Brands Hatch question
Discussion
Never driven or even been to BH.
Couple of nights ago, watched the Formula BMW and Formula Renault on the box and they were both at Brands (Indy Circuit).
In both races, I was surprised at the approach of all of the drivers at one particular bend.
It was a sweeping right hander going in to a dip. Looking at the map, I'm wondering if it was paddock Hill Bend.
Anyway, on the exit, there seemed to be about one and a half car's width of that astro turf stuff between the kerb and the gravel.
All of the cars seemed to like to use all of this astro turf stuff on the exit which seemed a bit weird to me.
Any thought?
Cheers,
Eric
Couple of nights ago, watched the Formula BMW and Formula Renault on the box and they were both at Brands (Indy Circuit).
In both races, I was surprised at the approach of all of the drivers at one particular bend.
It was a sweeping right hander going in to a dip. Looking at the map, I'm wondering if it was paddock Hill Bend.
Anyway, on the exit, there seemed to be about one and a half car's width of that astro turf stuff between the kerb and the gravel.
All of the cars seemed to like to use all of this astro turf stuff on the exit which seemed a bit weird to me.
Any thought?
Cheers,
Eric
jacobyte said:
Yes, it's Paddock Hill Bend. The "strip of astroturf" is tarmac (or was when I last checked) .
Yep its tarmac, been painted green though, if its wet stay off it...its like ice in the rain!
I have to admit, Paddock Hill is one of my favourite corners, closely followed by Bomb Hole at snetterton.
Michal
jacobyte said:Aha, that explains it. I guess I was confused 'cos it's green.
The "strip of astroturf" is tarmac ...
wee_skids said:Aye, you'd have thought the officials would be a bit more strict about that.
... although you are supposed to stay between the white lines on the track edges!
Thanks for the replies - cleared it up for me.
Cheers,
Eric
Widest exit equals the quickest racing line and the concrete on the exit allows them to keep the power on even after they've technically left the circuit. BH are very aware of this and in the sprint I did there a couple of months back, both wheels off the circuit on the exit of Paddock Hill bend incurred a penalty iirc but guess it's ok for certain races dependant on the organisers.
I went to the GP at Monza a couple of years back and was great to watch the cars through Lesmo 2 - they would be completely 'off' the track exiting the corner at 150+ and showed the commitment they all had. Even gave me a new respect for the journeymen in F1, Alex Yoong included!
I went to the GP at Monza a couple of years back and was great to watch the cars through Lesmo 2 - they would be completely 'off' the track exiting the corner at 150+ and showed the commitment they all had. Even gave me a new respect for the journeymen in F1, Alex Yoong included!
You're supposed to stay within the white lines, as dictated by Jonathan Palmer, having spend lots of £££'s to tidy up these areas, the exit of Paddock in particular. I believe that the run-off is supposed to help those drivers who have lost control, and gives them extra room to collect the car before hitting the gravel, and rolling - as many seem to do.
In practice though, everyone takes more kerb into the corners and rides the kerbs on the exit. You will see this even more so at the next corner, Druids. Everyone clips the (apex)kerbs on the way in, then runs out onto the kerbs on the exit. The real loonies will go over the exit kerbs and use the grass-crete, which is between the kerbs and the grass itself. Again, MSV don't like you doing it, but since the BTCC boys started it all they can hardly let them get away with it but punish the other racers. In some cars it will lose you time, but in the vast majority you will gain a few 10ths simply by having less steering lock. This reduces tyre scrub, giving higher exit speeds.
In practice though, everyone takes more kerb into the corners and rides the kerbs on the exit. You will see this even more so at the next corner, Druids. Everyone clips the (apex)kerbs on the way in, then runs out onto the kerbs on the exit. The real loonies will go over the exit kerbs and use the grass-crete, which is between the kerbs and the grass itself. Again, MSV don't like you doing it, but since the BTCC boys started it all they can hardly let them get away with it but punish the other racers. In some cars it will lose you time, but in the vast majority you will gain a few 10ths simply by having less steering lock. This reduces tyre scrub, giving higher exit speeds.
A view of Paddock Hill from the Outside of Druids...
It's an awesome corner and one of the best viewing spots on the track, specially if you're in the habit of snapping a pic or 2.
It's painted green because Dr Palmer is obsessed with grass and goes loopy if anyone damages his turf
>> Edited by monkeyhanger on Thursday 1st June 17:00
It's an awesome corner and one of the best viewing spots on the track, specially if you're in the habit of snapping a pic or 2.
It's painted green because Dr Palmer is obsessed with grass and goes loopy if anyone damages his turf
>> Edited by monkeyhanger on Thursday 1st June 17:00
PHB is super scary the first 50 or so times round it. My only experience of it so far is on a track day in the torrential rain. Must be awesom in the dry with bigger cahoonas than I have. The steepness of the drop only really hits you when the suspension's under compression at the bottom and you're being pressed down into the seat.
I think I got out of the car an inch shorter than I got in.
We're really lucky in the UK as we have some really great pieces of tarmac to go play on. Kraner Curves at Donington are also pretty dramatic.
I think I got out of the car an inch shorter than I got in.
We're really lucky in the UK as we have some really great pieces of tarmac to go play on. Kraner Curves at Donington are also pretty dramatic.
To be honest the BTCC and the televised support races do national motorsport no good. Standards in the BTCC are pretty poor in terms of UK racing rules. The stewards should have most of the drivers up at every meet. The race track is between the white lines. At many places they are totally off circuit with extreme corner cutting that other UK champsionships would punish.
As a racer you should be accurate enough to place the car within mm's of the black 'floppies' on the corners not simply steam roller over the buggers like the BTCC boys.
What with massive corner cutting and excessive 'nerrfing' they are encouraging the wrong sort of racing in other UK championships.
The UK racing rules are relaxed for the BTCC to aid televised excitment but it just means johhny x at a club race the following saturday thinks its ok to cut a corner totally and punt a competitor of the track.
As a racer you should be accurate enough to place the car within mm's of the black 'floppies' on the corners not simply steam roller over the buggers like the BTCC boys.
What with massive corner cutting and excessive 'nerrfing' they are encouraging the wrong sort of racing in other UK championships.
The UK racing rules are relaxed for the BTCC to aid televised excitment but it just means johhny x at a club race the following saturday thinks its ok to cut a corner totally and punt a competitor of the track.
Great bend - change of camber and crest on braking, turn in, adverse camber, downhill, compression at the bottom and up the other side to Druids.
Yonks ago, the bit where all that kitty litter is used to be the corner with very little run off at all. They then built the current bend inside that (early 80's from memory) but left all the old tarmac on the outside with a kerb in between. You would get a bad boy warning if you used the old tarmac after going in too hot, and for repeated excursions, black flagged.
Yonks ago, the bit where all that kitty litter is used to be the corner with very little run off at all. They then built the current bend inside that (early 80's from memory) but left all the old tarmac on the outside with a kerb in between. You would get a bad boy warning if you used the old tarmac after going in too hot, and for repeated excursions, black flagged.
Try and get hold of Peter Swinger's book - "English Racing Circuits - Then and Now". All major (and many minor) tracks are covered with lots of circuit diagrams showing the evolution of the various tracks. Brands Hatch is included, of course.
Watching Jim Clark three wheeling a Lotus Cortina around the old Paddock Hill bend is amazing.
Watching Jim Clark three wheeling a Lotus Cortina around the old Paddock Hill bend is amazing.
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