RE: We love road pricing: survey
RE: We love road pricing: survey
Thursday 29th June 2006

We love road pricing: survey

But only if the money's spent on roads


Congestion charge: coming your way soon?
Congestion charge: coming your way soon?
British motorists are about to give in on the vexed issue of road charging, according to a recent survey.

Their growing dissatisfaction with the driving experience has crossed a tipping point with more than two-thirds (68 per cent) now prepared to accept draconian measures to tackle congestion. They are ready to do a deal with Government on road pricing -- but their support depends on the terms offered in return such as concessions on motoring taxes and improvements in public transport and the road network.

The RAC Report on Motoring 2006 - an annual index of the views of UK motorists - reveals:

  • 79 per cent of motorists perceive that congestion is getting steadily worse
  • Support for the concept of road pricing has risen six per cent in two years, reflecting increasing frustration with congestion (from 19 per cent to 25 per cent)
  • Nearly half of motorists (44 per cent) support a road pricing scheme using precise telematics technology

The research suggests that motorists are clear about the deal they want: 67 per cent require a trade off on motoring tax; 63 per cent expect investment in existing roads and 43 per cent say improvements in public transport are crucial. Telematics technology is also popular with motorists and extending its benefits to include other options such as in-car panic buttons could create a more positive reception for technology-led road pricing schemes.

Using its findings, the RAC is calling on the Government to:

  • Take positive action by offering financial trade-offs to motorists to make a persuasive case for road pricing
  • Commit to improvements in public transport
  • Work more closely with employers to improve workplace travel plans
  • Lead the debate to mandate in-car technology and provide incentives to motorists to encourage take up

RAC boss Debbie Hewitt said: “Motorists are sending a clear signal to Government that road pricing is a more palatable solution than it has been for the growing problem of congestion - but they are looking to strike a deal. Government must act now to seize this opportunity to win over road users. Motorists themselves are telling us that there is wide scope to gain their support but it is critical that policymakers adopt a fair basis for charging, review the impact on current motoring taxes and promote the technological benefits of a road pricing system for the idea to become a reality.”

Doing a deal

Critics suggest road pricing simply extracts more money from motorists. Over two thirds of motorists reveal that a financial trade-off on the motoring tax burden is crucial for any scheme to get off the ground.

The road network's struggle to keep pace with congestion is a source of great frustration for motorists and potentially damaging for economic growth in the UK. In return for their support, nearly two thirds (63 per cent) of motorists stress that money raised from road pricing must be reinvested to improve existing roads.

English regions have allocated 72 per cent of their transport budgets to roads, with the East Midlands and South East directing as much as 95 per cent. However, the acceptability of road pricing will depend upon the provision of a reliable and affordable alternative. Improvements in public transport are also vital if the scheme is to prove successful.

Fair and square

The basis for charging under road pricing is uncertain with feasibility studies2 suggesting up to £1.34 a mile on the busiest roads at peak times. Motorists are in no doubt that to succeed, the scheme must be calculated on a fair basis. Two thirds (66 per cent) believe that annual mileage is the most effective method.

In another strong message for Government, more than half (55 per cent) of motorists consider that charges for using town centre roads are unfair. The same number also believe that higher charges during rush hour are unjust as do 57 per cent of motorists when it comes to charging for motorway use.

Tempting technology

With Global Positioning Systems likely to underpin any charging scheme, the report reveals that advanced technology presents an excellent opportunity for Government in winning motorists round.

 Road pricing would be received even more positively if the technology used also offered motorists a number of driver-friendly features. Anti-theft tracking is the most highly valued facility with 87 per cent of motorists indicating they would like one. Other attractive features include re-routing gizmos to avoid hold-ups (80 per cent), and a panic button that raises the alarm in an emergency (77 per cent).

Just goes to show that people will say anything when asked the right questions...

A full version of the report can be downloaded from www.racnews.co.uk

Author
Discussion

havoc

Original Poster:

32,562 posts

257 months

Thursday 29th June 2006
quotequote all
Ah, so who now own the RAC? And how much in the pocket of Labour are they?!? Is a peerage due soon???

But it's worked again for Labour - make something worse and even an unpalatable solution will seem better!
You were a free man, we're now giving you the choice between prison or wearing a tag? Which is it to be?!? No f'k'r thinks to ask "why can't I still be a free man?"

Mr Whippy

32,163 posts

263 months

Thursday 29th June 2006
quotequote all
Fair enough if it's spent on the roads, but isn't that what our existing £40 billion should be at least going towards already?

I can see this being an excuse to pay for the roads, while the current $4 billion actually spent on roads is then funded by the road charging, with the other £billions it makes just subsidising more jobsworths and red tape.

When will the British public learn, no matter what the government does, it's bending you over and rogering you for every penny! The roads will crumble more and more, busses and trains will run later and crapper than ever before, but lots of middle managers and dossers will be living the happy life!

Dave

Witchfinder

6,360 posts

274 months

Thursday 29th June 2006
quotequote all
Where the hell do they find these "motorists"? The only reason congestion is increasing is the sheer number of pointless bus lanes and other anti-mobility measures. Have the utility companies started putting stupid-juice in the water supply?

apache

39,731 posts

306 months

Thursday 29th June 2006
quotequote all
They didn't ask me so they can feck right off

dougc

8,240 posts

287 months

Thursday 29th June 2006
quotequote all
I like road pricing.

No seriously, I haven't gone mad.

When I go to France I don't mind paying €5 to go 100 odd miles on a smooth, clear, well maintained Autoroute with good lane discipline, regular services and well equipped rest stops every 50 or so kilometres.

What I don't like is the idea of being tracked constantly, being charged £1.34 a mile for journeys which I have to make and being told I have an alternative in public transport which is laughable.

zumbruk

7,848 posts

282 months

Thursday 29th June 2006
quotequote all
dougc said:
I like road pricing.

No seriously, I haven't gone mad.

When I go to France I don't mind paying €5 to go 100 odd miles on a smooth, clear, well maintained Autoroute with good lane discipline, regular services and well equipped rest stops every 50 or so kilometres.

What I don't like is the idea of being tracked constantly, being charged £1.34 a mile for journeys which I have to make and being told I have an alternative in public transport which is laughable.


I leave it as an exercise for the reader as to which one we'll be "offered".

Al 450

1,390 posts

243 months

Thursday 29th June 2006
quotequote all
What makes me laugh is that the plebs in charge don't seem to realise that people go to work at rush hour not out of choice but because it's when most people's jobs start.

Taxing people more for something they have no control over is grossly unfair.

PJS917

1,194 posts

270 months

Thursday 29th June 2006
quotequote all
I just resigned from the RAC, they are supposed to support the motorist
not idiot governments.

mybrainhurts

90,809 posts

277 months

Thursday 29th June 2006
quotequote all
Anybody got an address for the chairman of the RAC..?

No more fees from me, boyo...

jazzyjeff

3,652 posts

281 months

Thursday 29th June 2006
quotequote all
Al 450 said:
What makes me laugh is that the plebs in charge don't seem to realise that people go to work at rush hour not out of choice but because it's when most people's jobs start.

Taxing people more for something they have no control over is grossly unfair.


Even more of a reason for this antidiluvian country to drag itself into the 21st century and introduce staggered working hours.

Staggered working = no rush hour = reduced congestion = no need for financial pointy stick

JJ

PJS917

1,194 posts

270 months

Thursday 29th June 2006
quotequote all
There is a phone number on the RAC article on the link above,
I am sure the press office will be interested in our views.

aston67

872 posts

252 months

Thursday 29th June 2006
quotequote all
No deal!

they created in the first place all the necessary conditions for congestions with bus lanes, road works for constant neglect of the roads, speed cameras, speed humps, bottlenecks, road furniture of any kind to slow down... have I forgot anything?

then after driving us mad, the last straw is for us, drivers, to be happy with this crap about PAY AS YOU GO and rest assure in the hand of Labour will be PAY AS YOU EARN

your car will send also the signal to get a speeding ticket - it is a guarantee!

Road pricing is the most illiberal piece of rubbish: to put a tax on freedom of movement is simply unacceptable.

Look what these people have done to trains: they want you to use public transport but there are no serious investments. Then you get, guess what, overcrowding. Of course! Solution? Tax them out... Look below

www.timesonline.co.uk/article/0,,2-2248275,00.html

A67


Edited by aston67 on Thursday 29th June 13:08

matmoxon

5,026 posts

240 months

Thursday 29th June 2006
quotequote all
Three words for the Govt.... Go To Hell

There is absolutely no way I am having any form of tracking box fitted to my car, because not only would your mileage be monitored (and hence your location) but so would your speed which means any slight creep in speed not captured by a scamera would be picked up on this system, instant fine.

If you ask me this is just another way of screwing over the British Motoring Public, I am more than happy to pay the £190 tax to drive my ST170 thanks very much Mr Blair.

Even If they calculated it on average mileage what about track time, some people drive their cars on tracks allot which means track mileage it is not fair to tax them as they have already paid to use the race track (this is the same counter argument for abolishing road tax and putting 2p per litre on the price of fuel).

What all of this says to me is that Mr. Blair and his cronies won't be happy until they can monitor your location 24/7

Neil_C

61 posts

253 months

Thursday 29th June 2006
quotequote all
Support for the concept of road pricing has risen six per cent in two years, reflecting increasing frustration with congestion (from 19 per cent to 25 per cent)


Errrr... doesn't this imply that 75% do not support road pricing??

Mind you when have this gov't ever been interested in what the people they are supposed to serve think?

annodomini2

6,962 posts

273 months

Thursday 29th June 2006
quotequote all
Neil_C said:
Support for the concept of road pricing has risen six per cent in two years, reflecting increasing frustration with congestion (from 19 per cent to 25 per cent)


Errrr... doesn't this imply that 75% do not support road pricing??

Mind you when have this gov't ever been interested in what the people they are supposed to serve think?


When have any Government?

I personally believe this would be a complete breach of our personal civil liberties as with a lot of legislation passed recently. It targets the 0.1% of the population, but screws life up for the other 99.9%.

A DECISIVE AND FIRM NO!

TOOFM

26 posts

252 months

Thursday 29th June 2006
quotequote all
I already pay this shower of S**T enough in road tax, petrol tax, fines etc let them spend that money on the roads before they ask for any No car? then they can dictate when and where we go, when we go on holiday ie. no car so you only get a rail travel permit when they say so. It amazing how many brain dead people actually voted this lot in and then have kept them there and how they accept this sort of stuff without a whimper.
Feel better now

zumbruk

7,848 posts

282 months

Thursday 29th June 2006
quotequote all
Al 450 said:
What makes me laugh is that the plebs in charge don't seem to realise that people go to work at rush hour not out of choice but because it's when most people's jobs start.

Taxing people more for something they have no control over is grossly unfair.


All taxes are unfair. Either you get used to it, or we need to find another system of Government.

Narvanath

293 posts

245 months

Thursday 29th June 2006
quotequote all
A few weeks ago, I took part in a survey (I occationally do this for some reason) about road pricing schemes. So this, then, is the result. I remember answering NO to most of the surgestions regarding paying for this and that - include satnav based changing.

I must be one those in the minority then... or the results are fixed.

blugnu

1,523 posts

263 months

Thursday 29th June 2006
quotequote all
I have reservations about the potential to monitor my speed at all times, and the fact that in theory somebody knows where I have been. Of course it will be claimed that all this information would be kept secret or destroyed, but I wonder what would happen if someone called on tracking evidence as evidence at a trial - would it be released?

However, I am not as against it as most of you seem to be - the idea as I understand it is that this will replace road tax etc, rather than be in addition. There is no way it could be introduced as an extra charge because then the level at which it would be tolerated would be too low to justify the expense.

I don't see why you expect motoring to be exempt from the laws of supply and demand - there is much more demand for the good 'road space' (RS) now, but it has a limited supply, and there is a finite limit to how much more we can make. As with anything, when demand increases faster than supply, the price goes up. It's a blunt, ugly instrument, but we as motorists have shown ourselves to be incapable of addressing this problem ourselves - hardly anyone car shares, for example, and we don't take public transport even when it is viable because we don't want to be tied to a schedule.

If price doesn't go up, demand increases to the point where we can't move on the roads; a point I think we are rapidly approaching. At least this system would make people consider their journeys a little more. The decision to car share is a little simpler when the logic is "sharing will save me personally £2 a day" rather than "if I share it might make somone else's journey to work 30 seconds quicker" And of course the benefits of that are not only felt in your pocket, or in reduced delays, it will also help us preserve out pertol a bit longer, and help us meet our Kyoto emissions quotas.

On the flexible hours issue, something like this may force that because if costs people more money to get to work at certain times they will start to demand flexible hours. Of course there is always the chance they will instead demand more money to pay for their commute, but I think the balance will be that some employers will offer more flexibility.

So if not this, as most posts seem to suggest, what should be done?

Narvanath

293 posts

245 months

Thursday 29th June 2006
quotequote all
Grasshopper: Master, I have been caught driving too fast by a ... small box!
KungFuMaster: Speed is an illusion...
Grasshopper: But ... 6 points ... and ... a fine .. and ...
KungFuMaster: Drive slow, think fast. No fine for that.
Grasshopper: Yes, Master.