Traction Control
Discussion
I must have time on my hands at the moment because bit by bit I am doing my homework on the Cerbera and looking at different ways to improve the drive. To be honest I have not been able to drive the car that much due to work but I have been reading up on other drivers comments.
My question is has anybody added traction control to their cars. I know it can be done with some extra sensors since the car does not have ABS.
My question is has anybody added traction control to their cars. I know it can be done with some extra sensors since the car does not have ABS.
PH'er Faisal Kahn (American Cerbera owner) had a race logic system fitted - but I seem to recall it working for only brief periods of time?? Perhaps hes still around here to correct me on that... apparently there is also the facility to do it with an Emerald ECU, but im not sure that anyone has just yet.
Just had a reply from an enquiry I made about the cost etc of adding Traction Control. The sort of price for the kit plus extras and fitting comes to approx 1.5k, not bad if you ask me. They are at present adding the kit to a Tuscan Red Rose so it could be somebody on PHs. I would love to know the out come of it and I will keep intouch with the company to see how they get on.
I did the racelogic traction control onto Faisal's car out in san francisco 
.. I vowed never to fit it again .. nightmare from start to finish 
The DOS based inetrface was so user-unfriendly in the end i gave up and drove to racelogic to set it up .. which involved me driving the car along the dual carriagewy and it's roundabouts until I spun, then spun again, and again until the system was finalised.
I would imagine things have improved in the last 4 years though , and I'm pretty sure racelogic are on here so may well reply with all the latest tricks and tweaks in the current system .
When it was up and runing properly it was pretty good, but the car was then plauged with part throttle runing issues after fitting, the system appered to be modifying the injector signal to the 6 injectors used for cutting the fuel .. took me ages to find out why this was happening .. in the end it was cured by splicing injectors 4 and 8 into 3 and 7 through the TC also which meant the system wasn't working solely on single injector cuts on the rear 4 cylinders but was the only way it would work on that car, and then that totally cured the fuelling issue.
If someone can fit and set-up for 1500 pounds then jump at it if you think you want TC .. I lost out massively on the system I fitted. I think the key will be finding a place that's done it before (do RL only use approved fitting centres now??) which would make things a lot easier
I believe racing green fit racelogic systems to tuscans so they'd be my first port of call i think.
We're currently looking into the MBE ecu to find out if we can enable the TC in there .. initial launch control I suspect is a go-er but not sure about the TC. The emerald is TC enabled but I've not got a copy of the revised software to make that happen yet.
.. I vowed never to fit it again .. nightmare from start to finish The DOS based inetrface was so user-unfriendly in the end i gave up and drove to racelogic to set it up .. which involved me driving the car along the dual carriagewy and it's roundabouts until I spun, then spun again, and again until the system was finalised. I would imagine things have improved in the last 4 years though
, and I'm pretty sure racelogic are on here so may well reply with all the latest tricks and tweaks in the current system . When it was up and runing properly it was pretty good, but the car was then plauged with part throttle runing issues after fitting, the system appered to be modifying the injector signal to the 6 injectors used for cutting the fuel .. took me ages to find out why this was happening .. in the end it was cured by splicing injectors 4 and 8 into 3 and 7 through the TC also which meant the system wasn't working solely on single injector cuts on the rear 4 cylinders but was the only way it would work on that car, and then that totally cured the fuelling issue.
If someone can fit and set-up for 1500 pounds then jump at it if you think you want TC .. I lost out massively on the system I fitted. I think the key will be finding a place that's done it before (do RL only use approved fitting centres now??) which would make things a lot easier
I believe racing green fit racelogic systems to tuscans so they'd be my first port of call i think.
We're currently looking into the MBE ecu to find out if we can enable the TC in there .. initial launch control I suspect is a go-er but not sure about the TC. The emerald is TC enabled but I've not got a copy of the revised software to make that happen yet.
it's going to need it........The garage in question is a Japanese car specialist who also had a lot of problems with the system but has now just about cracked it and will be trying it out today. Not sure whether it’s the wheel speed sensors that are the problem in mating to the electronics but I am keeping my eye on the results and when I get back to the UK I will having a look at the system.
Tempted by Racelogic - seen it being fitted to 550bhp Moanaro were it make sense.
A good LSD should be good for most times and if just want to nail the throttle without it biting then what is the point.
V70 T5 I drive is a joke - you can just nail it out of corners and it lets you get away with it before giving you the power - where is the skill in that. TVR's are supposed to be a challenge!
A good LSD should be good for most times and if just want to nail the throttle without it biting then what is the point.
V70 T5 I drive is a joke - you can just nail it out of corners and it lets you get away with it before giving you the power - where is the skill in that. TVR's are supposed to be a challenge!
There are probably good TC's and bad one's. I used to have one (on a MINI!!!), and when the 110bhp threatened to break loose(!) it would literally cut 90% of power. If I weren't wearing a seatbelt then headbutting the steering wheel would ensue. I used to have it turned off all of the time. Completely rubbish it was.
I personally believe that people need to feel where the limits of traction are and frankly if you can't do this properly without something doing it for you then you shouldn't be pushing so hard. Apart from ABS, I think most driver aids make us lazy. Like the guy who reversed into me said, "You must have driven into me otherwise my reversing sensors would have beeped at me to warn me that you were there!" My response was, "Ue your mirrors mate and look over your shoulder."
I personally believe that people need to feel where the limits of traction are and frankly if you can't do this properly without something doing it for you then you shouldn't be pushing so hard. Apart from ABS, I think most driver aids make us lazy. Like the guy who reversed into me said, "You must have driven into me otherwise my reversing sensors would have beeped at me to warn me that you were there!" My response was, "Ue your mirrors mate and look over your shoulder."
That's true. But TC gives you protection against mistakes, and we all make them from time to time. I know a very experienced driver who almost wrote himself and car off while accelerating gently round a slip road, ironicaly it probably happened *because* he was driving gently in a high gear and if he'd been pressing on a little harder it probably wouldn't have happened. Personally, if I had TC it would be on on public roads and off for fun on the track. But I don't really have enough power to justify the cost and hassle to fit it to mine and get it working.
jellison said:
- your right foot is on the end of your leg for a reason (not a DELL!)
Same reaction I got from chris063 when we talked about it a few days ago. The only reason I thought about the possibility of TC is because of the amount of comments regarding the back end braking lose resulting in smashed cars. The first cerbera I ever drove ended its life that way (not my crash) which was a bloody shame. To be honest not sure whether I will be going the TC route but your comments are appreciated.
To be honest I reckon the £1k+ cost would be better spent on driver training, but then again I havent had to drive a Cerb when its icy and im yet to experience a decent TC system. Whenever I have driven the Cerbera in the wet though, as long as you dont take the 
, it seems quite able. Even when you exceed the limits of grip (flex your right foot mid corner slightly) it seems to behave in a very very predictable way. Which for a driver of my (in)ability, was very comforting indeed!!
The one on my car has only ever cut in after its been needed, or when trying to cross a junction on full throttle leaving me stranded in the middle of the road. Infact its finest moment came recently after I aquaplaned and spun off a roundabout. It killed power completely - after the spin - and left my pointing the wrong way down a dual carriageway for a good 30 seconds or so.
I personally hate Traction Control, but as I have said - im yet to try a decent system. ABS on the other hand is absolutelying fantastic!! Would love to have it on a Cerbera, the one on the smart is superb, you can feel it locking up just before it kicks in and in many cases react just before its intervention or allow it to work its magic (superb in a panic situation!)
, it seems quite able. Even when you exceed the limits of grip (flex your right foot mid corner slightly) it seems to behave in a very very predictable way. Which for a driver of my (in)ability, was very comforting indeed!! The one on my car has only ever cut in after its been needed, or when trying to cross a junction on full throttle leaving me stranded in the middle of the road. Infact its finest moment came recently after I aquaplaned and spun off a roundabout. It killed power completely - after the spin - and left my pointing the wrong way down a dual carriageway for a good 30 seconds or so.
I personally hate Traction Control, but as I have said - im yet to try a decent system. ABS on the other hand is absolutely
ing fantastic!! Would love to have it on a Cerbera, the one on the smart is superb, you can feel it locking up just before it kicks in and in many cases react just before its intervention or allow it to work its magic (superb in a panic situation!)what most people don't appreciate about a proper driver-orientated TC system is that it doesn't hinder playing with the back enf at all .. you can dial in when the safety net catches you, or switch the safety net off altogether if you want to be a real hooligan and don't mind spinning (because you will if you then go and play at the sorts of angles TC would allow you to but would be there to save you when your own talent runs out).
any mere mortal who thinks he's as quick without a properly set up TC as with is sadly mistaken, any mere mortal who thinks he's never going to be caught out by a lack of talent is also sadly mistaken.
TC doesn't kill the fun, doesn't make you a wuss but will improve the speed of you and your car combination and add to the safety.
it's a have cake and eat it situation, you've just got to make sure it's properly set-up and you know how to alter any settings in the unit to benefit you and your car.
I would say 1500pounds worth of TC is a much better way of making your car faster than 1500 pounds worth of conventional RV8 tuning ..
any mere mortal who thinks he's as quick without a properly set up TC as with is sadly mistaken, any mere mortal who thinks he's never going to be caught out by a lack of talent is also sadly mistaken.
TC doesn't kill the fun, doesn't make you a wuss but will improve the speed of you and your car combination and add to the safety.
it's a have cake and eat it situation, you've just got to make sure it's properly set-up and you know how to alter any settings in the unit to benefit you and your car.
I would say 1500pounds worth of TC is a much better way of making your car faster than 1500 pounds worth of conventional RV8 tuning ..
trackcar said:Indeed. You don't get F1 drivers (apart from Alesi) turning the TC off...
any mere mortal who thinks he's as quick without a properly set up TC as with is sadly mistaken, any mere mortal who thinks he's never going to be caught out by a lack of talent is also sadly mistaken.
carl_w said:
any mere mortal who thinks he's as quick without a properly set up TC as with is sadly mistaken, any mere mortal who thinks he's never going to be caught out by a lack of talent is also sadly mistaken.
Equally though, you dont get many F1 drivers who are in favour of traction control in the sport.
I'll agree a properly set up system should be far superior in reaction to a human and enable them to get some crazy angles without fear, but I cant help but think that "TC" stands for both Traction Control and Total Complacancy. When it becomes the latter, it becomes *EXTREMELY* dangerous IMHO.
>> Edited by BCA on Saturday 12th November 10:52
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