Shooting animals
Discussion
I got talking to a guy who shoots rabbits this week. Ive met a dozen such people over the years, and for the first time I asked the question:
'Of the ones you hit, how many dont drop dead and run away'
2/10 he said. Even if you are out 'just culling' the ineffective nature of the gun makes it seem rather cruel to me.
'Of the ones you hit, how many dont drop dead and run away'
2/10 he said. Even if you are out 'just culling' the ineffective nature of the gun makes it seem rather cruel to me.
Surely some depends on what type of shooting you do. Trying to stifle a dog near you while you take aim means you have to be quite a very long way away from the rabbit.
An air rifle is pretty damned accurate over about 25-30m, all shots will fall in about the size of an egg, and the rabbits I shoot about 30-40 this year have pretty much all fallen over kicked their feet for 20 seconds with a vacant look on their faces and then stopped.
Shooting at 40m for me gives a splay pattern of a tea cup saucer, which isn't a clean shot if you want to kill something. So when I say it depends what type of shooting you do it depends on how far and how much pain and suffering you are happy to inflict. If I wait for a rabbit to get 30m or less its unlikely to suffer much, if I wait and it doesn't look like its going to come that close at what point do you make the decision to fire at it.
Wost of all is a shotgun, which is a pretty indescriminate weapon unless quite close. Best would be rimfire, but ridiculously difficult to justify in this country.
An air rifle is pretty damned accurate over about 25-30m, all shots will fall in about the size of an egg, and the rabbits I shoot about 30-40 this year have pretty much all fallen over kicked their feet for 20 seconds with a vacant look on their faces and then stopped.
Shooting at 40m for me gives a splay pattern of a tea cup saucer, which isn't a clean shot if you want to kill something. So when I say it depends what type of shooting you do it depends on how far and how much pain and suffering you are happy to inflict. If I wait for a rabbit to get 30m or less its unlikely to suffer much, if I wait and it doesn't look like its going to come that close at what point do you make the decision to fire at it.
Wost of all is a shotgun, which is a pretty indescriminate weapon unless quite close. Best would be rimfire, but ridiculously difficult to justify in this country.
What about a good old shotgun with rock salt. Shoot when in range. And the rabbit quite simply doesnt exist (except a blood smear) after youve pulled the trigger.
Painless, you dont have any rabbits with infected wounds taking weeks to die, and it'll seperate the pelt/meat gatherers from those with genuine culling intentions pretty fast.
Painless, you dont have any rabbits with infected wounds taking weeks to die, and it'll seperate the pelt/meat gatherers from those with genuine culling intentions pretty fast.
It's quite common for them to get their arse full of lead and not die. However, they are wild animals, and due to human action and intervention in their food chain, they DO breed to excess in certain areas.
Ie, farmers remove foxes in excess, and provide alternate food for them in the case of sheep, lambs and chickens etc.
It's then highly likely rabbits over-populate. You can either kill them relatively humanely, disesase them, or breed foxes to kill them.
Of all the methods, shooting is by far the most effective. A small .22 rifle is about the best, while lamping on an evening.
Worst is possibly long range shotgunning when you know you can't get them but try anyway.
Either way, I'd prefer to be shot to be killed than eaten slowly by a fox the size of an elephant (relative to me)...
Dave
Ie, farmers remove foxes in excess, and provide alternate food for them in the case of sheep, lambs and chickens etc.
It's then highly likely rabbits over-populate. You can either kill them relatively humanely, disesase them, or breed foxes to kill them.
Of all the methods, shooting is by far the most effective. A small .22 rifle is about the best, while lamping on an evening.
Worst is possibly long range shotgunning when you know you can't get them but try anyway.
Either way, I'd prefer to be shot to be killed than eaten slowly by a fox the size of an elephant (relative to me)...
Dave
Julian64 said:
Wost of all is a shotgun, which is a pretty indescriminate weapon unless quite close. Best would be rimfire, but ridiculously difficult to justify in this country.
Not necessarily true. My long-barrelled .410 is one of the most effective rabbit killing weapons ever. Thing is, it's uneconomic, wasting cartridges on rabbits. So I went back to using an air rifle instead.
All academic now. Haven't shot anything live in years, since moving to London.
Julian64 said:
Surely some depends on what type of shooting you do. Trying to stifle a dog near you while you take aim means you have to be quite a very long way away from the rabbit.
An air rifle is pretty damned accurate over about 25-30m, all shots will fall in about the size of an egg, and the rabbits I shoot about 30-40 this year have pretty much all fallen over kicked their feet for 20 seconds with a vacant look on their faces and then stopped.
Shooting at 40m for me gives a splay pattern of a tea cup saucer, which isn't a clean shot if you want to kill something. So when I say it depends what type of shooting you do it depends on how far and how much pain and suffering you are happy to inflict. If I wait for a rabbit to get 30m or less its unlikely to suffer much, if I wait and it doesn't look like its going to come that close at what point do you make the decision to fire at it.
Wost of all is a shotgun, which is a pretty indescriminate weapon unless quite close. Best would be rimfire, but ridiculously difficult to justify in this country.
I won't shoot game with an Airifle as i've never believed it is deadly enough. .22 rim fire with a scope and you can pop them off like cans..
Shotgun is most effective if you are moving around i find.
BOOM!..
simpo two said:
>> Edited by simpo two on Friday 9th December 17:08
I'll see you that and raise you this:
Seriously...as long as you know what you're doing, are skilled enough and shoot to within the limitations of your weapon, the death a wild animal will suffer at your hands will be a damn sight more humane than they would at the hands of mother nature.
AlexH said:Praps. Id like to give it a go. Love guns, love shooting. Just didnt realise that letting 2/10 rabbits limp off carrying a fleshwound full of lead was the most humane way to go about it
>> Edited by simpo two on Friday 9th December 17:08
I'll see you that and raise you this:
Seriously...as long as you know what you're doing, are skilled enough and shoot to within the limitations of your weapon, the death a wild animal will suffer at your hands will be a damn sight more humane than they would at the hands of mother nature.
Ive never owned a real gun, but had a mate whose dad had his own private armoury with every legal weapon imaginable... he said the shotgun was the most fun, and didnt bring suffering to the critters he shot at a close enough range. The chap I spoke to is licenced to carry a modded air rifle, 800+fps but I got the impression he shoots for sport.
UKBob said:
What about a good old shotgun with rock salt. Shoot when in range. And the rabbit quite simply doesnt exist (except a blood smear) after youve pulled the trigger.
Painless, you dont have any rabbits with infected wounds taking weeks to die, and it'll seperate the pelt/meat gatherers from those with genuine culling intentions pretty fast.
Eh? Are you saying that rock salt is harder than the steel shot in cartridges?
AND... put SALT in my metal gun? Are you MAD? It's not a TVR.
Also I don't understand the bit about meat gatherers and cullers either? Are you saying it's worse to cull vermin or to eat what you kill?
Who cares it's a rabbit, it's not like they have feelings.
and a .22 to kill rabbits? I wouldn't trust them to kill an ant.
whats the matter afraid to use a real weapon, it's not like they are illegal or anything
my rule of thumb is, if the projectile is the size of the targets head then it will probably be effective in causing immediate death/obliteration
and a .22 to kill rabbits? I wouldn't trust them to kill an ant.
whats the matter afraid to use a real weapon, it's not like they are illegal or anything
my rule of thumb is, if the projectile is the size of the targets head then it will probably be effective in causing immediate death/obliteration
R988 said:
Who cares it's a rabbit, it's not like they have feelings.
and a .22 to kill rabbits? I wouldn't trust them to kill an ant.
whats the matter afraid to use a real weapon, it's not like they are illegal or anything
my rule of thumb is, if the projectile is the size of the targets head then it will probably be effective in causing immediate death/obliteration
Well that's crap, the helicopter would scare the rabbits... and you'd need to put some cammo netting around that table... WHITE indeed!
blueyes said:Rock salt. Im sure someone more knowlegable will correct, but at close range it disentegrates the target, meaning there is nothing left.
What about a good old shotgun with rock salt. Shoot when in range. And the rabbit quite simply doesnt exist (except a blood smear) after youve pulled the trigger.
Painless, you dont have any rabbits with infected wounds taking weeks to die, and it'll seperate the pelt/meat gatherers from those with genuine culling intentions pretty fast.
Eh? Are you saying that rock salt is harder than the steel shot in cartridges?
AND... put SALT in my metal gun? Are you MAD? It's not a TVR.
Also I don't understand the bit about meat gatherers and cullers either? Are you saying it's worse to cull vermin or to eat what you kill?
as for shooting rabbits, Ill be honest. Id never shoot an animal just for sport. But I would shoot if the sole purpose was to cull the population down. Im not sure whether Id want to spend an afternoon shooting though, if my shots wernt killing every time and I left a trail of half deal animals in my wake.
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