Audi S3/Seat Leon Cupra R
Discussion
Which one would you choose?
Obviously they have the same engine, with the difference being that the Audi has the 4wd system. I'm guessing that the Audi is going to be more expensive to service etc. Does one tend to break down more than the other and will the Audi cost more to repair? I've read about the common faults such as coil packs etc but are they generally reliable? Mixed views here.
Anybody had one?
Obviously they have the same engine, with the difference being that the Audi has the 4wd system. I'm guessing that the Audi is going to be more expensive to service etc. Does one tend to break down more than the other and will the Audi cost more to repair? I've read about the common faults such as coil packs etc but are they generally reliable? Mixed views here.
Anybody had one?
I had a 2001 (51) plate Audi S3 with 225bhp, which was a lovely car. I did 25,000 miles in a year without any problems. Servicing is fairly expensive at a main dealers but they do have fairly good gaps between services.
Only negative is that the steering doesn't have much feel, which is why I went back to an old 911.
Only negative is that the steering doesn't have much feel, which is why I went back to an old 911.
Hi,
Spent some time looking at both myself (as a poss Puma replacement)in terms of what you get for your money then the Seat probably wins, it will also be cheaper to service (no 4wd system) and no inflated Audi labour rates, assuming main dealers for both..
S3 is bolted together better, has the edge when it comes to handling and will hold its value better over time.
Me, I've gone off on a tangent and am looking for a WRX.
Enjoy looking
Spent some time looking at both myself (as a poss Puma replacement)in terms of what you get for your money then the Seat probably wins, it will also be cheaper to service (no 4wd system) and no inflated Audi labour rates, assuming main dealers for both..
S3 is bolted together better, has the edge when it comes to handling and will hold its value better over time.
Me, I've gone off on a tangent and am looking for a WRX.
Enjoy looking
I'd go for the S3 every time...but I had/have 3 A3's (one an S3). IMHO the fit and finish is that little bit better, the interior is better, and the 4wd helps put the power down.
They look better too IMHO.
FWIW, my 51 plate 225bhp model did jsut shy of 40,000 miles last year with two services and nothing else other than a set of boots.
They look better too IMHO.
FWIW, my 51 plate 225bhp model did jsut shy of 40,000 miles last year with two services and nothing else other than a set of boots.
Well i doubt i would use main dealers for servicing anyway.
I too prefer the interior of the S3, seats look nice too. Glad to hear some people have had trouble free motoring with them, when you read forums you only hear when things go wrong, making them sound un-reliable.
Would love an old 911, but i wouldnt really know what i was looking at when buying one, and i'm sure their hard and expensive to maintain.
Anyone think of any other cars which i could add to the list to look at? Around £10k ish. Anything with some poke really.
I too prefer the interior of the S3, seats look nice too. Glad to hear some people have had trouble free motoring with them, when you read forums you only hear when things go wrong, making them sound un-reliable.
Would love an old 911, but i wouldnt really know what i was looking at when buying one, and i'm sure their hard and expensive to maintain.
Anyone think of any other cars which i could add to the list to look at? Around £10k ish. Anything with some poke really.
skippy66 said:
Anyone think of any other cars which i could add to the list to look at? Around £10k ish. Anything with some poke really.
Skoda Octavia vRS and a trip to Jabbasport/AMD etc
Early Evo 5/6? Not sure what model would be in your price range
Impreza WRX
Supra TT
Saab 9-3 Aero/Viggen (With the rescue pack to sort out the torque steer)
BMW M3
Clio 182
Megane 225 (Might not be in the price range)
skippy66,we looked at both in o3 ,we were dissapointed with how noisy the s3 was + cost were a issue ended up with a brand new cupra r for the price of a 3 year old s3 ...it has been superb with no issues the engine has audi labels all over it !! its had a full set of wheels on warrenty because of some laquer peeling off one wheel !!!! it has done 22000 miles in 3 years and has been great fun in the dry its as quick as a wrx , in the wet its bloody scary but a laugh to drive , being a 5 door its been very practical and you cannot miss the bright yellow in a car park !!we have to sell it now because we are going to get a ford st (wife loves it ) but i have to say i will miss it when its gone !!!
don,t think it is any noisyer than any of the hot hatch brigade , it is not wind noise so must be the exhaust note i suppose its got a pretty large exhaust so its going to sound racey we thought it was quiter than a s3 just been in for service today good job from stoneacre of peterborough , they are going to change both the back shocks as one of them has a small leak and a split driveshaft cv boot all under warranty , they even gave it a wash ( ford/audi dealers take note !!!)
All the 1.8t engines are quite noisy (sound like a bag of bolts on cold start) the noise is ok for me in my 2000 S3 and I've done 45,000 miles in two years. Road noise can be bad depending on tyres and it's probably the most comfortable car I've driven lots of miles in, never get home with back / neck ache etc.
The haldex quattro system is very very good in my opinion, I do however find the car is more fun to drive when it's pissing with rain. I don't think there is much that can beat the S3 for price / safety / performance / quality / practicality etc.
I have had more problems and costs than anyone I know but I've still kept the car as I can't see anything that is better all round! Can you get a CTR for the money you've got to spend as that was my only other choice when I got mine!
The haldex quattro system is very very good in my opinion, I do however find the car is more fun to drive when it's pissing with rain. I don't think there is much that can beat the S3 for price / safety / performance / quality / practicality etc.
I have had more problems and costs than anyone I know but I've still kept the car as I can't see anything that is better all round! Can you get a CTR for the money you've got to spend as that was my only other choice when I got mine!
I do find the tyre noise and wind noise at speed more that some other cars I have been in but generally it's not an issue, just turn up the BOSE stereo 
Never had any problems with mine and it's pretty darn fast now that I have visited the nice people at AmD. I can't think of another car that can match it for build quality/speed/comfort/practicality/reliability/class.
Never had any problems with mine and it's pretty darn fast now that I have visited the nice people at AmD. I can't think of another car that can match it for build quality/speed/comfort/practicality/reliability/class.
Hmm, I'd be tempted to avoid both of them, and depending upon your requirements follow the Scooby advice, or perhaps something else if depending upon your performance/practicality criteria.
Both are based on a Mk4 Golf chassis so handling will always be poor, in the LCR getting some OKish handling out of the chassis means the suspension has almost no play whatsoever, to the point that you will lose teeth over expansion gaps and uneven surfaces, which over in the UK means most roads. This was one of the key reasons for selling mine, as for what it was the setup was just too uncomfortable.
Also IMO the Leon looks quite dated now (and did so even before the model was released), this combined with the shiny black plastic interior is starting to make the car look a lot older than it actually is - this seems to be a side effect of the more leading edge designs from the French, Spanish and Italian manufacturers, as while often pretty when released, they don't date well.
The Audi gains from the fact that beyond the new Rover/Audi grille on the new model they've not moved the game that far forward in design terms, so the older car doesn't look too outdated.
The 1.8T (in 210 or 225 tune) though is a very good engine and performs strongly, although with little aural excitement, compared to the CTR the delivery is so smooth with plenty of torque compared to the VTEC, difference being enough IMO to judge them as a different class of car, as the CTR demands you stay on the power band to have fun. Such is the difference that if you drove them back to back with listening to the engine you'd actually think the CTR had a turbo and the LCR was normally aspirated, such is the delivery of power inn each of them.
Paint quality on my LCR was also a major issue, I had mine (red) for 7 months and did something like 9k miles, at which point it had 12 stone-ships down to the metal, SEAT Customer Service is Milton Keynes weren't interested, even
when I mentioned "fit for purpose" and despite me finding numerous other reports of paint quality issues they wouldn't acknowledge it without me paying for investigations to be done (as these involved firing ball bearings at the paint to ascertain its quality I was slightly worried, as if they did decide it was "OK" then I'd have to foot the bill for that too). Having took it to a dealer they ackowledged that it was quite normal and they'd seen a few cars like it.
The Focus ST is however far better than either of these two, I found a site selling brand new ST2 5-door for £15k, so you could possibly get the base 3-door ST1 for £13.5 with a bit of searching, or wait a few months when any ST1s will have dropped in price considerably (dealers are advising customers not to buy the ST1 due to its low spec), then you'll have a far better handling and far more pratical car to play with.
Alternative look at anything with the MkV Golf chassis, as even the Touran which uses it handles better than the old MkIV cars!
Both are based on a Mk4 Golf chassis so handling will always be poor, in the LCR getting some OKish handling out of the chassis means the suspension has almost no play whatsoever, to the point that you will lose teeth over expansion gaps and uneven surfaces, which over in the UK means most roads. This was one of the key reasons for selling mine, as for what it was the setup was just too uncomfortable.
Also IMO the Leon looks quite dated now (and did so even before the model was released), this combined with the shiny black plastic interior is starting to make the car look a lot older than it actually is - this seems to be a side effect of the more leading edge designs from the French, Spanish and Italian manufacturers, as while often pretty when released, they don't date well.
The Audi gains from the fact that beyond the new Rover/Audi grille on the new model they've not moved the game that far forward in design terms, so the older car doesn't look too outdated.
The 1.8T (in 210 or 225 tune) though is a very good engine and performs strongly, although with little aural excitement, compared to the CTR the delivery is so smooth with plenty of torque compared to the VTEC, difference being enough IMO to judge them as a different class of car, as the CTR demands you stay on the power band to have fun. Such is the difference that if you drove them back to back with listening to the engine you'd actually think the CTR had a turbo and the LCR was normally aspirated, such is the delivery of power inn each of them.
Paint quality on my LCR was also a major issue, I had mine (red) for 7 months and did something like 9k miles, at which point it had 12 stone-ships down to the metal, SEAT Customer Service is Milton Keynes weren't interested, even
when I mentioned "fit for purpose" and despite me finding numerous other reports of paint quality issues they wouldn't acknowledge it without me paying for investigations to be done (as these involved firing ball bearings at the paint to ascertain its quality I was slightly worried, as if they did decide it was "OK" then I'd have to foot the bill for that too). Having took it to a dealer they ackowledged that it was quite normal and they'd seen a few cars like it.
The Focus ST is however far better than either of these two, I found a site selling brand new ST2 5-door for £15k, so you could possibly get the base 3-door ST1 for £13.5 with a bit of searching, or wait a few months when any ST1s will have dropped in price considerably (dealers are advising customers not to buy the ST1 due to its low spec), then you'll have a far better handling and far more pratical car to play with.
Alternative look at anything with the MkV Golf chassis, as even the Touran which uses it handles better than the old MkIV cars!
To be honest i dont think the noise will too much of an issue as i currently drive a rev3 MR2 Turbo, which isnt quiet.
I'm not very keen on the Civic type r, looks or interior and i dont like where the gear knob is. Also i dont really fancy a scooby. Other car which i considered is a BMW 330ci.
I personally think the leon looks alright, dont think its dated already. The Focus is out of my price range, although they do sound good.
I thought the S3 and leon would of had a bit of a push in the back, although i realise that the S3 is a heavy car and also suffers 4WD transmission losses, is it full time 4WD?
I'm not very keen on the Civic type r, looks or interior and i dont like where the gear knob is. Also i dont really fancy a scooby. Other car which i considered is a BMW 330ci.
I personally think the leon looks alright, dont think its dated already. The Focus is out of my price range, although they do sound good.
I thought the S3 and leon would of had a bit of a push in the back, although i realise that the S3 is a heavy car and also suffers 4WD transmission losses, is it full time 4WD?
skippy66 said:Can understand your point of view on the CTR, driving what looks like an MPV in wolf's clothing doesn't appeal to me. Now the 330, that would be a good car, RWD, creamy inline six engine and near as dammit 50/50 weight distribution, but likely quite expensive...
To be honest i dont think the noise will too much of an issue as i currently drive a rev3 MR2 Turbo, which isnt quiet.
I'm not very keen on the Civic type r, looks or interior and i dont like where the gear knob is. Also i dont really fancy a scooby. Other car which i considered is a BMW 330ci.
I personally think the leon looks alright, dont think its dated already. The Focus is out of my price range, although they do sound good.
I thought the S3 and leon would of had a bit of a push in the back, although i realise that the S3 is a heavy car and also suffers 4WD transmission losses, is it full time 4WD?
The dated looks of the Leon are my personal opinion, used to think they looked the business, but now the basic models without big wheels and body addenda don't do anything for me.
The S3 is like most Audis is FWD biased and directs power to the rear if traction is lost, but I'd imagine that would be at best 50%. The Leon weighs in at 1320Kg unladen (170 bhp/tonne), while the S3 is 1420 (158.45 hbp/tonne), so the extra 100Kg for the four wheel drive system drags it back quite a bit, although the traction of its 4WD system makes the 0-60 times about the same.
The Leon gives a gentle push when you rag it, but because of the smooth delivery it is not major league exciting, coming from your MR2 its not going to do it for you in a bit way I'd say.
greatgranny said:
BMW 330ci everytime.
Great engine, RWD, well made, nice interior etc.
Only downside is the reputation but personally it wouldn't bother me.
Got to agree with that-you would probably get a lower mileage 325i for that money. I don't like the image but do love the build quality, sound, inetrior and most of well sorted rear wheel rive handling!
However, if it must be hatch then I'd go for a Golf GTI for £6-7k with the heated leather recaros and spend the change from 10k beefing up suspension, brakes, chip,exhaust and other goodies to make it just like a Cupra but with a great interior!!
Theres a lovely dark grey 5door on Autotrader with 50k and full sh, leather recaros etc for only £5995...
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