Starter too much or something else ?

[TeGriffic]

On a 4.3 BV Griff. I have a battery only 6 months old and a recent recon Alternator (Marelli). I have recently replaced the starter (a Marelli 1.4kw) with another Marelli, the latter being 1.7kw. The engine turns over very slowly, same as you would get if the battery was a bit flat.

Is it likely that replacing a 1.4kw with a 1.7kw is making the difference ?

The volt meter reads 14.5 and, with the headlights on and the heating on full pelt reads 13.5 – not unreasonable to me. When I turn on the ignition prior to starting the car from cold, the volts read 11 – 13.

I’d be interested in any views before I change the starter back to the old one.

Thanks.

[GreenV8S]

what is the difference between the two starts? Do they have similar torque characteristics? The fact that one has a higher power rating doesn't necessarily mean it will turn the engine over faster.

[griffsmith]

I would have thought changing to a 1.7 Kw motor would usually allow it to spin the engine faster provided there was sufficient power in the battery or that it is getting to the motor ok! My 1.4Kw marelli motor was recently changed for a bosch 1.7 and it certainly made mine spin much faster indeed!!

Although I understand why you did the battery test the way you did but surely the power drain from the lights and fan would be well below the 1.7Kw from the starter. it is just possible the extra drain from the starter over your old one is showing up a weakness else where probably your battery.

since the motor was changed was it always slow or has it got slower since? what about trying another battery before trying anything else? your welcome to pop over some time to try my battery. alternatively use jump leads from another car. if it spins up better it would suggest the battery. however unless you take your current battery out of the loop then it could be causing a drain itself if the cells are damaged.. Leven have just got a battery drop tester if you were passing!

[v8 racing]

like griff smith said did you change the starter because it was turning over slow? if this is the case i would be looking for a bad earth on the battery as this is quite a common problem!! i would leave your original earths on but run a new one just to the engine, as the normal earth runs through the chassis first, just try this you could get some jump leads and conect the earth from the battery to the engine and see what happens!!

[TeGriffic]

Thanks. Well Leven tested the battery and it's ok and have taken the cut off switch out of the loop. Went down to the garage this morning and the battery was so flat that it wouldn't even prime up the fuel pump by the sounds of it. Jumped her from a power box, then took her for a run. Voltmeter reads 14.5 when the engine is running. Got back turned the engine off. Switched on the ignition (but didn't start it) and the voltmeter read 13 (which I'd say isn't too bad pure battery current).

Turned her over again and she really struggled to start, when the starter is turning the voltmeter drops to zero straight away. So I'm thinking (a) the bigger starter is wanting too much current (?) but then I'm thinking maybe I have an earth contacting because the battery seems to be draining.

Or, perhaps when I stop the car to open the garage and then restart it, the starter is just drawing so much that it leaves the battery so low that a week later it's can't turn the starter over.



>> Edited by TeGriffic on Sunday 5th March 15:12

[old64er]

TeGriffic said:

Thanks. Well Leven tested the battery and it's ok and have taken the cut off switch out of the loop. Went down to the garage this morning and the battery was so flat that it wouldn't even prime up the fuel pump by the sounds of it. Jumped her from a power box, then took her for a run. Voltmeter reads 14.5 when the engine is running. Got back turned the engine off. Switched on the ignition (but didn't start it) and the voltmeter read 13 (which I'd say isn't too bad pure battery current). Turned her over again and she really struggled to start, when the starter is turning the voltmeter drops to zero straight away. So I'm thinking (a) the bigger starter is wanting too much current (?) but then I'm thinking maybe I have an earth contacting because the battery seems to be draining. Or, perhaps when I stop the car to open the garage and then restart it, the starter is just drawing so much that it leaves the battery so low that a week later it's can't turn the starter over. >> Edited by TeGriffic on Sunday 5th March 15:12

A voltmeter reading 13 after a charge is no indication of a batteries true performance or that it is ok.It needs checking on a discharge meter to give a true indication but by the sound of the reading on your voltmeter when cranking its dead on its feet.

[griffsmith]

old64er said:

A voltmeter reading 13 after a charge is no indication of a batteries true performance or that it is ok.It needs checking on a discharge meter to give a true indication but by the sound of the reading on your voltmeter when cranking its dead on its feet.

I think a drop tester is how Leven tested the battery??
my money is on the battery though..but it could still be the starter... no help I know!!! did you swap over the starter when you replaced your engine or did you stick with the one that came with the new engine?

I've got some time on Wednesday evening if you want me to pop over and help with a couple of tests? I would start with the battery though then think about by-passing the starter solenoid,to see what happens.. lastly if you still have an alternate starter, I'd give that a try...

[TeGriffic]

The BV engine came with a starter fitted but we put the 1.7 on from the original 4.3 as it was newer. It used to turn over slower than the 1.4 even when I had the original engine in there. I've already decided to swap the starters. And yes, Leven did drop test the battery (which was new about 8 months ago). Griffsmith, certainly appreciate the offer to pop over but Mon to Fri I'm not home until after 9 for the next few weeks because of work deadlines, I'll try the starter first and let you know. By the way, did the loom do the trick ?

[griffsmith]

TeGriffic said:

The BV engine came with a starter fitted but we put the 1.7 on from the original 4.3 as it was newer. It used to turn over slower than the 1.4 even when I had the original engine in there. I've already decided to swap the starters. And yes, Leven did drop test the battery (which was new about 8 months ago). Griffsmith, certainly appreciate the offer to pop over but Mon to Fri I'm not home until after 9 for the next few weeks because of work deadlines, I'll try the starter first and let you know. By the way, did the loom do the trick ?

no worries I may be free next Saturday, rugby dependant though (sorry). I think your going the right way changing the starter to see what changes.
I didn't change the loom in the end I fixed my existing one. but I also wanted it for a side project which is currently on the back burner, awaiting financial sign off!

[Marto]

I have battery problems to. I have just this week fitted a bosch 650A battery. Have used the car for a couple of short journeys. Parked it up overnight with the alarm off.



Going for its MOT today and........flat battery, even the clock has stopped.



This think is testing my tolerance to the limit.



Any ideas?