pulling away from lights- what would an elise beat???
Discussion
Dunno and Don't care. I think you'll find most of the peeps on here don't really go in for that sort of thing - leave it to the kids in their Corsas.
The point of the Elise is not straight line speed (although they can be made ballistically fast) but the fact that it may well be the best handling car ever made and the whole driving experience.
The point of the Elise is not straight line speed (although they can be made ballistically fast) but the fact that it may well be the best handling car ever made and the whole driving experience.
I find the problem is that someone who has a chip on their shoulder about this will jump the lights - power off on yellow is the norm.
This always makes me cringe as more often than not the junction is not clear at all.
Otherwise, I tend to find the opposite. Most cars next to me take a look and think ' what a car, bet that's fast..so I won't make myself look silly '. Yes, they don't bother with a race!
Suits me fine!
I think an Elise is pretty unbeatable up to 70mph, so long as you cane it and do not miss a gear change....then, if the road is straight, it can be pulled back. So if you do want to go for it, make sure the roads ahead are twisty....and dry!!!
This always makes me cringe as more often than not the junction is not clear at all.
Otherwise, I tend to find the opposite. Most cars next to me take a look and think ' what a car, bet that's fast..so I won't make myself look silly '. Yes, they don't bother with a race!
Suits me fine!
I think an Elise is pretty unbeatable up to 70mph, so long as you cane it and do not miss a gear change....then, if the road is straight, it can be pulled back. So if you do want to go for it, make sure the roads ahead are twisty....and dry!!!
From my experience at the dragstrip, in a "traffic light" grand prix, there's little that'll keep up with an Elise... Boxsters and Boxster Ss get left behind, lower level 911s are about even, as are Most (standard) evos/WRXs etc, everything lower than that is an easy-beat (GTis, VTECs etc).
The trouble comes (in a quarter mile drag) after about 60' then the Elise is only about as quick from there to the 400m mark as something like a DC2 SiR integra or perhaps a Si Prelude VTEC (Most of my racing has been at Honda club meets you see).
However, none of that really counts at the traffic lights as the race is over long before then.
The Elise is a pretty slow car in a straight line, but its light weight makes it spritely off the mark and can keep up with some pretty "hot" machinery.
The trouble comes (in a quarter mile drag) after about 60' then the Elise is only about as quick from there to the 400m mark as something like a DC2 SiR integra or perhaps a Si Prelude VTEC (Most of my racing has been at Honda club meets you see).
However, none of that really counts at the traffic lights as the race is over long before then.
The Elise is a pretty slow car in a straight line, but its light weight makes it spritely off the mark and can keep up with some pretty "hot" machinery.
Did somebody mention a dragstrip?
www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&f=23&t=257233&p=1
he he..
slinky
587racing.com
www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&f=23&t=257233&p=1
he he..
slinky
587racing.com
Seriously though, you need to look at the 0-60 of the car and the power to weight. It is important to look at both 0-60 and power to weight with the Elise, as it has a huge amount of traction because the engine is over the rear wheels, which results in a quicker 0-60 than its power to weight would suggest. 0-60 in 6.1 seconds from the standard car is only achievable by really capitalising on the grip off the line. From a rolling start, an Elise would have a job beating another car that produced 0-60 in 6 seconds from a less advantageous layout (say, front engined rear drive for instance).
Aside from power to weight ratio, you've also got to look at absolute power. Acceleration obviously obeys Newton's second law (Force = mass multilpied by acceleration), so looked at simply power to weight determines acceleration. However, top speed is also relevant here because that is simply a balance of power and drag - nothing to do with weight. The top speed of the Elise is only around 130mph, because of its low power (the low weight is irrelevant for top speed), so in a blast away from the lights, acceleration will be tailing off due to the imminent approach of this top speed fairly quickly. The Caterham that I had was a good example of this - it would rocket away from a standstill like a err...rocket, but once up beyond 80mph you didn't stand a chance against anything properly quick.
If you're interested in power to weights, let's compare the Elise with a quickish exec salooon:
Standard S2 Elise: I think they weigh about 750kg? Let's assume the driver is 80kg and the power output is 120bhp. That gives 144bhp/tonne.
A current BMW 330 saloon: These used to weigh 1475, but now are probably about 1550kg. Add the same driver at 80kg and combine with 258bhp and we have 158bhp/tonne, so 14 more than the Elise.
Now, off the line the Elise is going to have a big advantage, as the driver can just bury the throttle without any wheelspin. I know from experience that the 330 requires a bit more delicacy than that, as its front engined layout doesn't give as much traction. Once up and running, the 330 will pull away from the Elise simply because of the higher power to weight ratio, and then as the speed increases the Elise's accleration will tail off due to its low top speed. The 330 would probably do over 165mph without the limiter, so it isn't as troubled by it's drag vs power as the Elise is.
OK, so the Elise just got creamed there. We can use the above analysis to make a foregon conclusion of some other cars such as the Boxster S (more power than the 330 and lighter too!), Nissan 350Z (more power than the BMW, and a similar weight).
Battling against a front wheel drive car would be a totally different matter, especially in the wet. The traction in the Elise is so great that its early advantage may stick throughout.
At the end of the day, the Elise isn't the fastest thing around - far from it. I can afford plenty of faster cars, and choose not to drive them though. For me, I can easily put up with the lack of straight line speed in order to gain the other obvious charms of the Elise.
Aside from power to weight ratio, you've also got to look at absolute power. Acceleration obviously obeys Newton's second law (Force = mass multilpied by acceleration), so looked at simply power to weight determines acceleration. However, top speed is also relevant here because that is simply a balance of power and drag - nothing to do with weight. The top speed of the Elise is only around 130mph, because of its low power (the low weight is irrelevant for top speed), so in a blast away from the lights, acceleration will be tailing off due to the imminent approach of this top speed fairly quickly. The Caterham that I had was a good example of this - it would rocket away from a standstill like a err...rocket, but once up beyond 80mph you didn't stand a chance against anything properly quick.
If you're interested in power to weights, let's compare the Elise with a quickish exec salooon:
Standard S2 Elise: I think they weigh about 750kg? Let's assume the driver is 80kg and the power output is 120bhp. That gives 144bhp/tonne.
A current BMW 330 saloon: These used to weigh 1475, but now are probably about 1550kg. Add the same driver at 80kg and combine with 258bhp and we have 158bhp/tonne, so 14 more than the Elise.
Now, off the line the Elise is going to have a big advantage, as the driver can just bury the throttle without any wheelspin. I know from experience that the 330 requires a bit more delicacy than that, as its front engined layout doesn't give as much traction. Once up and running, the 330 will pull away from the Elise simply because of the higher power to weight ratio, and then as the speed increases the Elise's accleration will tail off due to its low top speed. The 330 would probably do over 165mph without the limiter, so it isn't as troubled by it's drag vs power as the Elise is.
OK, so the Elise just got creamed there. We can use the above analysis to make a foregon conclusion of some other cars such as the Boxster S (more power than the 330 and lighter too!), Nissan 350Z (more power than the BMW, and a similar weight).
Battling against a front wheel drive car would be a totally different matter, especially in the wet. The traction in the Elise is so great that its early advantage may stick throughout.
At the end of the day, the Elise isn't the fastest thing around - far from it. I can afford plenty of faster cars, and choose not to drive them though. For me, I can easily put up with the lack of straight line speed in order to gain the other obvious charms of the Elise.
the elise has very good low speed acceleration to 60 or 70, there all pretty fast up to that point, faster than that and you need a 111s or 111r to keep the momentum going since most gp grandprix are over well before you get to 60 let alone faster as has been said already even a standard car should power off the line pretty fast, at the end of the day a quick takeoff is about driver skill as much as anything else, if the elise is nice an easy to lanch then thats worth a good chunk of time in itself, its all well an good looking at 0-60s etc but unless ur a test driver the chances of you getting anywere near that on the road is pretty much zero, so a car that the average driver can lanch off the line consistantly to say within 80% of its quoted 0 - 60 is clearly going to be faster than one were you can only average 70% realy world performance can be a world away from quoted figures from what i've seen on video's etc the elise tends to get off the mark pretty fast compared to a lot of cars
One disadvantage some higher powered cars have is the traction issues off the line. My rx at ~1300kg inc driver (~265bhp/ton) would, on paper, muller an elise but in reality I'd struggle to put down the power in 1st and 2nd gears if I simply booted it. On the road that's up to just over 70mph. Gearing might also be important... what are the optimum shift points in 0-80 for the Elise?
I suspect the same issues for TVR drivers and other cars without TC!
I suspect the same issues for TVR drivers and other cars without TC!
Gassing Station | Elise/Exige/Europa/340R | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff