, go for the 4.5 or the 5 litre though. Not sure what your budget is, but these 2 models were always a fair bit more than the 4 but are now in the bargain catchment area too. Seen a few 4.5s at a good price recently and I must say, having driven them all, there isnt much in the performance at all (read I didnt notice the difference!) and yet the 4.5 seems a touch smoother.
I think you are totally wrong about resale though I have to say. Potential buyers wont get so far as to walk around your garage, you'll be met by a click of the phone going down before you can tell them your address. Unless you are going to sell it for absolute peanuts, expect the buyers of even low price Chims and Griffs to be incredibly picky. Mine was a mint car and yet still the slightest thing was highlighted by potential buyers. Considering its a handbuilt car that doesnt have the best reputation for the build quality, buyers seem to demand a perfect history as well as an A1 everything for these cars. Where they eventually find their choice is beyond me, but thats the way it is.
Sounds like your mind is made up and I hope you enjoy
they are fantastic cars and gave me a big grin throughout ownership. Oh, and dont believe the unreliability rumours, its usually niggly problems no different to those that you suffer with the Lotus, and no more or less difficult to fix. Its not as precise, but then its a GT car and a great one at that. You wont know whether you like it until you own one, just buy wisely. 
Wise words.
My mind's not totally made up in relation to my next move, but at some point I will buy a Chim or Griff. Maybe an S2 will be next though. Not sure.
I would aim for a 4.5 or 5litre if I can find a good one. Driven a 4litre and it's very different to the Elise and the Tuscan, different to how I expected too - much tighter in the chassis than I expected, more together, but, surprisingly (probs as it was the 4) it didn't have the sheer wallop of torque I expected.
We will see........
My mind's not totally made up in relation to my next move, but at some point I will buy a Chim or Griff. Maybe an S2 will be next though. Not sure.
I would aim for a 4.5 or 5litre if I can find a good one. Driven a 4litre and it's very different to the Elise and the Tuscan, different to how I expected too - much tighter in the chassis than I expected, more together, but, surprisingly (probs as it was the 4) it didn't have the sheer wallop of torque I expected.
We will see........
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