Q. for JR and BTB re: accident on private land?
Discussion
John, et al . . . could you tell me the legal position if someone hits my and another car in a private car park (with public access) and then scarpers?
We have video of the git hitting the first car and witnesses seeing him hit the second car and have his registration.
The local police say it is nothing to do with them and to seek redress through the small claims court.
Should I inform my insurance company and will they follow up this on my behalf or do I just have to take it on the chin.
All advice welcome.
Thanks,
Tony
We have video of the git hitting the first car and witnesses seeing him hit the second car and have his registration.
The local police say it is nothing to do with them and to seek redress through the small claims court.
Should I inform my insurance company and will they follow up this on my behalf or do I just have to take it on the chin.
All advice welcome.
Thanks,
Tony
Few things.
If you have legal expenses cover on your insurance, given them the evidence and sit back.
Yes - you should inform your insurance co of the "event" - even if you do not make a further claim. Give them the reg. number of the car and again, let them follow it up for you. They have access to the MIIC (Motor Insurers Information Centre) and so will be able to trace if the other car has made a claim easily. 1+1=2 if he has.
Give the duty sargent a ring. Even though it was on private land, it is still criminal damage and hence I would have thought that they would still be oblidge to investigate - but MC or someone will know more than me.
You are entitled to ask DVLA to reveal the address of the registered keeper so you can serve a summons - your insurance co. solicitor or a private one can help here.
First place will be your insurance co - they should help.
J
If you have legal expenses cover on your insurance, given them the evidence and sit back.
Yes - you should inform your insurance co of the "event" - even if you do not make a further claim. Give them the reg. number of the car and again, let them follow it up for you. They have access to the MIIC (Motor Insurers Information Centre) and so will be able to trace if the other car has made a claim easily. 1+1=2 if he has.
Give the duty sargent a ring. Even though it was on private land, it is still criminal damage and hence I would have thought that they would still be oblidge to investigate - but MC or someone will know more than me.
You are entitled to ask DVLA to reveal the address of the registered keeper so you can serve a summons - your insurance co. solicitor or a private one can help here.
First place will be your insurance co - they should help.
J
joust said: Give the duty sargent a ring. Even though it was on private land, it is still criminal damage and hence I would have thought that they would still be oblidge to investigate - but MC or someone will know more than me.
Only criminal damage if it was intentional. No one will know of the intention until the perpetrator is arrested and questioned. That however (arresting him) is unlikely unless the offender is seen to aim the vehicle at yours or take two or three strikes at it.
You are entitled to ask DVLA to reveal the address of the registered keeper so you can serve a summons - your insurance co. solicitor or a private one can help here.
You can get this information but only after parting with the relevant fee.
First place will be your insurance co - they should help.
J
I would agree with that.
There is a certain amount of case law from the court of appeal in relation to this type of incident and you will find that even if the public have access on payment or otherwise, the car park will not be classed as a road in relation to failing to stop after an accident or failing to report an accident or indeed the requirement to have insurance.
Because the car park is not 'a road' in law. there is no requirement to have insurance at third party risk
I posted a long thread on this very subject some months ago. I cannot remember the thread title and am a luddite when it comes to resurecting the specific thread so there is a link on this post
That does not mean that you cannot make a complaint of careless driving though.
Section 3 Road Traffic Act 1988 states that
If a person drives a mechanically propelled vehicle on a road or other public place without due care and attention, or without reasonable consideration for other persons using the road or place, he is guilty of an offence.
Whether a public place is in fact a 'public place' for the purposes of the Road Traffic Act, will be a question of fact for the court.
If the driver of another vehicle has collided with yours then that would be good evidence.
You can make a formal complaint about this by attending the Police station and if you have video evidence, all the better.
Try the search engine on threads under 'public place', 'court of appeal', 'car parks' 'Lordships'
That might throw the specific post up for you. It was long and I do not particularly wish to type the whole lot again.
I will if you have difficulty finding it.
Basically a car park is for parking cars and has no other relation to a road other than parking cars.
The court of appeal ruled on the former and that only in exceptional circumstances would a car park become a road but they did not say what those circumstances were likley to be!
Try the Insurance Company first
I hope that helps.
>> Edited by madcop on Wednesday 22 January 03:50
Found the post.
It is called 'Had a bump. Do I tell the ins Co.'
It is in General Gassing and was started on 3rd October 2002.
If you put 'Clarke V Kato' into the search engine that should bring it straight up as this is the case law that governs this ruling.
Page 3 of the thread will be the most important. It contains all you need to know
Happy hunting!
>> Edited by madcop on Wednesday 22 January 04:10
It is called 'Had a bump. Do I tell the ins Co.'
It is in General Gassing and was started on 3rd October 2002.
If you put 'Clarke V Kato' into the search engine that should bring it straight up as this is the case law that governs this ruling.
Page 3 of the thread will be the most important. It contains all you need to know
Happy hunting!
>> Edited by madcop on Wednesday 22 January 04:10
Nice one MC.. and for the benefit of others.. heres the link to it. 
www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?t=18745&f=23&h=0&hw
>> Edited by M@H on Wednesday 22 January 10:27
www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?t=18745&f=23&h=0&hw
>> Edited by M@H on Wednesday 22 January 10:27
Thanks for the info MC.
It wasn't actually me (m-five) asking the question, but a friend that I lent my PH account to.
The video shows him enter one end of the car park, getting stuck at the locked/closed gate and reversing back into my mates car.
There is more to the story as there are witnesses from the building next to ours (where the other car was hit), that when they saw the first incident they tried to wave the driver down to stop. He immediately tried to do a 180 and scarper, but the road was not wide enough and he ended up doing a lot more damage to the second car than the first.
The car park used to be used as a short cut to another part of the industrial estate, but the second gate has been closed. We have checked out all the other businesses on the estate and none of them have any info about the van that was involved and he was not delivering anything.
They are both informing our respective insurance companies and using each other as witnesses, i.e. we have the video, and the other witness was one of the ones trying to flag the van down.
The duty officer was useless and said that unless the driver injured someone they were not prepared to take action. Unfortunately my mate git a bit lippy and threatened to do some damage to the other van/driver if he ever saw it again on the car park (and mentioned that the Police could do nothing as it was 'private land').
So we'll have to see where it ends up. I can see the insurance company doing bugger all and upping my mate's premium for the sake of it though.
I'll see if I can digitise the video - of the boss releases it to us!
It wasn't actually me (m-five) asking the question, but a friend that I lent my PH account to.
The video shows him enter one end of the car park, getting stuck at the locked/closed gate and reversing back into my mates car.
There is more to the story as there are witnesses from the building next to ours (where the other car was hit), that when they saw the first incident they tried to wave the driver down to stop. He immediately tried to do a 180 and scarper, but the road was not wide enough and he ended up doing a lot more damage to the second car than the first.
The car park used to be used as a short cut to another part of the industrial estate, but the second gate has been closed. We have checked out all the other businesses on the estate and none of them have any info about the van that was involved and he was not delivering anything.
They are both informing our respective insurance companies and using each other as witnesses, i.e. we have the video, and the other witness was one of the ones trying to flag the van down.
The duty officer was useless and said that unless the driver injured someone they were not prepared to take action. Unfortunately my mate git a bit lippy and threatened to do some damage to the other van/driver if he ever saw it again on the car park (and mentioned that the Police could do nothing as it was 'private land').
So we'll have to see where it ends up. I can see the insurance company doing bugger all and upping my mate's premium for the sake of it though.
I'll see if I can digitise the video - of the boss releases it to us!
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