The CV8 brake debate
Discussion
I thought I would put in my 2 cents for what it was worth....probably half pence!
Anyway the brakes on the CV8 do work...BUT...they lack initial bite and are wooden (have no feel). In saying that I mean when I first got the car I pulled out of a side street onto the main road and gassed it with a friend grinning in the passenger seat. I suddenly noticed the car in front was fast approaching (slow bugger) and hit the brakes............I truly thought that myself and my passenger I was showing off to were going to plow into the back of said car as when I hit the brakes nothing seemed to happen in the way of bite or initial speed reduction.
I did stop but it didn't feel like I would. I have the same issue between two motorcyles I own. A 2001 Yamaha R1 (awesome brakes with great initial bite and great feel) and a 2001 GSXR1000 (no initial bite and no feel).
The bikes both have similar size discs and the GSXR has six piston calipers which is more than the R1 at four, plus the GSXR is lighter.
The GSXR can be greatly improved by upgrading the pads, could this help the CV8 instead of chucking 2k at AP's?
In saying this I agree that inherently it would appear that the CV8 is like my GSXR, they both appear to have below par standard brakes but it could be in the pads.
Anyway the brakes on the CV8 do work...BUT...they lack initial bite and are wooden (have no feel). In saying that I mean when I first got the car I pulled out of a side street onto the main road and gassed it with a friend grinning in the passenger seat. I suddenly noticed the car in front was fast approaching (slow bugger) and hit the brakes............I truly thought that myself and my passenger I was showing off to were going to plow into the back of said car as when I hit the brakes nothing seemed to happen in the way of bite or initial speed reduction.
I did stop but it didn't feel like I would. I have the same issue between two motorcyles I own. A 2001 Yamaha R1 (awesome brakes with great initial bite and great feel) and a 2001 GSXR1000 (no initial bite and no feel).
The bikes both have similar size discs and the GSXR has six piston calipers which is more than the R1 at four, plus the GSXR is lighter.
The GSXR can be greatly improved by upgrading the pads, could this help the CV8 instead of chucking 2k at AP's?
In saying this I agree that inherently it would appear that the CV8 is like my GSXR, they both appear to have below par standard brakes but it could be in the pads.
Mate, your GSXR has 6 pot calipers right? The standard CV8 brakes have 2 pots and 1 pots!!!! They are ok just at standard power levels but when you start doing mods I reckon they need changing (although we didn't!). Why don't the companies (LSV, Wortec etc.) release a half-way house brake kit like the harrop kits in aus? Surely a lot more affordable and with a much wider audience who just want to upgrade to something capable of managing the car but don't want to blow £2K?
test123 said:
My objective @ LSV was to offer you the customer the best brakes AP's (imo) for least money!
I feel this has been achieved...@ £2085 inc fitting & vat!
DOUG
I feel this has been achieved...@ £2085 inc fitting & vat!
DOUG
Hi Doug, I guess my point was more around that standard brakes should handle the standard power of the vehicle.
Rather than everyone who owns one having to spend 2k on brakes when they are not substantially increasing the power of the vehicle it would seem that it may be worth looking at better brake pads.
I'm in process of working out what upgrades I'd like to do and for my tuppence worth I'd say the first thing you should do with upgrading any car is improve its ability to stop, before you make it go faster. Now if I wasn't intending to do other upgrades then I might not consider going the full hog and buying AP's but I would still want to upgrade to at least the VXR brakes. I am not at all confident in the standard brakes ability to stop the car. The brakes on the girlfriend's 2l turbo signum perform far better than my Monaro's and have a much more positive feel to them.
Well_Fans said:
I'm in process of working out what upgrades I'd like to do and for my tuppence worth I'd say the first thing you should do with upgrading any car is improve its ability to stop, before you make it go faster. Now if I wasn't intending to do other upgrades then I might not consider going the full hog and buying AP's but I would still want to upgrade to at least the VXR brakes. I am not at all confident in the standard brakes ability to stop the car. The brakes on the girlfriend's 2l turbo signum perform far better than my Monaro's and have a much more positive feel to them.
I had a 97 Honda Civic company car years ago with better brakes as well.
In an ideal world...standard brakes should handle the standard power...but this isn't an ideal world.
Like everyone else I don't like spending £2085 unless I feel I have too.
Have tried various pads, but imo NO LOW COST BRAKE PAD SOLUTION.
Slightly cheaper alternative, HSV kits: Discs x 4(AP), with refurbished HSV calipers (Red or Gold). £1785 inc vat & fitting.
DOUG
Like everyone else I don't like spending £2085 unless I feel I have too.
Have tried various pads, but imo NO LOW COST BRAKE PAD SOLUTION.
Slightly cheaper alternative, HSV kits: Discs x 4(AP), with refurbished HSV calipers (Red or Gold). £1785 inc vat & fitting.
DOUG
I thought initially that the standard brakes on the commodore were pretty good. (Think they are actually the same as what is on the Monaro). You just don't want to use them alot of you are hooking around and using them alot.
Upgraded them to 4 pot HSV brakes, man, that was a HUGE improvement. I was impressed at how much better the car pulled up.
Then when I got the HSV Coupe with the AP 6 pot on it.. all I have to say is... DO IT!!!! You will definitely not regret it. The AP's are absolutely amazing!!! Go for a spin in your car, and then go for a spin with the AP's fitted. You will be putting yourself through the windscreen in no time.
Initially I thought, yeah, could see the improvement over the standard to the HSV 4 pots by just looking at them, and thought that the AP's were going to be marginally better... how wrong was I!!!
Upgraded them to 4 pot HSV brakes, man, that was a HUGE improvement. I was impressed at how much better the car pulled up.
Then when I got the HSV Coupe with the AP 6 pot on it.. all I have to say is... DO IT!!!! You will definitely not regret it. The AP's are absolutely amazing!!! Go for a spin in your car, and then go for a spin with the AP's fitted. You will be putting yourself through the windscreen in no time.
Initially I thought, yeah, could see the improvement over the standard to the HSV 4 pots by just looking at them, and thought that the AP's were going to be marginally better... how wrong was I!!!
test123 said:
In an ideal world...standard brakes should handle the standard power...but this isn't an ideal world.
Like everyone else I don't like spending £2085 unless I feel I have too.
Have tried various pads, but imo NO LOW COST BRAKE PAD SOLUTION.
Slightly cheaper alternative, HSV kits: Discs x 4(AP), with refurbished HSV calipers (Red or Gold). £1785 inc vat & fitting.
DOUG
Like everyone else I don't like spending £2085 unless I feel I have too.
Have tried various pads, but imo NO LOW COST BRAKE PAD SOLUTION.
Slightly cheaper alternative, HSV kits: Discs x 4(AP), with refurbished HSV calipers (Red or Gold). £1785 inc vat & fitting.
DOUG
Not much in it then, if someone was to do it then the AP's would be the way to go. Standard brakes can be awesome (My Yamaha R1 would pull your face off with braking power) just not with the Monaro.
Edited by headhoon on Friday 16th June 09:38
Raggyman said:
I thought initially that the standard brakes on the commodore were pretty good. (Think they are actually the same as what is on the Monaro). You just don't want to use them alot of you are hooking around and using them alot.
Upgraded them to 4 pot HSV brakes, man, that was a HUGE improvement. I was impressed at how much better the car pulled up.
Then when I got the HSV Coupe with the AP 6 pot on it.. all I have to say is... DO IT!!!! You will definitely not regret it. The AP's are absolutely amazing!!! Go for a spin in your car, and then go for a spin with the AP's fitted. You will be putting yourself through the windscreen in no time.
Initially I thought, yeah, could see the improvement over the standard to the HSV 4 pots by just looking at them, and thought that the AP's were going to be marginally better... how wrong was I!!!
Upgraded them to 4 pot HSV brakes, man, that was a HUGE improvement. I was impressed at how much better the car pulled up.
Then when I got the HSV Coupe with the AP 6 pot on it.. all I have to say is... DO IT!!!! You will definitely not regret it. The AP's are absolutely amazing!!! Go for a spin in your car, and then go for a spin with the AP's fitted. You will be putting yourself through the windscreen in no time.
Initially I thought, yeah, could see the improvement over the standard to the HSV 4 pots by just looking at them, and thought that the AP's were going to be marginally better... how wrong was I!!!
If I spend any money on the Monaro (other than the remap to HSV tune it's had) then I'll definately consider the AP's.
To all those who feal the std breaks on CV8 are ok.
Many people on this forum start out feeling this way and then, after suffering the worst case of fade ever, change their minds!
I hope:-
a; this doesn't happen to you
b; if it does then 'you get away with it'
It happened to me on a country road after 10 mins of spirited driving, and thankfully got away with it after getting round an open corner followed by a steep hill.
The breaks are the single worst thing (imho) about the car, and GM should be ashamed to be trying to give thier customers the ability to kill themselves quite so easily. (Some might say that putting a 5.7 V8 in the car helps as well - but whilst getting it to go is great - the assumption that it will stop would be nice)
Many people on this forum start out feeling this way and then, after suffering the worst case of fade ever, change their minds!
I hope:-
a; this doesn't happen to you
b; if it does then 'you get away with it'
It happened to me on a country road after 10 mins of spirited driving, and thankfully got away with it after getting round an open corner followed by a steep hill.
The breaks are the single worst thing (imho) about the car, and GM should be ashamed to be trying to give thier customers the ability to kill themselves quite so easily. (Some might say that putting a 5.7 V8 in the car helps as well - but whilst getting it to go is great - the assumption that it will stop would be nice)
Like the man says, the first time you use them hard they are a bit wooden, have no feel and don't really pull the car up that quickly, the next corner they are even worse, and by the 3rd time you would swear you pushed the loud pedal by mistake 
I've got a 6.0 VXR set at home waiting to go on (thanks Kev
) I'm hoping they will be up to a trip round the 'ring in the next couple of months. I wouldn't even think about going there on the standard stuff.
I've got a 6.0 VXR set at home waiting to go on (thanks Kev
) I'm hoping they will be up to a trip round the 'ring in the next couple of months. I wouldn't even think about going there on the standard stuff. Edited by alfienoakes on Friday 16th June 10:48
Raggyman said:
I thought initially that the standard brakes on the commodore were pretty good. (Think they are actually the same as what is on the Monaro). You just don't want to use them alot of you are hooking around and using them alot.
Upgraded them to 4 pot HSV brakes, man, that was a HUGE improvement. I was impressed at how much better the car pulled up.
Then when I got the HSV Coupe with the AP 6 pot on it.. all I have to say is... DO IT!!!! You will definitely not regret it. The AP's are absolutely amazing!!! Go for a spin in your car, and then go for a spin with the AP's fitted. You will be putting yourself through the windscreen in no time.
Initially I thought, yeah, could see the improvement over the standard to the HSV 4 pots by just looking at them, and thought that the AP's were going to be marginally better... how wrong was I!!!
Upgraded them to 4 pot HSV brakes, man, that was a HUGE improvement. I was impressed at how much better the car pulled up.
Then when I got the HSV Coupe with the AP 6 pot on it.. all I have to say is... DO IT!!!! You will definitely not regret it. The AP's are absolutely amazing!!! Go for a spin in your car, and then go for a spin with the AP's fitted. You will be putting yourself through the windscreen in no time.
Initially I thought, yeah, could see the improvement over the standard to the HSV 4 pots by just looking at them, and thought that the AP's were going to be marginally better... how wrong was I!!!
That sums it up very well Jas. The HSV (Harrop) brakes that Raggyman refers to were mine & yes they are good, but no comparison to the mighty AP's. I believe that the AP's are now cheaper than the HSV (Harrop) set up!
Are the '05 CV8 brakes the same as those fitted to the '04 VXR? I'm sure I read somewhere that the '05 CV8 has a brake 'upgrade' in relation to the '04 CV8.
IMO the '04 CV8 brakes were, frankly, rubbish. You expect some corners to be cut when you're getting supercar performance for under £30k, but not the brakes FFS. Anyone who thinks the standard '04 brakes are in any way "ok" has clearly not had to use them very much.
IMO the '04 CV8 brakes were, frankly, rubbish. You expect some corners to be cut when you're getting supercar performance for under £30k, but not the brakes FFS. Anyone who thinks the standard '04 brakes are in any way "ok" has clearly not had to use them very much.
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