Jail terms for young offenders to be scrapped!!!
Discussion
From the Indypedant today:
http://news.independent.co.uk/uk/crime/story.jsp?story=373114
http://news.independent.co.uk/uk/crime/story.jsp?story=373114
Tough on crime.. etc..
Jail terms for young offenders to be scrapped
Thousands of persistent young offenders will escape going to prison under government plans to scrap a flagship scheme to punish prolific teenage criminals.
The Youth Justice Board, attached to the Home Office, has recommended to ministers that it abandons the short Detention and Training Order (DTO), introduced by the former home secretary Jack Straw to tackle repeat offenders. The plan would mean that 3,000 teenagers who would have been jailed each year would instead be sent on community-based programmes.
The development follows research by Oxford University's department of criminology that found the DTO, which combines a custodial sentence with an equal period under supervision in the community, was ineffective. The report found that when such offenders returned home they were given an average of only 90 minutes supervision a week for up to three months, even though they were supposed to still be serving a sentence.
One official described the result as "pathetic".
As a result, the Youth Justice Board has advised ministers that the short DTO was a "waste of time" that should be allowed to "wither on the vine" as it was replaced by alternative punishments.
Officials said the dropping of the short DTO was not a cost-cutting measure, although it would lead to savings of about £14m a year and reduce the youth prison population from 2,800 to about 2,000.
The DTO originally proved attractive to magistrates as it combined a mixture of prison and community punishment and was seen to offer both a deterrent and rehabilitation. But the scheme was badly hit by the soaring youth prison population last year, when public alarm over street crime led to a sharp rise in use of custody and young offender institutions became heavily overcrowded.
Ministers are being advised to replace the short DTOs with a new year-long punishment called an Intensive Supervision and Surveillance Programme (ISSP). The Oxford research found that a six-month version of the ISSP, which includes offenders being given work-based training, literacy classes, anger management and drug treatment, as well as being taken by "mentors" to the cinema and football matches, was successful.
No soap box rant here, but, nobody wants to see impresionable first time offenders doing time with hardend nut cases, like wise the hardend nut cases and serious offenders need to be off the streets and in serious rehabilitation before anybody ever considers letting them out. I hope that the government gets the mix right, but somehow I doubt it.
When you consider the experience of sentencing that MadCop recounted today:
www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?t=27559&f=23&h=0&p=3
Perhaps, by letting all the scrotes out and jailing decent people forced to retaliate or defend themselves - even if they make restitution - they can get to the point where the 58,930,000 scrotes are free to walk the streets and the 70,000 with any scruples at all are all safely locked up in prison where they can't impede the human rights of the scrotes.
The scrotes will close the borders to all non UK passport holders, pending a successful visa application. They will then repeal all speed limits and sell all Gatsos to the French Government in exchange for cheap cigarettes and whiskey.
Anyone who breaks their code of ethics will face serious consequences which act as a powerful deterrent against anti-anti-social behaviour.
Scrupulous prisoners will get early release for buggering and murdering their fellow inmates. But not for breaking their playstation or teaching them to read.
Pah - Huxley and Orwell were wide of the mark.
www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?t=27559&f=23&h=0&p=3
It makes you wonder what their end game is.
A couple of cases from my local paper this week.
1) 52 year old accounts manager in a reasonably large firm is in front of the Judge who tells him that he is basically a decent chap who has gone through a mid life crisis and in his attempt to woo his girlfriend, managed to lavish £32,000 of the company funds on doing so through false accounting and theft.
He realised his foolishness, admitted to his firm what he had done, went back to his wife and sold their house so that he could repay all the money he took.
Judge says he is guilty of a major breach of trust and gives him 3 years.
2) Local scumbag up in front of a Judge at the same court for a series of street robberies to enable him to feed his heroin habit. Two of the robberies were on elderly people. Three were on young people and one of them was injured by a knife slash requiring stiches.
Cash and mobile phones were his target.
Judge says he is a horrible miscreant that should be going down for 5 years. But because he has read the social enquiry report and is so very impressed about how the offender is coping with attempts to get off his adiction, he will give him a drug rehabilitation order instead of the 5 years.
Perhaps, by letting all the scrotes out and jailing decent people forced to retaliate or defend themselves - even if they make restitution - they can get to the point where the 58,930,000 scrotes are free to walk the streets and the 70,000 with any scruples at all are all safely locked up in prison where they can't impede the human rights of the scrotes.
The scrotes will close the borders to all non UK passport holders, pending a successful visa application. They will then repeal all speed limits and sell all Gatsos to the French Government in exchange for cheap cigarettes and whiskey.
Anyone who breaks their code of ethics will face serious consequences which act as a powerful deterrent against anti-anti-social behaviour.
Scrupulous prisoners will get early release for buggering and murdering their fellow inmates. But not for breaking their playstation or teaching them to read.
Pah - Huxley and Orwell were wide of the mark.
Britain 2003.......... break into a car, smash up someones property, burgle them and rob them, take illegal drugs then blame it on a broken home, assault OAPs in their own home, shoplift and vandalise, rape and even kill,.... the penalty in Britain 2003? A slap on the wrist, and community service.
Exceed a ferkin stoopid speed limit and its GO TO JAIL> DO NOT PASS GO>DO NOT COLLECT 200 SOVS.
Whats wrong with this picture?....anyone?...a free mugging prize goes to the first ten correct answers, on a postcard to:
Are you totally fed up in Britain?
Its a disgrace street,
Skumbags rule ok,
Britain, The biggest Shithole in the world.
Exceed a ferkin stoopid speed limit and its GO TO JAIL> DO NOT PASS GO>DO NOT COLLECT 200 SOVS.
Whats wrong with this picture?....anyone?...a free mugging prize goes to the first ten correct answers, on a postcard to:
Are you totally fed up in Britain?
Its a disgrace street,
Skumbags rule ok,
Britain, The biggest Shithole in the world.
deltaf said: Britain 2003.......... break into a car, smash up someones property, burgle them and rob them, take illegal drugs then blame it on a broken home, assault OAPs in their own home, shoplift and vandalise, rape and even kill,.... the penalty in Britain 2003? A slap on the wrist, and community service.
Exceed a ferkin stoopid speed limit and its GO TO JAIL> DO NOT PASS GO>DO NOT COLLECT 200 SOVS.
Whats wrong with this picture?....anyone?...a free mugging prize goes to the first ten correct answers, on a postcard to:
Are you totally fed up in Britain?
Its a disgrace street,
Skumbags rule ok,
Britain, The biggest Shithole in the world.
Well why don't you just f**k off then?
They shoudl ahve community service orders of hard physical labour on chain gangs, 12 hours a day, 7 days a week so the scroats are too tired to do anything when they get home, save the cost of housing them. If they don't turn up one day, they get dragged down by irate alsations and left chained there for the remainder of their sentence. That'll teach the little shits. Might also have a decent deterrent effect as well as having the worthless maggots do something useful for a change.
CarZee said:One can but dream, Denny...
DennisTheMenace said: Damn when i read the title to the thread i thought they might have brought back hanging
Oh sweet sweet dream...
Ah, but they will. For speeding, or perhaps also for defending your family and property.
Tough on common sense, tough on the causes of common sense.
Why not have the scrotes serve a multi-layered sentence say : A period of stalinist hard labour and bang-up time, followed by a period of boot camp and labour gangs, followed by a period of community detention involving community-based-benefitting projects and return to the institute at night-time, and finally home-curfews or tagging and community sentences.
Typically 10 years for burlary split up into 3 years hard time, 3 years boot camp building/repairing fcuking roads, 3 years community detention, 1 year home-curfew.
Fcuk up at any stage and you step back to the previous.
Typically 10 years for burlary split up into 3 years hard time, 3 years boot camp building/repairing fcuking roads, 3 years community detention, 1 year home-curfew.
Fcuk up at any stage and you step back to the previous.
tvrsag - no onewants to see impressionable first timers locked up with hard crims
I applaud your liberal instincts - sincerely
I think the article refers to Persistent offenders,
Basically the CJS needs to be clearer about the esculator for crime
1st offence non violent - caution/fine
1st offence violent - community supervision order & suspended jail term
2nd offence non violent community supervision order & suspended jail & education /support program
2nd offence violent Jail & rehabiliation
3rd ofence either case Jail
4th offence - hang them by piano wire from a lamp post in the sink estate they came from and invite decent people to spit on their good dead bodies
Sometimes here on ph we jump in without considering some of the wider issues - this actually might be a good piece of rehab decision making - it needs to be properly funded and the DELIVERY needs to be better.
I applaud your liberal instincts - sincerely
I think the article refers to Persistent offenders,
Basically the CJS needs to be clearer about the esculator for crime
1st offence non violent - caution/fine
1st offence violent - community supervision order & suspended jail term
2nd offence non violent community supervision order & suspended jail & education /support program
2nd offence violent Jail & rehabiliation
3rd ofence either case Jail
4th offence - hang them by piano wire from a lamp post in the sink estate they came from and invite decent people to spit on their good dead bodies
Sometimes here on ph we jump in without considering some of the wider issues - this actually might be a good piece of rehab decision making - it needs to be properly funded and the DELIVERY needs to be better.
swilly said: Why not have the scrotes serve a multi-layered sentence say : A period of stalinist hard labour and bang-up time, followed by a period of boot camp and labour gangs, followed by a period of community detention involving community-based-benefitting projects and return to the institute at night-time, and finally home-curfews or tagging and community sentences.
Typically 10 years for burlary split up into 3 years hard time, 3 years boot camp building/repairing fcuking roads, 3 years community detention, 1 year home-curfew.
Fcuk up at any stage and you step back to the previous.
I would expect that this would be suprisingly effective for an awfull lot of people.
Add in drug rehab where neccesary and it sounds like a rather cunning plan. Enough of a carrot for someone to behave, enough of a stick to make them wish they had.
The problem is no matter what the punishment, its worthess if its not applied correctly by the courts.
Swilly
I applaud some of your ideas.
Lets face it knowing that the offenders are living it up with tv, videos, pocket money, etc etc is very hard for the majority of us to swallow, how can this be paying back the community they offended against??
It would be good to see these types of criminals engaged in hard labour programs such as road building/renewing, urban regeneration (land clearance etc) playground building, or any basic community program that needs physical labour to complete.
These people have to give something back, perhaps the level of the give back they provide could be used to adjust their parole, lots of work equals early release and vice versa.
This type of activity could even generate money for the prison service so as it isn't as reliant upon the tax payers (see the shawshank redemption but not lining the pocket of the prison govener).
I applaud some of your ideas.
Lets face it knowing that the offenders are living it up with tv, videos, pocket money, etc etc is very hard for the majority of us to swallow, how can this be paying back the community they offended against??
It would be good to see these types of criminals engaged in hard labour programs such as road building/renewing, urban regeneration (land clearance etc) playground building, or any basic community program that needs physical labour to complete.
These people have to give something back, perhaps the level of the give back they provide could be used to adjust their parole, lots of work equals early release and vice versa.
This type of activity could even generate money for the prison service so as it isn't as reliant upon the tax payers (see the shawshank redemption but not lining the pocket of the prison govener).
Lets read the title of the thread first guys!
"Jail terms for young offenders to be scrapped"
This is just a ploy by the labour scumbags in power to "tune" the statistics at some time in the future! As is the "burglars not to be pursued" thingy. All it will mean is that at some time Billy Liar and his Cronies will trot out some guff about having been "hard on crime" and "we have the statistics to prove it!!!!!!!!!!!"
NEVER EVER believe statistics UNLESS YOU HAVE MADE THEM UP YOURSELF!!!
That's why the real majority in Britain is still getting royally screwed by these labour scum, as Labour make up statistics all the time and the gullible majority don't speak out against their utter lies!
ANYONE for Revolution?
"Jail terms for young offenders to be scrapped"
This is just a ploy by the labour scumbags in power to "tune" the statistics at some time in the future! As is the "burglars not to be pursued" thingy. All it will mean is that at some time Billy Liar and his Cronies will trot out some guff about having been "hard on crime" and "we have the statistics to prove it!!!!!!!!!!!"
NEVER EVER believe statistics UNLESS YOU HAVE MADE THEM UP YOURSELF!!!
That's why the real majority in Britain is still getting royally screwed by these labour scum, as Labour make up statistics all the time and the gullible majority don't speak out against their utter lies!
ANYONE for Revolution?
deltaf said:
Are you totally fed up in Britain?
Its a disgrace street,
Skumbags rule ok,
Britain, The biggest Shithole in the world.
Added to which indignity many urban areas look more like the shanty dwellings of Cape Town more than habitats for subjects living in the alleged 4th biggest economy in this world.
It's bloody Bliar!
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