Watch Watchdog - on now..
Discussion
'Photographic clampers' are buying info from the DVLA and billing legal parkers for scam fees. The DVLA claim that they are 'not responsible' for the use of info they supply...
This is a scam beyond the wildest dreams of the Scameras mob.
Go to http://tinyurl.com/kngh4 for more info!
This is a scam beyond the wildest dreams of the Scameras mob.
Go to http://tinyurl.com/kngh4 for more info!
I am currently in charge of a Vehicle Immobilising company which is regulated by the SIA. I have been brought in to manage the day to day running of the business and to ensure that everything is performed to the letter of the law. Every Vehicle Immobiliser has to go on an expensive and time consuming course where they also have to sit an exam and get decent pass rates. On top of that the whole organisation is under scrutiny from the SIA. The regulation of this industry was vastly overdue, and necessary to weed out the criminals that were blatantly robbing the public at every operational level. Now if you do not have an SIA licence (which involves a criminal record check amoungst other things) you are not allowed to clamp - period.
So this is the latest way these thieves make their money - again without regulation, and now they are using the DVLA database as a worksheet. Utterly disgusting. The company that I direct holds the biggest contract for the DVLA around London, and mainly deals with unlicensed vehicles, which are reported by the council snoop, then passed onto this company for clamping or lifting, depending on what the arrangement is for that borough.
When ANPR2 goes live (see previous PH news for details) on or about the 7th of March, it is only a matter of time before the CCTV number plate data gets farmed out to private companies. Already the council use high street CCTV cameras to enforce parking violations, so you can just imagine what it will be like when the cowboys get hold of this information.
If DVLA are allowing this information to be legally obtained and used for Private Parking Enforcement now, then what the hell is it going to be like in a few years when everyones' cars are continually monitored wherever they go??
This is outrageous and totally unacceptable and the government needs to step in and act now.
So this is the latest way these thieves make their money - again without regulation, and now they are using the DVLA database as a worksheet. Utterly disgusting. The company that I direct holds the biggest contract for the DVLA around London, and mainly deals with unlicensed vehicles, which are reported by the council snoop, then passed onto this company for clamping or lifting, depending on what the arrangement is for that borough.
When ANPR2 goes live (see previous PH news for details) on or about the 7th of March, it is only a matter of time before the CCTV number plate data gets farmed out to private companies. Already the council use high street CCTV cameras to enforce parking violations, so you can just imagine what it will be like when the cowboys get hold of this information.
If DVLA are allowing this information to be legally obtained and used for Private Parking Enforcement now, then what the hell is it going to be like in a few years when everyones' cars are continually monitored wherever they go??
This is outrageous and totally unacceptable and the government needs to step in and act now.
MGBGT said:
'Photographic clampers' are buying info from the DVLA and billing legal parkers for scam fees. The DVLA claim that they are 'not responsible' for the use of info they supply...
This is a scam beyond the wildest dreams of the Scameras mob.
Go to http://tinyurl.com/kngh4 for more info!
Surely the digital photos can't be used as "evidence".I could take a photo of anyone's car and use photoshop to put whatever reg. no. on I wanted!
esselte said:
'Photographic clampers' are buying info from the DVLA and billing legal parkers for scam fees. The DVLA claim that they are 'not responsible' for the use of info they supply...
This is a scam beyond the wildest dreams of the Scameras mob.
Go to http://tinyurl.com/kngh4 for more info!
Surely the digital photos can't be used as "evidence".I could take a photo of anyone's car and use photoshop to put whatever reg. no. on I wanted!
ultimasimon said:
Already the council use high street CCTV cameras to enforce parking violations, so you can just imagine what it will be like when the cowboys get hold of this information.
AL666 said:
Does this mean that if I owned some land and somebody parked on it, I could legally request any amount of money from them and claim that it was a parking fine?
That's a bloody rediculoud idea!
That's exactly what theses shisters are doing - even altering images using photo editors to alter vehicle details and locations...
The first woman on Watchdog nearly made me get out of my chair and punch her in her face fat. Her justification for parking where she did was "I've parked there on half a dozen occasions before". 
me you inconsiderate bitch. I'm glad you've been landed with hundreds of pounds worth of fines. I think inconsiderate parking is a cancer in this country and it is indicative of the "I don't give a fk about anyone other than myself" attitude that a lot of people seem to have.
See this thread about people parking opposite mine and my neighbour's driveway. If I could get these parking people to police the close I live in, then I would.
As for the people on Watchdog - I wipe my arse with their feelings, they just make themselves look stupid by appearing on television and announcing their idiocy to the nation.
and deep breaths...
me you inconsiderate bitch. I'm glad you've been landed with hundreds of pounds worth of fines. I think inconsiderate parking is a cancer in this country and it is indicative of the "I don't give a fk about anyone other than myself" attitude that a lot of people seem to have. See this thread about people parking opposite mine and my neighbour's driveway. If I could get these parking people to police the close I live in, then I would.
As for the people on Watchdog - I wipe my arse with their feelings, they just make themselves look stupid by appearing on television and announcing their idiocy to the nation.
and deep breaths...
Slapmat - So you think fining people without adequate or obvious notice is OK then?
Law enforcement should NEVER be put into the hands of private enterprise. It is a matter for the authorities, not profit seeking businesses.
Obviously, parking wityhout permission on private land is not tolerable. However, a lot of these companies are enforcing parking restrictions in PUBLIC access areas which happen to have parking restrictions - some of which are either unmarked or not very obvious.
>> Edited by Eric Mc on Wednesday 1st March 09:10
Law enforcement should NEVER be put into the hands of private enterprise. It is a matter for the authorities, not profit seeking businesses.
Obviously, parking wityhout permission on private land is not tolerable. However, a lot of these companies are enforcing parking restrictions in PUBLIC access areas which happen to have parking restrictions - some of which are either unmarked or not very obvious.
>> Edited by Eric Mc on Wednesday 1st March 09:10
Eric Mc said:
Slapmat - So you think fining people without adequate or obvious notice is OK then?
Law enforcement should NEVER be put into the hands of private enterprise. It is a matter for the authorities, not profit seeking businesses.
Obviously, parking wityhout permission on private land is not tolerable. However, a lot of these companies are enforcing parking restrictions in PUBLIC access areas which happen to have parking restrictions - some of which are either unmarked or not very obvious.
It depends how you look at the situation:
Do you assume that it is OK to park anywhere you like, unless told otherwise
Or
Do you assume that you can only park in clearly designated parking areas?
The people on the programme clearly think the former, whereas I strongly believe that it shoudl be the latter.
You're totally right, law enforcement should NOT be a profit making exercise and it shouldn't be in the hand of private companies, but this situation has come about due to our (members of the public) total inability to use common sense and consideration when deciding where to park our cars.
Yes, the parking companies are shysters, but the people in the programme only have themselves to blame for their inconsiderate parking and subsequent fines.
Yes they do.
The law actually says that the public are free to park on the public highway unless specifically restricted from doing so. Therefore, if someone parks on the side of the road or outside a premises ON THE PUBLIC HIGHWAY and there are no restriction signs in place, then they should not be fined.
The problem arises when the signs are there but are defaced, covered over by dirt or vegitation or in such a position so as to make them virtually invisible. To be honest, official road signs are usually reasonably well placed and people usually do not have a legal leg to stand on if they try to claim that they weren't aware that parking restrictions were in place.
However, whatare the technical distinctions between "parking", "stopping", "dropping off" etc. A lot of these operators seem to be slapping fines on people who stopped for a few seconds to let someone out of the car and then drove off!
The situation regarding parking on private land is very different. I have no reservations regarding private landlords taking whatever steps they need to prevent unauthorised parking onn their property. However, even thse situations can be fraught with undcertainty as it is not always absolutely clear where the public highway ends and private property begins.
The law actually says that the public are free to park on the public highway unless specifically restricted from doing so. Therefore, if someone parks on the side of the road or outside a premises ON THE PUBLIC HIGHWAY and there are no restriction signs in place, then they should not be fined.
The problem arises when the signs are there but are defaced, covered over by dirt or vegitation or in such a position so as to make them virtually invisible. To be honest, official road signs are usually reasonably well placed and people usually do not have a legal leg to stand on if they try to claim that they weren't aware that parking restrictions were in place.
However, whatare the technical distinctions between "parking", "stopping", "dropping off" etc. A lot of these operators seem to be slapping fines on people who stopped for a few seconds to let someone out of the car and then drove off!
The situation regarding parking on private land is very different. I have no reservations regarding private landlords taking whatever steps they need to prevent unauthorised parking onn their property. However, even thse situations can be fraught with undcertainty as it is not always absolutely clear where the public highway ends and private property begins.
I believe you should be able to get out of most of those fines. I know one guy who went through and triggered the same speed camera 3 or 4 times in the one day and he successfully got the fine down to only one because he argued that if he had been stopped by the police or warned immediately somehow he would have known the correct speed limit and subsequently slowed down but as he had no warning that he triggered the camera how would have known to slow down.
slapmatt said:
Do you assume that it is OK to park anywhere you like, unless told otherwise
Or
Do you assume that you can only park in clearly designated parking areas?
The people on the programme clearly think the former, whereas I strongly believe that it shoudl be the latter.
So what you're saying is that you will only ever park in a marked bay?
So - what do you do outside your own home (assuming there are no marked bays)? Hover? Drive to the nearest road with yellow lines and park for the limited permitted time, then return and move it an hour later?
Or (as I suspect) do you just park on the unmarked road, assuming its ok to do so unless told otherwise?
To implement your stated approach to parking, every inch of roadway in the country would need to be marked up - hardly practical or sensible, surely?
I think most people here have got the wrong end of the stick. The issue is about people parking and/or entering on PRIVATE property, it is nothing to do with the public highway or decriminalised parking, nor are they "fines".
What happens is somebody parks a car on private property, or in some cases merely drives down a private road, the parking operator gets the registered keeper's details from the DVLA and then charges them, by saying they entered into a contract by taking those actions when warned by signage. What I question is how the registered keeper can be liable for the debts incurred by the driver, who is often a different person, and how they can even prove if the RK was the driver.
Then there is the purely dodgy dealings like this - note that the warning sign is at the very END of the private road: http://mrstella.bravehost.com/
Gareth
What happens is somebody parks a car on private property, or in some cases merely drives down a private road, the parking operator gets the registered keeper's details from the DVLA and then charges them, by saying they entered into a contract by taking those actions when warned by signage. What I question is how the registered keeper can be liable for the debts incurred by the driver, who is often a different person, and how they can even prove if the RK was the driver.
Then there is the purely dodgy dealings like this - note that the warning sign is at the very END of the private road: http://mrstella.bravehost.com/
Gareth
ultimasimon said:
Every Vehicle Immobiliser has to go on an expensive and time consuming course where they also have to sit an exam and get decent pass rates.
I agree its a Time consuming course
But the multiple choice exam is a piece of cake - you need to score less than 75% to pass
GOM said:
JUST BE AWARE THAT THE DVLA (A GOVERNMENT DEPARTMENT) ARE SELLING YOUR PERSONAL DETAILS TO A THIRD PARTY. THEY WANT US TO HAVE ID CARDS NEXT
Surely under DPA rules the DVLA would need permisison from the data subject, with the abilty to opt out? Or does this fall under the catch all of "we need to do this for operational reasons"?
FG
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