Uncanny Audis - "ghost runners"
Discussion
Just got home after 3 days of beer, sun and petrolhead heaven. So many beautiful cars to look at and perfect weather.
But those Audis are just uncanny! Every other car makes the noises you're used to hearing - pops, bangs and flames on the over-run, then a visceral howl of power as they leave the corner. In some cases the noise was not far short of physical assault, e.g. the Corvettes. Then in comes an Audi Tdi, whispering into the corner and barely making any noise as it accelerates away - if there was a petrol driven car in the vicinty then you couldn't hear the Audi at all, making them seem electric driven.
Also impressed by how well set-up they are. OK, so they're equipped with particle filters, but still to produce no visible smoke at all from a diesel engine churning out 650 bhp and 1,100 Nm of torque. One day we'll all end up with sportscars running diesels or hybrids - with this win they have shown the way forward. Now if only they could make diesel that when burnt smelt like Castrol R!
Hope you all make it back OK without meeting the rozzers. Saw plenty of PHers cars around a jag with liiony's (sp?) name on, Nervy getting out of his GT3 to go for dinner at Arnage last night. Many thanks to the kind TVR driver who asked if I was OK when he passed my porker at a standstill near the entrance to Houx Annexe - yes I was lost but had just worked out where to go!
But those Audis are just uncanny! Every other car makes the noises you're used to hearing - pops, bangs and flames on the over-run, then a visceral howl of power as they leave the corner. In some cases the noise was not far short of physical assault, e.g. the Corvettes. Then in comes an Audi Tdi, whispering into the corner and barely making any noise as it accelerates away - if there was a petrol driven car in the vicinty then you couldn't hear the Audi at all, making them seem electric driven.
Also impressed by how well set-up they are. OK, so they're equipped with particle filters, but still to produce no visible smoke at all from a diesel engine churning out 650 bhp and 1,100 Nm of torque. One day we'll all end up with sportscars running diesels or hybrids - with this win they have shown the way forward. Now if only they could make diesel that when burnt smelt like Castrol R!
Hope you all make it back OK without meeting the rozzers. Saw plenty of PHers cars around a jag with liiony's (sp?) name on, Nervy getting out of his GT3 to go for dinner at Arnage last night. Many thanks to the kind TVR driver who asked if I was OK when he passed my porker at a standstill near the entrance to Houx Annexe - yes I was lost but had just worked out where to go!
nel said:
One day we'll all end up with sportscars running diesels or hybrids
That is a horrible thought.
nel said:
with this win they have shown the way forward.
How have they shown the way forward? Next year they should let the turbo petrol cars have the near 2 litre displacement difference, the bigger air restrictors, the bigger fuel filler nozzle size etc, etc, the diesel cars would be nowhere.
Many people think diesel is going to take over motor racing. I think some people are missing the point with regards to endurance racing. Diesels have there place in racing and they are not going to take over all sorts of championships. Performance on track was not much different between the Audi's and Pescarolos (sp?) but the Audis were able to stay out much longer between pitstops.
I find it great that the technology of diesel has advanced so much, but for a performance car petrol will always win as the costs to get a diesel to this standard is rather a lot!
I find it great that the technology of diesel has advanced so much, but for a performance car petrol will always win as the costs to get a diesel to this standard is rather a lot!
Mikey G said:
I find it great that the technology of diesel has advanced so much, but for a performance car petrol will always win as the costs to get a diesel to this standard is rather a lot!
Yes but that's R&D, something traditionally associated with Le Mans, the classic endurance race. One day the first hydrogen fuel cell racer will probably compete here!
Mikey G said:
Many people think diesel is going to take over motor racing. I think some people are missing the point with regards to endurance racing. Diesels have there place in racing and they are not going to take over all sorts of championships. Performance on track was not much different between the Audi's and Pescarolos (sp?) but the Audis were able to stay out much longer between pitstops.
I find it great that the technology of diesel has advanced so much, but for a performance car petrol will always win as the costs to get a diesel to this standard is rather a lot!
I find it great that the technology of diesel has advanced so much, but for a performance car petrol will always win as the costs to get a diesel to this standard is rather a lot!
The regs are biased towards the Diesels though, build a petrol car to the same regs and it'd be so much faster that it wouldn't matter about fuel stops. Compare the R10 to the R8 - the R8 ran smaller restrictors, had to refuel with smaller fuel lines, was 1.9 L smaller and was limited by the regs to 1.6 bar of boost compared with the R10 which was running 2.9 Bar!
m12_nathan said:
The regs are biased towards the Diesels though, build a petrol car to the same regs and it'd be so much faster that it wouldn't matter about fuel stops. Compare the R10 to the R8 - the R8 ran smaller restrictors, had to refuel with smaller fuel lines, was 1.9 L smaller and was limited by the regs to 1.6 bar of boost compared with the R10 which was running 2.9 Bar!
Fair comment, though it is always hard to set the parity between two different engine types. The closeness of the result shows that they got it about right when they set the Le Mans spec. for the diesels. Similar to the arguments about how to classify the capacity of a wankel engine, hence all the complaints in the bike racing a few years ago that the rotary Nortons had an unfair advantage.
But to encourage the use of such developments it has to be made possible for them to win - if the same capacity regs for the petrol engines had been applied to the chip fat burners then no one would have bothered making a racing diesel coz they wouldn't have had a hope. Long term, encouraging such R&D can only be a good thing for what we get in our road cars.
I agree with that 
, but think that the bare facts still show the fuel would not be the choice of the engineers when asked to build the fastest car they could if the regs were equal.
Fair play to Audi but I'm dreading the whole "le mans proved diesel is better than petrol" marketting rubbish that will completely avoid the fact that the regs are so much more free for the R10.
, but think that the bare facts still show the fuel would not be the choice of the engineers when asked to build the fastest car they could if the regs were equal. Fair play to Audi but I'm dreading the whole "le mans proved diesel is better than petrol" marketting rubbish that will completely avoid the fact that the regs are so much more free for the R10.
adom said:
For me one of the great attractions pf Le Mans is the noise and glowing brake discs - I find these silent diesels all very depressing. Not the 'way forward' in my book.
Yeah I agree, though I can't help but be admirative of the engineering work that's gone into making racing diesel engines. However, planned changes to the regulations for next year include the driver air-con (cockpit temperatures to respect) and noise levels, so the nannying just goes on. With every passing year you can expect the cars to get less raucous, which does seem a pity.
According to the briefing from Alan McNish, the Audi's were running 5 speed box's changing up at 4500rpm 
This whole diesel thing is bad news generally as Peugeot will be there next year with their diesel, Honda maybe the year after.
Racing cars are supposed to be LOUD and present an assault to the senses at all levels, otherwise we all will be reduced to the 24hour Scalextric marathon.
This whole diesel thing is bad news generally as Peugeot will be there next year with their diesel, Honda maybe the year after.
Racing cars are supposed to be LOUD and present an assault to the senses at all levels, otherwise we all will be reduced to the 24hour Scalextric marathon.
corozin said:
Aside from the "whooshing grumble" of the Deisel engines, if you listened a bit closer you could hear a gentle "slap, slap" noise in the background. I believe it was the sound of French national pride being slapped like a bitch...
Yes, the frogs might be a bit sensitive at the moment with all the french drivers not considered good enough for F1, so they were no doubt hoping that Henri's Pescarolo team would do the business. Problem is that the french love their diseasels so much (65% of private car buyers plump for one) that, as noted above, they'll probably be here with their own chip fat burners next year.
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