RE: Porsche Panamera
Tuesday 17th January 2006
Panamera
Porsche Panamera
Manufacturing base to be decided by April
Porsche's will decide by April where it will build its radical new four seater coupe, the Panamera.
Automobilwoche magazine says in a report published this week that Chief Technology Officer Wolfgang Duerheimer confirmed the timetable.
Favourite location is currently thought to be the existing plant in Leipzig.
Panamera
Discussion
Sorry dinkel are you sure your middle picture isn't a Mazda 3?
I hate these com-gens, they all look shite, saw one sketch that looks like the best goddamed 4-door ever and I've not seen it again, which concerns me a little. If they can get it right I suspect the base Panamera will give the Jag XJR some headaches though.
As for where it gets produced, how about South Africa? Hey, BMW and Mercedes Both make 4-doors there (C-class and 3-series respectively), I'm sure its not a giant leap for another German to follow suit. And they could make the Cayenne in Alabama as well.
Ali.
I hate these com-gens, they all look shite, saw one sketch that looks like the best goddamed 4-door ever and I've not seen it again, which concerns me a little. If they can get it right I suspect the base Panamera will give the Jag XJR some headaches though.
As for where it gets produced, how about South Africa? Hey, BMW and Mercedes Both make 4-doors there (C-class and 3-series respectively), I'm sure its not a giant leap for another German to follow suit. And they could make the Cayenne in Alabama as well.
Ali.
Very Carrera GT at the front.....
IMO more dulling of the Brand - still, I guess it sits nicely alongside the Cayenne..!
.....and if Ferrari can do it.........
I'm still not sure what they're hoping to achieve with this model - surely there isn't a massive market for proper 4 seater sports GT cars....The Cayenne I could understand, but what niche would this fill. It's hardly going to compete with the Continental GT or 612 Scag (not exactly massive sellers - and more desirable IMO) and as such won't keep the accountants happy....
>> Edited by mbutchers on Wednesday 18th January 09:18
IMO more dulling of the Brand - still, I guess it sits nicely alongside the Cayenne..!
.....and if Ferrari can do it.........
I'm still not sure what they're hoping to achieve with this model - surely there isn't a massive market for proper 4 seater sports GT cars....The Cayenne I could understand, but what niche would this fill. It's hardly going to compete with the Continental GT or 612 Scag (not exactly massive sellers - and more desirable IMO) and as such won't keep the accountants happy....
>> Edited by mbutchers on Wednesday 18th January 09:18
FestivAli said:
Sorry dinkel are you sure your middle picture isn't a Mazda 3?Ali.
Looks pretty shite doesn't it? Strectched Cayenne or limoed CGT . . .
The last one in my row of 3 looks great indeed but there are other cars - like the Aston Rapide - that would suit the 4-door concept way better. Making a sleek / low GT just isn't a Porkers thing . . . They should leave it or come up with a shocking concept that really rocks. Like the 928 did in the early 70s.
Still every time I see one
Edit to add Espada concept: make this!
>> Edited by dinkel on Wednesday 18th January 10:11
When I look at the bottom pic I just see 'Espada' don't know if it's the roofline or the glass area or what but I think it looks quite good. What would it be up against performance wise in the 4 door gang? New Aston, M5, Maserati fourdoor, Bently C Flying Spur, Proposed Audi S8? I'm sure they'll sell loads...
Crook said:Espada - agree.....
When I look at the bottom pic I just see 'Espada' don't know if it's the roofline or the glass area or what but I think it looks quite good. What would it be up against performance wise in the 4 door gang? New Aston, M5, Maserati fourdoor, Bently C Flying Spur, Proposed Audi S8? I'm sure they'll sell loads...
Not sure it'll compete with the M5 as it surely cant hope to compete on a practical level....
As for the others, they're hardly big sellers, which is what Porsche Accountants require. I'm also fairly sure that it cant hope to compete with Bently or Aston from a desirability point of view..... There was an interesting article in Autocar by Chris Harris about the need for exotic four-door sports fastbacks - basically, if you've got the money, you get a proper 4 door, 4 seat luxury car (Bentley Arnage) and have a sports car for the weekend.
I would say it will sell well. Basing this presumption on the assumption that the people who buy the 'SUV' Porsche probably buy it because it is A. a Porsche and B. a 4 door family estate car. All Porsche are doing is removing unnecesary SUV attributes as a small fraction of buyers use it's off road ability, leaving a practical 4 door Porsche estate car. Also based on the Cayenne's sales success (I'm presuming it's a success based on the amount you see in London) it doesn't even have to be good looking!
>> Edited by Crook on Wednesday 18th January 11:53
>> Edited by Crook on Wednesday 18th January 11:53
Crook said:Surely they're not making a 4 seat estate.....! This car will be a 4 door coupe with minimal luggage space - the Cayenne sold well - yes, because it was a Porsche, but also because it is very practical. People buy SUV's, not for their 'offroad' abitlities, but for the feeling of superiority/invincibility/Inherent safety - take those attributes away and you're left with very little. Will admit to knowing less than the bods at Porsche about these things, but cannot share in their confidence.....
I would say it will sell well. Basing this presumption on the assumption that the people who buy the 'SUV' Porsche probably buy it because it is A. a Porsche and B. a 4 door family estate car. All Porsche are doing is removing unnecesary SUV attributes as a small fraction of buyers use it's off road ability, leaving a practical 4 door Porsche estate car. Also based on the Cayenne's sales success (I'm presuming it's a success based on the amount you see in London) it doesn't even have to be good looking!
>> Edited by Crook on Wednesday 18th January 11:53
I attended a presentation for bond investors by the
Porsche CFO yesterday. When I asked him whether the Panamera is going to be the
spiritual successor to the 928 he strongly denied it. Moreover, he
added the design has been approved and will be unveiled to the public
pretty soon.
It will be a Porsche only platform - a clean sheet design with no
outside involvment whatsoever. Development costs of EUR1bn will be
fully bourne by Porsche themselves and the firm expects to sell
around 20,000 units per year. The car will cost around EUR100,000.
There will be no platform sharing with VW / Audi etc. It will be a 4-
door 4 full seater sports coupe ala MB CLS and "it will be like
nothing that we have seen before."
Sadly, Porsche has well and trully burried the 928...
Porsche CFO yesterday. When I asked him whether the Panamera is going to be the
spiritual successor to the 928 he strongly denied it. Moreover, he
added the design has been approved and will be unveiled to the public
pretty soon.
It will be a Porsche only platform - a clean sheet design with no
outside involvment whatsoever. Development costs of EUR1bn will be
fully bourne by Porsche themselves and the firm expects to sell
around 20,000 units per year. The car will cost around EUR100,000.
There will be no platform sharing with VW / Audi etc. It will be a 4-
door 4 full seater sports coupe ala MB CLS and "it will be like
nothing that we have seen before."
Sadly, Porsche has well and trully burried the 928...
I assumed that it would be like the Aston and from the images looked sort of like a shooting brake. Agree with your points on the benefits of SUV's and that it is bought as it's the most prestigeous of the SUV's available. But I do think that there is a market for the practical car with a supercar badge that isn't a trend purchase.
It will upset a lot of 911 fans, but I don't think that Porsche will put the enthusiast ahead of the Euro on this one.
If they wanted to do a Shooting Brake they could've marketed this [URL]http://common.weblogsinc.com/common/images/066909156[/URL]
>> Edited by Crook on Wednesday 18th January 13:04
It will upset a lot of 911 fans, but I don't think that Porsche will put the enthusiast ahead of the Euro on this one.
If they wanted to do a Shooting Brake they could've marketed this [URL]http://common.weblogsinc.com/common/images/066909156[/URL]
>> Edited by Crook on Wednesday 18th January 13:04
As a 928 owner ('87 S4) I am once again, disappointed with the direction they have taken. I have never been a fan of the whole 911 series & believe the only attractive cars they have EVER built were the S4-GTS 928's.
I think it is hubris for them to believe there is a market for 20,000 $125k 4-door coupes(?) with Mercedes CLS series having created the niche & having at least a 5 year headstart. Porsche's survival balances precariously on the continued World economic prosperity, remember what happened to them in the late 80's....this is just a BAD decision.
I think it is hubris for them to believe there is a market for 20,000 $125k 4-door coupes(?) with Mercedes CLS series having created the niche & having at least a 5 year headstart. Porsche's survival balances precariously on the continued World economic prosperity, remember what happened to them in the late 80's....this is just a BAD decision.
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