Driven: 1988 930
Discussion
20 minutes spent a the wheel of this...thing 
I will start with the bad points, if you don't mind:
1° appalling driving position
I felt like seating at the bar; even though the seats are pretty much the same as that of the 944, it was impossible to move them back enough. (people might have been smaller in 1988
)
2° loooooooooooong gearlever stroke
Approximately twice as long as the 944's, extremely unprecise and "kaschlunk" feel
3° loooooooooooong clutch pedal stroke
At first I thought I was too close to the pedals (see point 1) but when I pushed the clucth I found out I was not close enough!
4° no rest place for the left foot
5° pedals not aligned with the steering wheel
6° funny ventilation
Even though I moved the seat forward in order to cure point 2°, I was not close enough to see out of the windscreen because the ventilation proved totally unable to get rid of enough mist
7° Wooden brake feel (car fitted with no ABS)
Good points:
1° Light steering, so light I thought it was PA, which was not the case
1bis° Front of the car very light, virtually no understeer at all
A good experience, after all.
I had never driven a 911 before but now I can criticise in the know
edited to add: why they sold more 911 in 1988 than 944 I definitely don't know...
>>> Edited by Thom on Monday 6th January 20:28
I will start with the bad points, if you don't mind:
1° appalling driving position
I felt like seating at the bar; even though the seats are pretty much the same as that of the 944, it was impossible to move them back enough. (people might have been smaller in 1988
) 2° loooooooooooong gearlever stroke
Approximately twice as long as the 944's, extremely unprecise and "kaschlunk" feel
3° loooooooooooong clutch pedal stroke
At first I thought I was too close to the pedals (see point 1) but when I pushed the clucth I found out I was not close enough!
4° no rest place for the left foot
5° pedals not aligned with the steering wheel
6° funny ventilation
Even though I moved the seat forward in order to cure point 2°, I was not close enough to see out of the windscreen because the ventilation proved totally unable to get rid of enough mist
7° Wooden brake feel (car fitted with no ABS)
Good points:
1° Light steering, so light I thought it was PA, which was not the case
1bis° Front of the car very light, virtually no understeer at all
A good experience, after all.
I had never driven a 911 before but now I can criticise in the know
edited to add: why they sold more 911 in 1988 than 944 I definitely don't know...
>>> Edited by Thom on Monday 6th January 20:28
Have to say that most supercars of that age had bad driving positions,some a lot worse than the 930.You would be surprized how quickly you become acustomed to it.I am amazed that you found the steering light,mine was very heavy! As Danny says,its an aquired taste.
Steve
>> Edited by sb930turbo on Monday 6th January 21:54
Steve
>> Edited by sb930turbo on Monday 6th January 21:54
In 1991 I owned a 1986 one of these things. I had wanted a 911 Turbo for years but when I should have been able to afford one (the late 80's) the prices went through the roof (the yuppie era). When the dream was finally realised I survived for 11 weeks with it and was very happy to sell it. I replaced it with a 928GT which was twice the car. Again,in 2000, I decided a 993 would be needed. It survived a deal longer but still, aside of the looks, I really don't know what the fuss is about. I conclude that some people are just not cut out for 911 things, and despite a basic liking of them, I do get fed up with their shortcomings fairly quickly. Along with TVR's my wife has been instructed to hit me over the head with a silly stick if I suggest I might buy another !!
Thom - you don't mention the most important attribute of this car, it's performance! Surely this cannot have left you unimpressed? No disrespect to 944s (which I have driven and are great cars) but a 930 must surely have felt like a rocket by comparison?
The rest of the things you mention are quirks which in my opinion give the car character and make driving it different to most other things on the road.
I do most of my day to day driving in a boring 3-series Touring and taking out my 930 is always an event.
Still, life would be boring if we all valued the same things in a car!
Chris
The rest of the things you mention are quirks which in my opinion give the car character and make driving it different to most other things on the road.
I do most of my day to day driving in a boring 3-series Touring and taking out my 930 is always an event.
Still, life would be boring if we all valued the same things in a car!
Chris
Interestingly, in the 911's defence, the attributes vary enormously from model to model. An early 3.2 Carrera feels a different car completely to a 993 - although Thom may still dislike a few 'family' elements, like the floor mounted pedals or fixed steering wheel.
Anyway, Thom's points applied to a 964RS...
1° appalling driving position
Nope, it's just about perfect. The Recaro race seats help. Pedals are slightly offset and floor hinged, though, and the switchgear may take a little getting used to (but remember it is not as insane as some 911s as it has less switches for electrical items). I'd give it 8/10 - you can even heel and toe with a bit of practice.
2° loooooooooooong gearlever stroke
Not so in the short throw G50/10 - or even a normal 3.2, 964 or 993 variant of the G50. Lovely feel and action, very precise, and nicer than a 944's - and as Thom knows, I owned a turbo and S2 for a couple of years. Perfectly judged ratios for a sports car - pulls top speed at the rev limiter according to a friend who saw 175 on the clock in his.
3° loooooooooooong clutch pedal stroke
Not long in mine. This can normally be adjusted anyway. Floor mounted action a bit strange however.
4° no rest place for the left foot
I had a foot rest in mine, mainly to brace yourself when cornering hard. Plenty of room for one as pedals slightly offset. Mine was in boy racer drilled alloy.
5° pedals not aligned with the steering wheel
True, but never a massive problem. Not as bad a BMW M1 I drove!
6° funny ventilation
LOL, yeah, but the 964 onwards has a more modern climate control system, and my only comment was that it never got cold enough on hot days. Air con solves that, though. You get hot air more rapidly on a cold day through a 911's system than a water cooled car's. And my 964RS even had the excellent windscreen demist 'superblower' function. Brilliant. This gets rid of the mist problem you encountered, Thom.
7° Wooden brake feel (car fitted with no ABS)
Again, try a 964RS or later model. Superb brakes, tons of feel. Fade free. The 964RS has 965 Turbo four pots at the front and Cup car four pots at the back, slowing down something weighing 1190kgs.
So don't hate 911s just yet, Thom
>> Edited by domster on Tuesday 7th January 10:49
>> Edited by domster on Tuesday 7th January 12:30
Chris_N said: Thom - you don't mention the most important attribute of this car, it's performance! Surely this cannot have left you unimpressed? No disrespect to 944s (which I have driven and are great cars) but a 930 must surely have felt like a rocket by comparison?
Actually, not.
I guess that's because I had the opportunity to get in other pretty faster cars already.
I suppose you haven't been in a 944 Turbo Cup, you would understand what a really fast car is
edited:
I wish I'll have the opportunity to sample other models of 911 in the future, just to make sure they really are cars from another era; sorry but apart from the nice light steering, driving this 930 was even worse than what I had expected
>> Edited by Thom on Tuesday 7th January 21:57
Thom said: I suppose you haven't been in a 944 Turbo Cup, you would understand what a really fast car is
No never have. I did have a loan of a 944 Turbo for a weekend once though and that was a lot of fun and plenty fast but (though it might seem a strange thing to say) everything was a bit easy.
I think what I like about the 930 is that it is challenging and I know that I have got a long way to go to master it. I reckon if I still have it in a couple of years time I will still be learning how to exploit it.
With the 944 Turbo I found its limits in a weekend. Fun while it lasted but would pretty soon cease to be exciting. All IMHO of course!
Chris
I once had a lift to the station in a Ferrari 355. it was raining and the wipers didn't clear the whole screen, can you believe it? What crap cars Ferraris are, you'll never catch me buying one, I bet the F40's just the same too...and the 288 GTO and forget the Enzo too...to coin a phrase "I really don't know what the fuss is all about".
Dom, sold the RS then? Wotugotinstead?
Dom, sold the RS then? Wotugotinstead?
Rubystone. WOW! You have actually been in a FERRARI?!? I'd give my right nut for a go in one of those!!!
Don't know why everyone gets so excited about these Porky type cars though. Bloody 'orrible if you ask me.
Seems that Domster has realised this and thus sold his one rather hastily. He'll get a Caterham next you wait and see. Yep, a proper bloody car with a bit of heritage!
Don't know why everyone gets so excited about these Porky type cars though. Bloody 'orrible if you ask me.
Seems that Domster has realised this and thus sold his one rather hastily. He'll get a Caterham next you wait and see. Yep, a proper bloody car with a bit of heritage!
Yeah, I wouldn't slag off Ferraris rubystone - they sound nice at 8k revs, and they use less Fiat Uno bits than they used to. I'm a fan, for sure.
SL - I have already owned two Caterhams (used to commute in them for two years), and was indeed tempted to go for a Superlight R at Red Baron time. However, it looks like the Red Baron will have to go to make way for:
1) House deposit, or rather 'garage deposit'.
2) Ultima starter kit, as these are a tad safer than Caterhams I reckon (my biggest worry with them these days) and have a lot more top end. This is why the garage is needed.
3) BMW E36 3 series V8, professional conversion using a 4.0l BMW engine, as a runaround/something interesting until the Ultima gets assembled.
Cheers
Domster
SL - I have already owned two Caterhams (used to commute in them for two years), and was indeed tempted to go for a Superlight R at Red Baron time. However, it looks like the Red Baron will have to go to make way for:
1) House deposit, or rather 'garage deposit'.
2) Ultima starter kit, as these are a tad safer than Caterhams I reckon (my biggest worry with them these days) and have a lot more top end. This is why the garage is needed.
3) BMW E36 3 series V8, professional conversion using a 4.0l BMW engine, as a runaround/something interesting until the Ultima gets assembled.
Cheers
Domster
Domster,
Hope you're going to give early warning here if/when you do decide to sell the RS. I could potentially be interested. I must have listened to you sing the praises of RS's for long enough that I'm getting tempted to try one!
Presume the V8 in the E36 must be tuned otherwise isn't it going to be less powerful than an M3 Evo which you can pick up for sensible money?
Chris
Hope you're going to give early warning here if/when you do decide to sell the RS. I could potentially be interested. I must have listened to you sing the praises of RS's for long enough that I'm getting tempted to try one!
Presume the V8 in the E36 must be tuned otherwise isn't it going to be less powerful than an M3 Evo which you can pick up for sensible money?
Chris
Hi Chris
If it goes on 'the open market' I have a few people to email, and will include yourself. It looks like my mechanic may buy it and turn into a trackday monster, though, and I am happy for this as it will 'keep it in the family' and let me have a play in the Red Baron now and again.
Sadly, sensible house purchases and mental Ultima projects are tempting me to sell. The 911RS is the best 'sporting' Porsche I have ever driven, by a country mile - far better than a 993 C2, 964C2, 965 Turbo, 3.2 Carrera , 944 Cab, 944 Turbo, 968 etc. IMHO.
The BMW will push out around 300bhp, in between the 286 and 321bhp outputs of the M3s, but will have more torque than any variant. It will also be nicely different.
Cheers
Domster
If it goes on 'the open market' I have a few people to email, and will include yourself. It looks like my mechanic may buy it and turn into a trackday monster, though, and I am happy for this as it will 'keep it in the family' and let me have a play in the Red Baron now and again.
Sadly, sensible house purchases and mental Ultima projects are tempting me to sell. The 911RS is the best 'sporting' Porsche I have ever driven, by a country mile - far better than a 993 C2, 964C2, 965 Turbo, 3.2 Carrera , 944 Cab, 944 Turbo, 968 etc. IMHO.
The BMW will push out around 300bhp, in between the 286 and 321bhp outputs of the M3s, but will have more torque than any variant. It will also be nicely different.
Cheers
Domster
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