Discussion
I do not get to see many Ferraris here in Hungary and have just read the thread re replacement for 456. I thought the 550 was the replacement for the 456, am I wrong?
In a word, yes
You're right in that they're very similar and share a lot of the same bits. They are concurrent models though, and all the feedback I've had from the dealers is that both are set to be replaced by updated models in the next year or two.456mgt: interesting that you think both are to be replaced.
I guess the 575 was always only a mid-term warm-over of the 550, but would have thought they would have given it atleast 2 years, possibly more. I was actually looking to buy a 550 in the new year. Do you have any idea of timescale for replacement? Perhaps it might be better to hold off for a while if they are going to replace it soon.
In any case I've been having serious mental turmoil trying to choose between a 360 and 550. I know they are going to bring out a revision to the 360 next year, with larger / more powerful engine. I guess that will have a reasonable impactr on second hand values. Don't want to spend a lot of money and then 6 months later have an out of date car.
>> Edited by paulbellis on Monday 18th November 12:56
>> Edited by paulbellis on Monday 18th November 12:56
I guess the 575 was always only a mid-term warm-over of the 550, but would have thought they would have given it atleast 2 years, possibly more. I was actually looking to buy a 550 in the new year. Do you have any idea of timescale for replacement? Perhaps it might be better to hold off for a while if they are going to replace it soon.
In any case I've been having serious mental turmoil trying to choose between a 360 and 550. I know they are going to bring out a revision to the 360 next year, with larger / more powerful engine. I guess that will have a reasonable impactr on second hand values. Don't want to spend a lot of money and then 6 months later have an out of date car.
>> Edited by paulbellis on Monday 18th November 12:56
>> Edited by paulbellis on Monday 18th November 12:56
What the dealers have told me is that the next version of the 456 is due out end 2003, the 550/575M replacement due 2004. Seems to me that product cycle times are getting shorter generally, and the 456 is an outlier in that it's been going for over 8 years now.
I'm with Rich on the wait versus pounce question. If you follow this reasoning, you will always be waiting. The only other choice is to buy a car that is already a 'classic'.
I'm with Rich on the wait versus pounce question. If you follow this reasoning, you will always be waiting. The only other choice is to buy a car that is already a 'classic'.
Agreed. Always use this argument with the misses when she thinks I'm wasting money on other toys; PCs, plasma tv, DVD...etc.
Really just wanted to be re-assured I wasn't going to spend 100K on a car, only to find a completely new model just around the corner.
Unfortunately I'm still a little confused over the 550 vs 360 question. Seems the gap has narrowed between the models compared with the 355 vs 550.
I do a lot of trackdays, so guess the 360 would be better for that, but have a Caterham SLR which is generally faster around most tracks than both (retreats to a safe distance!!!) so probably want something as a fast road car / toy / weekends away. Always thought a V12 Ferrari was the ulitmate, but keep seeing 360's (live next to HROwen S. Ken.) and always think they look fabulous, and the noise......
Really just wanted to be re-assured I wasn't going to spend 100K on a car, only to find a completely new model just around the corner.
Unfortunately I'm still a little confused over the 550 vs 360 question. Seems the gap has narrowed between the models compared with the 355 vs 550.
I do a lot of trackdays, so guess the 360 would be better for that, but have a Caterham SLR which is generally faster around most tracks than both (retreats to a safe distance!!!) so probably want something as a fast road car / toy / weekends away. Always thought a V12 Ferrari was the ulitmate, but keep seeing 360's (live next to HROwen S. Ken.) and always think they look fabulous, and the noise......
Pick the car you want first.
The noise can be "added" later, as many of the posters on this board will confirm.
If you've got the caterham for trackdays I would forget the 360 (better than 550 on trackdays due to weight) and be very tempted with the V12 550 with Fiorano handling pack and a Tubi "enviroment enhancement" system.
DAZ
V12 :drool:
The noise can be "added" later, as many of the posters on this board will confirm.
If you've got the caterham for trackdays I would forget the 360 (better than 550 on trackdays due to weight) and be very tempted with the V12 550 with Fiorano handling pack and a Tubi "enviroment enhancement" system.
DAZ
V12 :drool:
Paul others on this board (Rich1231 springs to mind as the most recent) should be able to confirm the warranty situation.
As I understand it Ferrari dealers at first will tell you you're not covered and therefore try and persuade you not to get any aftermarket exhaust. What you as a purchaser do is threaten them that if the warranty won't cover a car with an upgraded exhaust you won't put £100k+ their way. This normally clears their thought process and they agree to the exhaust not affecting the warranty.
DAZ
(A porker owner restating what has been said by Ferrari & Tubi owners in the past). Note: Need to make more money before I can justify 2 supercars in the garage.
As I understand it Ferrari dealers at first will tell you you're not covered and therefore try and persuade you not to get any aftermarket exhaust. What you as a purchaser do is threaten them that if the warranty won't cover a car with an upgraded exhaust you won't put £100k+ their way. This normally clears their thought process and they agree to the exhaust not affecting the warranty.
DAZ
(A porker owner restating what has been said by Ferrari & Tubi owners in the past). Note: Need to make more money before I can justify 2 supercars in the garage.
Aaahh yes- 360 versus 550 is a tough call. They really are very different.
The 360 feels the more nimble, lightweight car. It seems to pivot right beneath the drivers' seat and makes a pretty fantastic noise with the appropriate aftermarket exhaust jobbie. It's a real adrenaline rush. Strangely enough, the car I had before my 360 was a Caterham SLR.
The 550 will feel a lot lighter than it really is, but you're aware that you're driving the heavier car, and that it's front engined. It is much better screwed together than the 360. More of a grown-ups car.
My benchmark for exhaust notes is the 355 and in this regard the V12s don't make as good a sound as the V8s. Incidentally, I don't buy any of that exhaust length/firing order crap as the reason for this Manu Customer demand more like.
Try a couple out and make your mind up. You will know pretty quickly I think. Not that I'm in any position to lecture on choosing between a V12 and a V8.
The 360 feels the more nimble, lightweight car. It seems to pivot right beneath the drivers' seat and makes a pretty fantastic noise with the appropriate aftermarket exhaust jobbie. It's a real adrenaline rush. Strangely enough, the car I had before my 360 was a Caterham SLR.
The 550 will feel a lot lighter than it really is, but you're aware that you're driving the heavier car, and that it's front engined. It is much better screwed together than the 360. More of a grown-ups car.
My benchmark for exhaust notes is the 355 and in this regard the V12s don't make as good a sound as the V8s. Incidentally, I don't buy any of that exhaust length/firing order crap as the reason for this Manu
Customer demand more like. Try a couple out and make your mind up. You will know pretty quickly I think. Not that I'm in any position to lecture on choosing between a V12 and a V8.
Guys please stop it you are making me drool all over my keyboard... can anyone lend me a few quid for a ferrari fund 
...... saw 550 on track at Goodwood today, respect to the guy for trackdaying it but it sounded like a Mondeo from the pit wall. The 355 blasting past was a lot lot better- so good in fact i got to go out with him for a session 
Great fun and thank you very much freindly owner, but he was having problems with cooking his brakes and he wasnt really going brain out fast.
oh almost forgot the whole reason for this post was to say to our Hungarian thread starter ref 456 & 550. The 456 is a 4 seater the 550 a 2 seater (which I actually diddnt know till kev- 456mgt pointed it out at a Virgina waters meet)
>> Edited by iguana on Monday 18th November 19:39
...... saw 550 on track at Goodwood today, respect to the guy for trackdaying it but it sounded like a Mondeo from the pit wall. The 355 blasting past was a lot lot better- so good in fact i got to go out with him for a session Great fun and thank you very much freindly owner, but he was having problems with cooking his brakes and he wasnt really going brain out fast. oh almost forgot the whole reason for this post was to say to our Hungarian thread starter ref 456 & 550. The 456 is a 4 seater the 550 a 2 seater (which I actually diddnt know till kev- 456mgt pointed it out at a Virgina waters meet)
>> Edited by iguana on Monday 18th November 19:39
Ben unwell today.. hence low PH profile.
In my very humble opinion the 360 VS 550 debate can be rephrased thus:
Ultimate Sports Car VS True Exotic...
New prices/running costs/production numbers make that clear in my opinion
After a Maranello or a 456 the V8 Ferraris feel, in my opinion, a bit toylike... interior/build quality/engine(read torque)/road presence/and even exclusivity (and yes for around £150K it DOES matter to me)..... the V8s don't have that V12 "thing."
Now the 360 is a total weapon (in the right hands) and the 355 is probably the prettiest car to have come from Maranello after the 288GTO.. these are GREAT cars which I adore but forget this "consumate GT" nonsense the journos talk - it's bullsh!t - the 550/575M is a SUPERCAR - full fat V12 500+hp rear wheel drive BEAST... and to hell with light weight when you've got an engine that delivers almost 200hp at 2500rpm.... BRUTE FORCE is used to deliver thrills... (kind of like another car I love which is the old Aston Martin V8 Vantage V600 - makes the Vanquish seem pathetic really).
Re - 456 - this is Ferraris Bentley... sexy, FAST, classy, comfy, and BEAUTIFUL and since that day when Kevin gave it large with me, ninja AND ajay all in it sitting comfortably, I reckon it bloody handles awesomely too... Can't wait to see how Ferrari do the replacement.
PS. Kev - We know how to make em howl a la F355 too... After much deliberation and experimentation this is what we do... We replace the "central exhaust mixer node" (Ferrari language for central silencer) with a custom crossover and then replace the rear silencers with special order Tubi "Y-tube pipe-only solo" exhausts... The result is not for the faint of heart... but it sounds like a Daytona.
>> Edited by manu on Monday 18th November 21:25
In my very humble opinion the 360 VS 550 debate can be rephrased thus:
Ultimate Sports Car VS True Exotic...
New prices/running costs/production numbers make that clear in my opinion
After a Maranello or a 456 the V8 Ferraris feel, in my opinion, a bit toylike... interior/build quality/engine(read torque)/road presence/and even exclusivity (and yes for around £150K it DOES matter to me)..... the V8s don't have that V12 "thing."
Now the 360 is a total weapon (in the right hands) and the 355 is probably the prettiest car to have come from Maranello after the 288GTO.. these are GREAT cars which I adore but forget this "consumate GT" nonsense the journos talk - it's bullsh!t - the 550/575M is a SUPERCAR - full fat V12 500+hp rear wheel drive BEAST... and to hell with light weight when you've got an engine that delivers almost 200hp at 2500rpm.... BRUTE FORCE is used to deliver thrills... (kind of like another car I love which is the old Aston Martin V8 Vantage V600 - makes the Vanquish seem pathetic really).
Re - 456 - this is Ferraris Bentley... sexy, FAST, classy, comfy, and BEAUTIFUL and since that day when Kevin gave it large with me, ninja AND ajay all in it sitting comfortably, I reckon it bloody handles awesomely too... Can't wait to see how Ferrari do the replacement.
PS. Kev - We know how to make em howl a la F355 too... After much deliberation and experimentation this is what we do... We replace the "central exhaust mixer node" (Ferrari language for central silencer) with a custom crossover and then replace the rear silencers with special order Tubi "Y-tube pipe-only solo" exhausts... The result is not for the faint of heart... but it sounds like a Daytona.
>> Edited by manu on Monday 18th November 21:25
Manu's right about the V8s feeling toylike after you've been in a V12, though your SLR must be a bit like driving round in a 1/3rd scale model Paul. The other thing, and this may sound odd, is that they even smell different- leather and exhaust smells are quite distinctive. Blindfold me and put earmuffs on, and I could still tell you which is which.
And have you noticed how many of Manu's solutions involve replacing various bits with straight pipes? Funny that, eh
I daresay it does sound like a Daytona, but how many of them precisely?
Kevin
PS Manu hope you're OK now.
And have you noticed how many of Manu's solutions involve replacing various bits with straight pipes? Funny that, eh
I daresay it does sound like a Daytona, but how many of them precisely? Kevin
PS Manu hope you're OK now.
The 550 vs 360 debate
Personally I think its very difficult to compare them as they are completely different animals. Its a personal preference thing at the end of the day. Once you have driven both as Kev has pointed out, you will know straight away. I changed from a 355 to a 550 because I just HAD to have/try a V12 and I also like the "Gentlemens Club" type feeling of the 550's interior. The 550 is a GT which embodies all the traditions and values of the great GT Ferrari's of the past.
The only real solution to this problem is to take the Kev route and have both a V12 and V8
Frostie
Personally I think its very difficult to compare them as they are completely different animals. Its a personal preference thing at the end of the day. Once you have driven both as Kev has pointed out, you will know straight away. I changed from a 355 to a 550 because I just HAD to have/try a V12 and I also like the "Gentlemens Club" type feeling of the 550's interior. The 550 is a GT which embodies all the traditions and values of the great GT Ferrari's of the past.
The only real solution to this problem is to take the Kev route and have both a V12 and V8
Frostie
manu said: and to hell with light weight when you've got an engine that delivers almost 200hp at 2500rpm.... BRUTE FORCE is used to deliver thrills...
I don't agree Manu.Especially in this time dominated by 500 hp mega-accelerating saloons, the true competitive advantage of a supersportcar as the 550/575, is its dynamic competence, its nimbleness and responsiveness.
Keeping the weight down is a must to achieve this dynamic goal and to retain a true and real edge on the fast but dull supersaloons.
To count on brute force, as you say, to deliver the thrills is a very dangerous route, and one that I hope Ferrari will never take.
But I'm very glad to hear that you've managed to make the V12 scream, since if the replacement of the 575 will have an aluminum chassis I'll probably go the V12 route myself...
>> Edited by LG1 on Tuesday 19th November 08:38
Aaah Luigi (I remember fondly our battles on Ferrarichat about the same subect ) - I do sort of, agree with you, but then the Murcielago weighs in at an ACTUAL 1800kg and has been winning praise from almost everyone...
More importantly it depends what kind of thrill you're after, I reckon. As I said before the old V8 Vantage was not about lightness and nimbleness - it was about FORCE - I think the 550/575 have a similar performance philosophy but are also incredibly agile too... the "experience" is different somewhere in between.... I would never commend a 1600kg V8 Ferrari (that would be terrible) but on the V12s where the engine is so strong, at least for now, it's fine. If they can build a V12 which weighs 1550kg with around 580hp then that I suppose would be ideal.
P.S. Incidentally, was looking at the lastest copy of Forza (THANKS MARANELLOUK!!) which had the "digi-tec 360" featured - that exhaust is a Tubi.. not a ahem "digi-tec." Also did you know straight pipes are a better solution for those wishing to eliminate cabin resonance (its true Kev - I mean it!).
P.P.S Dazren - when are you going to get a Ferrari? It's just a matter of time you know! No seriously, I know a couple of dealers that have some right bargains at the mo and I can introd......
) - I do sort of, agree with you, but then the Murcielago weighs in at an ACTUAL 1800kg and has been winning praise from almost everyone... More importantly it depends what kind of thrill you're after, I reckon. As I said before the old V8 Vantage was not about lightness and nimbleness - it was about FORCE - I think the 550/575 have a similar performance philosophy but are also incredibly agile too... the "experience" is different somewhere in between.... I would never commend a 1600kg V8 Ferrari (that would be terrible) but on the V12s where the engine is so strong, at least for now, it's fine. If they can build a V12 which weighs 1550kg with around 580hp then that I suppose would be ideal.
P.S. Incidentally, was looking at the lastest copy of Forza (THANKS MARANELLOUK!!) which had the "digi-tec 360" featured - that exhaust is a Tubi.. not a ahem "digi-tec." Also did you know straight pipes are a better solution for those wishing to eliminate cabin resonance (its true Kev - I mean it!
). P.P.S Dazren - when are you going to get a Ferrari? It's just a matter of time you know! No seriously, I know a couple of dealers that have some right bargains at the mo and I can introd......
The ideals behind the 550 and the 360 are very different!
The 550 is a luxurious Rapid GT can cover vast distances in speed,style and grace looks best in my opinion in F1 Silver exterior /Red Leather.
The 360 is a luxuriious Quick Sportscar and in convertable form the no. 1 pausers [probably spelt wrong]car and i makes a fabulous noise looks best in my opinion as in spyder F1 Mid Red Exterior/Cream interior.
In the end choosing between them is like choosing between a mouse and a keyboard, the keyboard has more buttons but the mouse is nimbler.
Personally i would have a 360 - Pauser thing!
The 550 is a luxurious Rapid GT can cover vast distances in speed,style and grace looks best in my opinion in F1 Silver exterior /Red Leather.
The 360 is a luxuriious Quick Sportscar and in convertable form the no. 1 pausers [probably spelt wrong]car and i makes a fabulous noise looks best in my opinion as in spyder F1 Mid Red Exterior/Cream interior.
In the end choosing between them is like choosing between a mouse and a keyboard, the keyboard has more buttons but the mouse is nimbler.
Personally i would have a 360 - Pauser thing!
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