BNP members cleared

[paulhol]

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/west_yorkshire/46 - heard no end of it lately as there are an awful lot of tree hugger types at university with me in leeds and they have been protesting en masse (i thought we all had degrees to be doing?)

now lets first get this clear, i dont support them - i agree with some of their policies and not others. however i see this a positive thing that they got off. they were trialed on the basis of a leftie bbc documentary pushed to court by the bnp making significant gains in the elections last summer. a glimmer of hope that free speech still exists in an otherwise pc world? or just racist idiots getting one over on the general public?

>> Edited by paulhol on Friday 3rd February 14:20

[Yugguy]

The problem is that until the government actually does something concrete about terrorism within Britain they're playing into the hands of the BNP.

[Twincam16]

Given the swollen, obese underbelly of chavs in this country, I worry about where the BNP are going to go from here. I saw that clip on the news last night, of Nick Griffin shaking the hands of his supporters - seemingly split between Daily Mail-reading 50-something housewives and Adidas-clad chavs with scarves disguising themselves below the nose and shaved foreheads evolved for the purpose of headbutting.

Can you imagine what would happen if chavvy white-trash Britain suddenly decided to vote? Listen in to conversations among chavs and you'll hear that they're not far off BNP rhetoric sometimes. Even if they didn't get anywhere, Nick Griffin and the BNP are serving to inspire racially-motivated violence in our more deprived (both economically and educationally) areas.

And people say that our democracy is strong and the BNP is tiny - well, when Hitler joined the NSDAP they only had 47 members, and they existed under what appeared at the time to be a strong democracy.

[Parrot of doom]

I remember that programme - it was actually quite good. Some of the nonsense spouted by BNP members was quite shocking, almost as bad as the undercover filming in the documentary about UKIP, where people were talking about German tanks rolling across English countryside....

[simpo two]

I'd venture to suggest that immigration and 'racism' go hand in hand.

[Twincam16]

simpo two said:

I'd venture to suggest that immigration and 'racism' go hand in hand.

Not necessarily, but a politician can turn feeling into actiong with worrying efficiency.

I'm reading a fascinating book at the moment called The Man Who Invented Hitler, by David Lewis. It's all about how Hitler went from timid, reclusive wannabe artist with 'hysterical blindness' following a gas attack, to the leader of the Third Reich.

You realise after a while that the things Hitler stood for were nothing new - he pinched most of his 'ideology' and inflated personal image from other people, mainly misguided amateur philosophers and disillusioned ex-soldiers. What Hitler did was to put all these ideas together and deliver them in public speeches in pubs, to gain support for his party. He used to frequently incite riots, and ended up in prison in the '20s.

Point is, people may have semi-racist opinions on immigrants and immigration, but restraint and social ettiquette tells them to keep it under wraps. This, thankfully, has a normalising effect on large groups of the population.

But by appearing as a legitimate political party and voicing racist views on immigration, Nick Griffin is essentially building a national network of racist communities, who feel no shame in airing and agreeing with racist views. When you get feelings like this creating a sense of 'togetherness', especially amongst disillusioned and badly-off neighbourhoods, people feel that racially-motivated violence and vandalism is somehow justified.

They need stopping. They'd never get anywhere in Germany - they learned from the past and now have long-standing laws to prevent filth like this from getting any further than putting up a poster.

[s2art]

Whatever the rights and wrongs of the situation I think its overreacting to get worried about the BNP.
They are not going to get any political power. Just look at the lib-dems, a perfectly respectable party, trying hard for decades to break through. Havent got far.
If the country turns a bit right wing I am sure the Tories will be able to hoover up the votes rather than the BNP.

[scorp]

As much as i deplore a lot of the BNP's policies im happy they were acquitted, this curbing of freedom of speech is beginning to look a bit sinister these days.

[james_j]

I too am glad they were aquitted. Freedom of speech is maintained (just).

They did not exceed / abuse the boundaries of freedom of speech.

[scorp]

Twincam16 said:

They need stopping. They'd never get anywhere in Germany - they learned from the past and now have long-standing laws to prevent filth like this from getting any further than putting up a poster.

How do you suggest we stop them under existing laws?

[vario-rob]

Twincam16 said:

[They need stopping. They'd never get anywhere in Germany - they learned from the past and now have long-standing laws to prevent filth like this from getting any further than putting up a poster.

Twincam,

Whilst I agree in part with what you’re saying here I think you’re slightly wide of the mark when it comes to Germany.

Cast your mind back to last summer when the were various memorials held to commemorate the bombing of Dresden, I can clearly recall large numbers of 21st century fascists marching through the streets of Dresden giving a Nazi salute and demanding the British apologies for actions of Arthur Harris and Bomber Command. I also remember a thread or two on here suggesting exactly what they could do with this train of thought, me being one of them.

There is till an active fascist movement in Germany albeit predominantly located in the poorer eastern parts of the country but it is still there and I think always will be as to the disaffected youth there is still surely a feeling that their national identity has been diminished by the events of a little over sixty years ago.

What’s more, with the World Cup now just around the corner mark my words, there will be plenty more evidence that Germany still has an active right wing movement. It’s sad to say but I’d bet a fair few quid there will trouble as a result of just this sort of thing with the England fans and we will be very lucky if the tournament passes off without significant crowd trouble at englands matches.

We will see how wrong I am but as I’m going to England Sweden on my way back from Le Mans and I really hope that I’m wrong as I’m really looking forward to what will be a fantastic week away. Unfortunately though I’ve had long discussions with a mate in CID who’s coming with us and it seems that both the British and German Police see this as a very real threat so let’s hope I’m wrong and you’re right!

[rsvmilly]

scorp said:

As much as i deplore a lot of the BNP's policies im happy they were acquitted, this curbing of freedom of speech is beginning to look a bit sinister these days.

There is too much legislation 'for our own good' like this Religious Hatred bill being discussed at the moment.

[Moparmick]

I think that Nick Griffin could rise above the BNP and form a party more to the left but to the right of the main parties, which at the moment, you could not force a fag packet between them.
Most of the BNP are just mindless racist thugs and as such, will never be taken seriously. All the major tv stations are left wing as is 60 percent of the media, not to mention, all the other so called independent think tanks, sticking their oar in. The country needs a proper right wing alternative to keep a balance, instead we've got a few thousand guardian readers, dictating what is and is not acceptable to the masses.

[Jaglover]

anonymous said:

[redacted]

Well said

[police state]

Jaglover said:

anonymous said: [redacted] Well said

This guy say's it better...

www.faithfreedom.org/oped/kw60203.htm

[hendry]

Moparmick said:

I think that Nick Griffin could rise above the BNP and form a party more to the left but to the right of the main parties, which at the moment, you could not force a fag packet between them. Most of the BNP are just mindless racist thugs and as such, will never be taken seriously. All the major tv stations are left wing as is 60 percent of the media, not to mention, all the other so called independent think tanks, sticking their oar in. The country needs a proper right wing alternative to keep a balance, instead we've got a few thousand guardian readers, dictating what is and is not acceptable to the masses.

Was interested to find this thread and after reading through the whole thing - all of it very valid and eloquent - this is the quote that sits best with my own beliefs. The Lib Dems are failing at the moment because their heartland is occupied by a "righter-wing" New Labour and Tories that will try anything to get back in. The Lib Dems offer nothing the two better established parties don't (at least nothing anyone wants that much).

I have long shared the view that there is till a demand for something right of this busy space which, traditionally, is somewhere the Tories would sit. Much further right is the BNP - with many policies that many respectable people in this country would vote for, if they didn't feel like the BNP was the National Front with lipstick on. Whereas the three parties we have on offer are splitting hairs over minitiae around middle-class crap to appease the Guardian voters, they are missing the passion the eloctorate is feeling over immigration, racial issues, crime, violence etc., issue that effect us all.

Let's see whete Maceroon drags the Tories, but I have no real expectation that he will manage to tap into the right of Tony, as he seems to be the candidate for Sedgefield with a blue tie on. Shame.

[alfaman]

police state said:

Jaglover said: anonymous said: [redacted] Well said This guy say's it better... www.faithfreedom.org/oped/kw60203.htm

thats a good piece of analysis.

Funny how the protesters in Regents Park today were calling for the beheading of anyone who "insulted" Muslims ,and were praising Osama and 9/11 ....... even more odd that they weren't arrested (by the Police attending)for inciting racial hatred or inciting murder .

Double standards , bigotry and hypocrisy ?............. we just have to live with it I guess ( apparently )

[denbeer]

Twincam16 said:

simpo two said: I'd venture to suggest that immigration and 'racism' go hand in hand. Not necessarily, but a politician can turn feeling into actiong with worrying efficiency. I'm reading a fascinating book at the moment called The Man Who Invented Hitler, by David Lewis. It's all about how Hitler went from timid, reclusive wannabe artist with 'hysterical blindness' following a gas attack, to the leader of the Third Reich. You realise after a while that the things Hitler stood for were nothing new - he pinched most of his 'ideology' and inflated personal image from other people, mainly misguided amateur philosophers and disillusioned ex-soldiers. What Hitler did was to put all these ideas together and deliver them in public speeches in pubs, to gain support for his party. He used to frequently incite riots, and ended up in prison in the '20s. Point is, people may have semi-racist opinions on immigrants and immigration, but restraint and social ettiquette tells them to keep it under wraps. This, thankfully, has a normalising effect on large groups of the population. But by appearing as a legitimate political party and voicing racist views on immigration, Nick Griffin is essentially building a national network of racist communities, who feel no shame in airing and agreeing with racist views. When you get feelings like this creating a sense of 'togetherness', especially amongst disillusioned and badly-off neighbourhoods, people feel that racially-motivated violence and vandalism is somehow justified. They need stopping. They'd never get anywhere in Germany - they learned from the past and now have long-standing laws to prevent filth like this from getting any further than putting up a poster.

[denbeer]

Twincam16 said:

simpo two said: I'd venture to suggest that immigration and 'racism' go hand in hand. Not necessarily, but a politician can turn feeling into actiong with worrying efficiency. I'm reading a fascinating book at the moment called The Man Who Invented Hitler, by David Lewis. It's all about how Hitler went from timid, reclusive wannabe artist with 'hysterical blindness' following a gas attack, to the leader of the Third Reich. You realise after a while that the things Hitler stood for were nothing new - he pinched most of his 'ideology' and inflated personal image from other people, mainly misguided amateur philosophers and disillusioned ex-soldiers. What Hitler did was to put all these ideas together and deliver them in public speeches in pubs, to gain support for his party. He used to frequently incite riots, and ended up in prison in the '20s. Point is, people may have semi-racist opinions on immigrants and immigration, but restraint and social ettiquette tells them to keep it under wraps. This, thankfully, has a normalising effect on large groups of the population. But by appearing as a legitimate political party and voicing racist views on immigration, Nick Griffin is essentially building a national network of racist communities, who feel no shame in airing and agreeing with racist views. When you get feelings like this creating a sense of 'togetherness', especially amongst disillusioned and badly-off neighbourhoods, people feel that racially-motivated violence and vandalism is somehow justified. They need stopping. They'd never get anywhere in Germany - they learned from the past and now have long-standing laws to prevent filth like this from getting any further than putting up a poster.

[denbeer]

Sorry about the double end posting lads, just got phuked up