SCAMeras fail in Northants (unsurprisingly)
Discussion
From today’s local paper (Chronicle & Echo):
Tragic rise in road deaths
THE number of people killed on the county's roads last year rose by 28.5 per cent on the previous 12 months, despite the major investment in safety cameras in the county.
A total of 62 people died in accidents across the county last year, compared with only 46 in 2001 and 58 the previous year.
The figures were met with disappointment from Northamptonshire Police's traffic officers, who have blamed the rise on motorists who continue to ignore the speed limit.
Pc John Spencer, a senior accident investigator with the force, said: "It is disappointing and we are very concerned about the increase on the previous year.
"We will analyse all the deaths to see if there is a pattern and will do all we can to keep the figures down.
"The most common cause of the majority of the accidents would appear to be driver error or excess speed," he added.
"Cars are highly sophisticated machines, but motorists remain susceptible to simple human error."
Police have said there has been a fall in the number of serious injury accidents.
Northamptonshire County Council's cabinet member for highways, Councillor John Forshaw (Lab, Shire Lodge) denied the rise meant that the dozens of speed cameras lining the county's roads were not having the desired effect.
The 70-year-old, who is facing a £60 fine after being caught travelling at 45mph in a 30mph zone in Geddington last month, said: "This rise in deaths does not mean cameras are not doing their job of reducing accidents. We have seen accidents go down on sites where safety cameras have been erected.
"We are constantly working to reduce the number of accidents, with cameras being a very effective way of doing this.
"But we are also building on the rest of the safety work we already do, including road engineering and driver education."
Northamptonshire is widely regarded as one of the best performing police forces with regard to road death statistics.
Pc Spencer added: "Since the introduction of safety cameras on designated red and amber routes the number of people killed or seriously injured on those roads has fallen dramatically.
"We have had a reduction of about 29 per cent, which puts us near the top of the league nationally.
"Most of the people caught on camera in the county now are not local residents. People in Northamptonshire certainly appear to be heeding the message to slow down."
This comment was reflected in today's list at Towcester Magistrates Court where only five of the 33 people charged specifically with speeding were from the county.
Several more appeared charged with failing to give information to police.
This year's death toll started within hours of 2003.
A 35-year-old Raunds man, Russell Rodaway, died after he was in collision with a car while walking along the A45, at 5.50am on January 1.
Please note from the article:
The Labour Councillor, John Forshaw, who is being prosecuted for speeding himself, yet is still spewing out crap about SCAMeras being effective at reducing deaths
What are these idiots on?
Tragic rise in road deaths
THE number of people killed on the county's roads last year rose by 28.5 per cent on the previous 12 months, despite the major investment in safety cameras in the county.
A total of 62 people died in accidents across the county last year, compared with only 46 in 2001 and 58 the previous year.
The figures were met with disappointment from Northamptonshire Police's traffic officers, who have blamed the rise on motorists who continue to ignore the speed limit.
Pc John Spencer, a senior accident investigator with the force, said: "It is disappointing and we are very concerned about the increase on the previous year.
"We will analyse all the deaths to see if there is a pattern and will do all we can to keep the figures down.
"The most common cause of the majority of the accidents would appear to be driver error or excess speed," he added.
"Cars are highly sophisticated machines, but motorists remain susceptible to simple human error."
Police have said there has been a fall in the number of serious injury accidents.
Northamptonshire County Council's cabinet member for highways, Councillor John Forshaw (Lab, Shire Lodge) denied the rise meant that the dozens of speed cameras lining the county's roads were not having the desired effect.
The 70-year-old, who is facing a £60 fine after being caught travelling at 45mph in a 30mph zone in Geddington last month, said: "This rise in deaths does not mean cameras are not doing their job of reducing accidents. We have seen accidents go down on sites where safety cameras have been erected.
"We are constantly working to reduce the number of accidents, with cameras being a very effective way of doing this.
"But we are also building on the rest of the safety work we already do, including road engineering and driver education."
Northamptonshire is widely regarded as one of the best performing police forces with regard to road death statistics.
Pc Spencer added: "Since the introduction of safety cameras on designated red and amber routes the number of people killed or seriously injured on those roads has fallen dramatically.
"We have had a reduction of about 29 per cent, which puts us near the top of the league nationally.
"Most of the people caught on camera in the county now are not local residents. People in Northamptonshire certainly appear to be heeding the message to slow down."
This comment was reflected in today's list at Towcester Magistrates Court where only five of the 33 people charged specifically with speeding were from the county.
Several more appeared charged with failing to give information to police.
This year's death toll started within hours of 2003.
A 35-year-old Raunds man, Russell Rodaway, died after he was in collision with a car while walking along the A45, at 5.50am on January 1.
Please note from the article:
The Labour Councillor, John Forshaw, who is being prosecuted for speeding himself, yet is still spewing out crap about SCAMeras being effective at reducing deaths
What are these idiots on?
yeah that looks almost identical to the article i read in our local rag(leicester) the other day 
more deaths than last year despite more speed err.. sorry safety cameras and the coppers continue to blame "speed" - the solution? more scameras, coz they obviously slow people down dont they
more deaths than last year despite more speed err.. sorry safety cameras and the coppers continue to blame "speed" - the solution? more scameras, coz they obviously slow people down dont they
I'm from Northants, and yes, these reports also make my blood boil. They keep on showing the photo of the Audi involved in the incident on the A428 Bedford road, when it hit the other car, killing the poor girl, and the 3 occupants of the Audi, who were all drunk and doing 90-95 mph at the time. No speed camera would have prevented this. What percentage of deaths/accidents ARE caused by drink, error,stupidity etc, and how many are caused by responsible drivers marginally over the limit?
There's a series of radio adverts on in my area at the moment, goes something like this . . .
. . . did you know that women drivers injured 1000 children in your area last year on the roads ? . . . and did you know that 50 of those women were over the limit . . . "shock horror response - surely not - female voices, etc" . . . over the SPEED limit . . . "oh the SPEED limit" . . . blah blah safety camera parnership . . . blah blah, over the limit is over the limit . . .
Now the thing that irks me is that the figures they quote (and there are a number of these ads running from the same people) the percentage of accidents involving speeding quoted is always 5% or less.
Every time I hear this I can't help but wonder, just what is being done about the other 95% of accidents.
I drive every day, 20,000+ miles a year, I can probably count the number of traffic cars I've seen in the last 6 months on 1 hand.
There is no enforcement or policing that is visible to me that is dealing with 95% of road injuries (by the stats published here).
Anybody else think that is just unbelievable ?
Fd
>> Edited by fergusd on Friday 3rd January 20:23
. . . did you know that women drivers injured 1000 children in your area last year on the roads ? . . . and did you know that 50 of those women were over the limit . . . "shock horror response - surely not - female voices, etc" . . . over the SPEED limit . . . "oh the SPEED limit" . . . blah blah safety camera parnership . . . blah blah, over the limit is over the limit . . .
Now the thing that irks me is that the figures they quote (and there are a number of these ads running from the same people) the percentage of accidents involving speeding quoted is always 5% or less.
Every time I hear this I can't help but wonder, just what is being done about the other 95% of accidents.
I drive every day, 20,000+ miles a year, I can probably count the number of traffic cars I've seen in the last 6 months on 1 hand.
There is no enforcement or policing that is visible to me that is dealing with 95% of road injuries (by the stats published here).
Anybody else think that is just unbelievable ?
Fd
>> Edited by fergusd on Friday 3rd January 20:23
Northamptonshire County Council's cabinet member for highways, Councillor John Forshaw...
The 70-year-old, who is facing a £60 fine after being caught travelling at 45mph in a 30mph zone
This makes me sick
45 in a 30?
How do they expect to be listened to when they (politicians) are ALL hypocrites, from the top (Blair)
downwards, what a bunch of self serving scum. And some mighty fine traffic Policing going on by the sounds of it - where is all this leading to?
"Most of the people caught on camera in the county now are not local residents. People in Northamptonshire certainly appear to be heeding the message to slow down."
This comment was reflected in today's list at Towcester Magistrates Court where only five of the 33 people charged specifically with speeding were from the county.
This would indicate to me the Scamera Partnership is concentrating on arterial routes as opposed to near schools, shops housing estates where we keep being told to kill you speed not a child/pensioner etc.
To me this demonstrates they are more concerned with routes with a high density of traffic where they can extort the most fines and points as opposed to where people are genuinely at risk from motorists.
Makes me want to
Fcuking hypocritical bastards too bloody thick to realise that central government has rigged "the game" to get police to bash the motorists for political reasons under the guise of safety. What Chief Constable in his right mind is going to refuse the chance of bringing extra millions into his budget even if it is ringfenced for road safety, when in all other areas he's being told to cut budgets. It's bloody simple, rebrand loads of your people as "road safety" related employees. ie talivans, back office staff, scamera operatives, court officials etc.
DAZ
Excuse the ranting nature of this post but I've just gorged a rather fine meal with a bottle and a half of rather nice claret.
>> Edited by dazren on Friday 3rd January 23:31
This comment was reflected in today's list at Towcester Magistrates Court where only five of the 33 people charged specifically with speeding were from the county.
This would indicate to me the Scamera Partnership is concentrating on arterial routes as opposed to near schools, shops housing estates where we keep being told to kill you speed not a child/pensioner etc.
To me this demonstrates they are more concerned with routes with a high density of traffic where they can extort the most fines and points as opposed to where people are genuinely at risk from motorists.
Makes me want to
Fcuking hypocritical bastards too bloody thick to realise that central government has rigged "the game" to get police to bash the motorists for political reasons under the guise of safety. What Chief Constable in his right mind is going to refuse the chance of bringing extra millions into his budget even if it is ringfenced for road safety, when in all other areas he's being told to cut budgets. It's bloody simple, rebrand loads of your people as "road safety" related employees. ie talivans, back office staff, scamera operatives, court officials etc.
DAZ
Excuse the ranting nature of this post but I've just gorged a rather fine meal with a bottle and a half of rather nice claret.
>> Edited by dazren on Friday 3rd January 23:31
Cold light of day....
45 in a 30, dunno what it's like round there but here most roads that are 30 limits are not safe to travel down at 45, and that's me with faster reactions (and driver training, car with decent brakes and feel) than some doddery old git whose probably pissed on port from the latest council meeting - I hope he gets screwed - hypocrite!
45 in a 30, dunno what it's like round there but here most roads that are 30 limits are not safe to travel down at 45, and that's me with faster reactions (and driver training, car with decent brakes and feel) than some doddery old git whose probably pissed on port from the latest council meeting - I hope he gets screwed - hypocrite!
He he he he.....silly old fart.
So if motorists are still speeding despite all the scameras, and they are slowing motorists down, and theyre not a a failure.....and if the policy is working........why did HE get copped then?
(Big fat grins..)
Victim of his own failed policy id say....Big ups to the gatso that snapped his sorry ass, at last a gatso worthy of the accolade of "most useful scamera in britain"...made my day that has
So if motorists are still speeding despite all the scameras, and they are slowing motorists down, and theyre not a a failure.....and if the policy is working........why did HE get copped then?
(Big fat grins..)
Victim of his own failed policy id say....Big ups to the gatso that snapped his sorry ass, at last a gatso worthy of the accolade of "most useful scamera in britain"...made my day that has
fergusd said: There's a series of radio adverts on in my area at the moment, goes something like this . . .
. . . did you know that women drivers injured 1000 children in your area last year on the roads ? . . . and did you know that 50 of those women were over the limit . . . "shock horror response - surely not - female voices, etc" . . . over the SPEED limit . . . "oh the SPEED limit" . . . blah blah safety camera parnership . . . blah blah, over the limit is over the limit . . .
I get those adverts shoved down my throat every damn day at work. The Van radio is stuck on one station and they play the ad at every fricking opportunity
Strathclyde Partnership or something like that.
This would indicate to me the Scamera Partnership is concentrating on arterial routes as opposed to near schools, shops housing estates where we keep being told to kill you speed not a child/pensioner etc.
To me this demonstrates they are more concerned with routes with a high density of traffic where they can extort the most fines and points as opposed to where people are genuinely at risk from motorists.
True unfortunately. They regularly sit in their Talivans on the M1 bridges, which seems rather odd as motorways are the safest roads. And they also like the A14 dual carriageway which is the main link from the M1/M6 to Cambridgeshire/Norfolk/Suffolk.
The figures were met with disappointment from Northamptonshire Police's traffic officers, who have blamed the rise on motorists who continue to ignore the speed limit.
It's not how fast we drive, it's how good we are as drivers,
at the speed we choose to drive. Schumacher at 200 mph
around Monaco no problem.
Sounds like a simple case of dumbing down to me.
"The most common cause of the majority of the accidents would appear to be driver error or excess speed," he added.
I think one of these is much more likely than the other.
"Cars are highly sophisticated machines, but motorists remain susceptible to simple human error."
Interesting to note that improved driver training forms no part of
their policy, even though "simple human error" is quoted as a
major problem.
No chance of any improved training then - just make them drive
slower.
Clearly Northamptonshire isn't the place to visit if you are in a hurry, or want fast & efficient delivery of goods & services.
This year's death toll started within hours of 2003.
A 35-year-old Raunds man, Russell Rodaway, died after he was in collision with a car while walking along the A45, at 5.50am on January 1.
Interesting to note that a speeding driver was at fault here.
No mention of drunk pedestrian, or any other
possible cause.
add me to the collection of PH'ers whose blood is now boiling.
SO if the death toll is REDUCED, it means the cameras are working, but if it INCREASES, it means the cameras are working too???????
Forget politics, forget being nice. Lets just burn a politician a day until they take the cameras away.
C
SO if the death toll is REDUCED, it means the cameras are working, but if it INCREASES, it means the cameras are working too???????
Forget politics, forget being nice. Lets just burn a politician a day until they take the cameras away.
C
hertsbiker said: add me to the collection of PH'ers whose blood is now boiling.
SO if the death toll is REDUCED, it means the cameras are working, but if it INCREASES, it means the cameras are working too???????
Forget politics, forget being nice. Lets just burn a politician a day until they take the cameras away.
C
we're all pissed off with this crap mate, but we need the average joe to see through the lies.....from what I've seen it's starting to happen, spread the word, join the ABD, annoy your MP, write to your local rag
>> Edited by apache on Saturday 4th January 17:51
Interesting to note that a speeding driver was at fault here.
No mention of drunk pedestrian, or any other
possible cause.
From what I read on the front page of the paper, the guy was walking down the A45, which is a dual carridgeway - mostly unlit, in dark jeans with a dark jacket. At 5:30 in the morning.
Make your own minds up as to what the cause was...
bengie said:
Interesting to note that a speeding driver was at fault here.
No mention of drunk pedestrian, or any other
possible cause.
From what I read on the front page of the paper, the guy was walking down the A45, which is a dual carridgeway - mostly unlit, in dark jeans with a dark jacket. At 5:30 in the morning.
Make your own minds up as to what the cause was...
... that'll be a pissed-up pedestrian then ......
And I saw one yesterday on a dual carriageway, heading into the low setting sun..... One of your old time favourites, a cylcist, dressed in black, with no lights - oh, and in the middle of the inside lane as well, not hugging the verge. And guess who'd be blamed if he got hit and killed .......
I live in northants and can agree with most coments about the positioning of cameras. I think most of you will agree that if a scamera is positioned to protect our childrens safety then non of us have a problem with that, but down a stretch of clear dual carriageway? how can anybody maintain this is for safety.
The worst thing is that we the driving public let this invisible taxation happen. But with Gordons Brown huge deficit getting larger is there anyway we can stop this from continuing.
Question, if we all did use public transport as the environmentalists and the government want, where would the missing millions of pounds generated from road tax, petrol tax and speeding fines come from??
The worst thing is that we the driving public let this invisible taxation happen. But with Gordons Brown huge deficit getting larger is there anyway we can stop this from continuing.
Question, if we all did use public transport as the environmentalists and the government want, where would the missing millions of pounds generated from road tax, petrol tax and speeding fines come from??
Tabs, I agree with you, and especially with your comment on the Audi picture, and I think the C&E could source another photo of a crashed car from anywhere else in the country, my wife and i knew the girl and still know the parents, and this picture popping up at random, does little to ease their grief. SPEED KILLS yeah and so does being pissed out of your head, and being egged on by car load of f'ckwit mates
The causes of accidents seem to be inattentive driving and failure to yeild properly. While speed is a magnifer of damage when things go wrong, speed in itself is not to blame for deaths. People of someplaces have revolted. There is a company that maintained the cameras in Hawaii that is trying to sue that state for $3M after the admistration dismantled the program after massive public outcry and complaints about the use of the cameras. Maybe you people can do the same thing. People in USA won't be as passive in this issue as other countries have been about these radar cameras.
Calvin
Calvin
Gassing Station | Speed, Plod & the Law | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff