Trackcar MBE chip
Discussion
Its rare that I can notice a change in a car within the first meter of a drive, but having driven a TCS chipped car - I can honestly say that it was incredibly noticeable from the off...
From the moment the clutch was let out and I slowly crept down the hill and through the industrial estate it was obvious that the Cerbera had found a whole new level of ability that it had previously never come close to. Normally I drive along there very very carefully looking at the ruts in the road, while the Cerbera does its whole jumping about and hunting thing, the revs slightly bouncing all over the place. No More. This time, I was absolutely astonished to find it easily driving along at just over idle... none of the roughness of before, just purely silken low rpm steady throttle driving. Coming to a halt at the junction to a little road leading out of "pearsons industrial estate" - I was in shock, for the first time I wasnt having to concentrate to get a smooth start at low rpm - and sure enough, I turned onto the road with complete confidence that the car wasnt going to start kangaroo'ing down the road at just over idle.
It sounds stupid, but until roundabout I barely went over idle, basking in the new found smoothness - at this point I decided to find out what the pick up was like, another previous weak point and as I steered onto and around the roundabout I gave it a dab of throttle - once again, the smoothest delivery of power up to 3000rpm (it wasnt 100% warm) as I short shifted up the box... each change allowing me to experience the complete transformation to the low rpm throttle response and clean cut delivery.
As the car wasnt completely warm and it was wet I chose not to explore further up the rev range and I cannot comment at all on any power increase as I simply didnt have the chance to find out.
I can however, recommend without hesitation - this chip. I have always seen the Cerbera as a Gentleman racer on wheels - suitably attired to turn up at a dinner party and yet at weekends it'll thrash around on tracks/hillclimbs etc etc... This chip simply TRANSFORMS the cars ability to waft with complete confidence across a large gravel drive away from the dinner (no uncomfortable jostling forwards as it wishes for higher revs), while retaining its ability to snarl its way sideways around croft. It suits the Cerbera so perfectly, the delivery remaining mad as ever higher up but without that uncomfortable edginess lower down. Its an unbelievable difference, so much so that I actually recommend it as probably the most important upgrade one can do to a Cerbera that is driven, ever. It is of benefit to both those who spend thier time enjoying one of the finest british sportscars on thier journey into work and for the trackday junkies.
If you have £400-£500 (cant remember what Joo said) and want your Cerbera to be a pleasure to drive all the time, just do it. Seriously, forget any power figures, im sure its probably pushing a few more bhp/lb ft (will find out at a later date) but this chip is worth it for the power delivery alone.
Im not the kind of person who likes the Cerbera to be like a "normal car" - I dont like the clutch we had fitted two years ago, I prefered the old one, where you needed both legs to push it in! - but this mod is an absolute beauty. Its normal car smooth to the throttle, but with warp speed a few degrees away. No hesitation, no stuttering, no hunting - just smooth response and the usual VROOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOM. Dont think, DO IT!
Thanks trackcar, you've now made it an even harder car to replace
how am I meant to get it out of his hands now??
From the moment the clutch was let out and I slowly crept down the hill and through the industrial estate it was obvious that the Cerbera had found a whole new level of ability that it had previously never come close to. Normally I drive along there very very carefully looking at the ruts in the road, while the Cerbera does its whole jumping about and hunting thing, the revs slightly bouncing all over the place. No More. This time, I was absolutely astonished to find it easily driving along at just over idle... none of the roughness of before, just purely silken low rpm steady throttle driving. Coming to a halt at the junction to a little road leading out of "pearsons industrial estate" - I was in shock, for the first time I wasnt having to concentrate to get a smooth start at low rpm - and sure enough, I turned onto the road with complete confidence that the car wasnt going to start kangaroo'ing down the road at just over idle.
It sounds stupid, but until roundabout I barely went over idle, basking in the new found smoothness - at this point I decided to find out what the pick up was like, another previous weak point and as I steered onto and around the roundabout I gave it a dab of throttle - once again, the smoothest delivery of power up to 3000rpm (it wasnt 100% warm) as I short shifted up the box... each change allowing me to experience the complete transformation to the low rpm throttle response and clean cut delivery.
As the car wasnt completely warm and it was wet I chose not to explore further up the rev range and I cannot comment at all on any power increase as I simply didnt have the chance to find out.
I can however, recommend without hesitation - this chip. I have always seen the Cerbera as a Gentleman racer on wheels - suitably attired to turn up at a dinner party and yet at weekends it'll thrash around on tracks/hillclimbs etc etc... This chip simply TRANSFORMS the cars ability to waft with complete confidence across a large gravel drive away from the dinner (no uncomfortable jostling forwards as it wishes for higher revs), while retaining its ability to snarl its way sideways around croft. It suits the Cerbera so perfectly, the delivery remaining mad as ever higher up but without that uncomfortable edginess lower down. Its an unbelievable difference, so much so that I actually recommend it as probably the most important upgrade one can do to a Cerbera that is driven, ever. It is of benefit to both those who spend thier time enjoying one of the finest british sportscars on thier journey into work and for the trackday junkies.
If you have £400-£500 (cant remember what Joo said) and want your Cerbera to be a pleasure to drive all the time, just do it. Seriously, forget any power figures, im sure its probably pushing a few more bhp/lb ft (will find out at a later date) but this chip is worth it for the power delivery alone.
Im not the kind of person who likes the Cerbera to be like a "normal car" - I dont like the clutch we had fitted two years ago, I prefered the old one, where you needed both legs to push it in! - but this mod is an absolute beauty. Its normal car smooth to the throttle, but with warp speed a few degrees away. No hesitation, no stuttering, no hunting - just smooth response and the usual VROOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOM. Dont think, DO IT!
Thanks trackcar, you've now made it an even harder car to replace
how am I meant to get it out of his hands now??
philcerbera said:
Picking up my 4.5 from TCS this week after a 4 week stay with Uncle Joolz. A MBE re-map is just one of the many goodies I'm looking forward to appreciating. Your post has just made the last few days of frustration even worse - thanks BCA ;-)
If it helps the wheels + tyres on your car look absolutely superb too... you'll notice the smoothness instantly. Not sure you'll believe its your car at first though.
looked very very nice indeed.
Lots of flag waving going on here Ted, I thought our car was smooth enough, you really really notice the difference immediately afterwards. There is a roughness to the Cerbera mapping below 3krpm, you'll notice the difference if it was anything like ours. Serious improvement.
* that said, ours was an early 4.5 (97) so maybe they got better later on.
* that said, ours was an early 4.5 (97) so maybe they got better later on.
Agree with Daggart, standard mapping must be laughably bad in certain areas.
No real flag waving here either, Trackcar did the work and im just commenting on the results - Austec obviously do similar work, though I am yet to sample any of it personally. Its not really fair to compare at the moment as Joolz only really does a "generic" chip for the MBE (as I understand it), hence the price difference, although with his rollers arriving soon theres doubtlessly more to come.
Just like to thank Mr Wheeler once more for his greatest mistake.
>> Edited by BCA on Sunday 6th November 21:06
No real flag waving here either, Trackcar did the work and im just commenting on the results - Austec obviously do similar work, though I am yet to sample any of it personally. Its not really fair to compare at the moment as Joolz only really does a "generic" chip for the MBE (as I understand it), hence the price difference, although with his rollers arriving soon theres doubtlessly more to come.
Just like to thank Mr Wheeler once more for his greatest mistake.
>> Edited by BCA on Sunday 6th November 21:06
So what happened to the Emeralds? When I had my MBE remap by the A camp some 18 months ago (which I believe was one of, if not the first MBE remapped cars), the J camp and customers kept posting that the Emerald was the way forward and far better than the MBE route?
Now the J camp have started to unlock the mysteries of the MBE, which I fully commend BTW, everyone appear to be saying that the MBE is the way forward? Which is it?
I understand that the Emerald is more user friendly if you want to tinker with your own mapping, but are the power gains (slightly) better with the MBE?
Mark Adams is updating the MBE on mine this week, bringing it up to current spec from his learnings over the past 18 months. Cant wait
Now the J camp have started to unlock the mysteries of the MBE, which I fully commend BTW, everyone appear to be saying that the MBE is the way forward? Which is it?
I understand that the Emerald is more user friendly if you want to tinker with your own mapping, but are the power gains (slightly) better with the MBE?
Mark Adams is updating the MBE on mine this week, bringing it up to current spec from his learnings over the past 18 months. Cant wait
For some reason the MBE chips that trackcar works with dont quite make the same mid range torque as the Emeralded cars as far as I know. Whether this is because the emerald allows more adjustment to be done or not I am unsure, but it is certainly the easier to play about with. Also the Emerald as far as I know is at the moment, barely used to its full ability - there are all sorts of things that the emerald has the option to handle, such as traction control, full throttle upshift etc etc...
As I stressed earlier, track-car-solutions MBE chip is thus far, only a generic chip as far as I know - it is not a fully mapped to the car jobbie.
MBE is the way to go for a budget improvement however, as the emerald involves having to buy a new ECU and have it personally mapped. This is why Trackcar MBE stuff is under £500, whereas the Emerald was a smidgen over a grand. I cannot speak for Austec, but I get the impression they personally map each MBE car - a different approach, one only comparable to the Emerald at the moment, Joolz does not appear to personally map MBE cars other than in a generic way (for the moment at least.)
Trackcar, feel free to correct me and I'll edit my post accordingly, equally if I am wrong about any of Austecs stuff, please let me know. Im just working from memory/ what I have read of others work.
As I stressed earlier, track-car-solutions MBE chip is thus far, only a generic chip as far as I know - it is not a fully mapped to the car jobbie.
MBE is the way to go for a budget improvement however, as the emerald involves having to buy a new ECU and have it personally mapped. This is why Trackcar MBE stuff is under £500, whereas the Emerald was a smidgen over a grand. I cannot speak for Austec, but I get the impression they personally map each MBE car - a different approach, one only comparable to the Emerald at the moment, Joolz does not appear to personally map MBE cars other than in a generic way (for the moment at least.)
Trackcar, feel free to correct me and I'll edit my post accordingly, equally if I am wrong about any of Austecs stuff, please let me know. Im just working from memory/ what I have read of others work.
BCA, I think you are spot on, I believe Mark Adams custom maps each car and includes all the useable bits/extras (technical, I know 
) within the MBE free gratis, and Im guessing that is why this route costs more than the generic map? IIRC TCS can do the 'extras' for an additional fee? Appologies Jools if Ive got that bit wrong?
) within the MBE free gratis, and Im guessing that is why this route costs more than the generic map? IIRC TCS can do the 'extras' for an additional fee? Appologies Jools if Ive got that bit wrong?
Ben's almost right there .. the chip in their car is a generic chip based on a good average of the ones done so far, this is bacause the way we have to do the mapping is a bit time consuming so i can't afford to pay for 3rd party rolling road time for bespoke chips on the mbe cars at the moment other than the first few cars we've done to get the averages. MA says Austec paid 20k for their live mapping box of tricks .. mine cost under a tenth of that so I have comparatively little money to get back, and once the rollers are in my own workshop it doesn't really matter that it take 5 hours rather than 3 hours to do some mapping.
However, any cars with generic chips in at the moment will be mapped bespoke FOC when my rollers come in .. so the price is right for a mapped car (waiting for nubbin's padlock right now ...) , just that BCA's car at the mo has a generic chip cos I wanted his dad to feel the difference getting it fairly close can give. The good news for Ben is that his car will get even better when it's mapped specifically.
However, any cars with generic chips in at the moment will be mapped bespoke FOC when my rollers come in .. so the price is right for a mapped car (waiting for nubbin's padlock right now ...) , just that BCA's car at the mo has a generic chip cos I wanted his dad to feel the difference getting it fairly close can give. The good news for Ben is that his car will get even better when it's mapped specifically.
On the subject of emerald v mbe .. I still haven't worked out why the mbe cars make less midrange than the emerald cars I've tested with both system mapped, but my results confirm this consistently so there's obviously something the emerald does that the mbe doesn't .. I'm erring towards an injector timing offset at the moment which might be giving more charge cooling effect at certain rpm, but that's only a guess.
Nearly there then...
Theres no need to have this thread locked, its quite interesting how much the mapping has changed the cerberas low rpm throttle range. Usually these topics are about big numbers, we dont have these as it hasnt been on the rollers yet - and as a result, the talking point is most definately the smoothness and the Cerbs newly found behaviour through the rev range.
I know people have before said of how the cars are alot smoother, but I for one completely overlooked that and focused on the figures. Yet having experienced the difference im amazed people havent talked about it more. Earlier on I moved the cars around (the cerb was in the way) and I have to admit it was a shock once more, its such an improvement!!!
Im presuming Austec produce a similarly silky power delivery too... you Austec'd guys never really stressed this enough!
edit: Still seem to have a limiter at 7200rpm? Though its starting to seem like less of a bad thing! Maybe its linked to the idle thing + as with a fair few things on our early car, will remain an absolute mystery??
>> Edited by BCA on Monday 7th November 00:44
Theres no need to have this thread locked, its quite interesting how much the mapping has changed the cerberas low rpm throttle range. Usually these topics are about big numbers, we dont have these as it hasnt been on the rollers yet - and as a result, the talking point is most definately the smoothness and the Cerbs newly found behaviour through the rev range.
I know people have before said of how the cars are alot smoother, but I for one completely overlooked that and focused on the figures. Yet having experienced the difference im amazed people havent talked about it more. Earlier on I moved the cars around (the cerb was in the way) and I have to admit it was a shock once more, its such an improvement!!!
Im presuming Austec produce a similarly silky power delivery too... you Austec'd guys never really stressed this enough!
edit: Still seem to have a limiter at 7200rpm? Though its starting to seem like less of a bad thing! Maybe its linked to the idle thing + as with a fair few things on our early car, will remain an absolute mystery??
>> Edited by BCA on Monday 7th November 00:44
Emerald, MBE, shorter pipes, induction mods, Track Car Solutions and Austec it's all good for the future and enjoyment of our cars.
I have been doing a bit of experimenting with mods recently, and have some independantly tested RR results that show interesting differences between mods, hopefully by next Sunday I should have the following states of tune / mods for comparison (just need to get the final two RRd);
Standard 4.5
Emerald 4.5 (unmapped)
Emerald 4.5 (mapped)
Emerald 4.5 (mapped with induction mod)
Emerald 4.5 (as above but with shorter hoses)
Emerald 4.5 (remapped with shorter hoses)
Emerald 4.5 (as above but with linked decats)
I have been doing a bit of experimenting with mods recently, and have some independantly tested RR results that show interesting differences between mods, hopefully by next Sunday I should have the following states of tune / mods for comparison (just need to get the final two RRd);
Standard 4.5
Emerald 4.5 (unmapped)
Emerald 4.5 (mapped)
Emerald 4.5 (mapped with induction mod)
Emerald 4.5 (as above but with shorter hoses)
Emerald 4.5 (remapped with shorter hoses)
Emerald 4.5 (as above but with linked decats)
Gassing Station | Cerbera | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff