Bought a Macbook...Prefer my old G4 iBook!
Discussion
Hi Folks,
I recently bought a 13" 2Ghz Core Duo Macbook and am honestly a little disappointed with it. The performance is great with native apps, I filled it up with 2Gb of RAM and a 120 HDD which really gives it a kick in the pants. Front Row and all the other new i-apps are great too, it's just the hardware that isn't as well finished as my old faithful iBook G4. The machine is nowhere near as tactile, there are sharp-ish edges all round the perimeter, it runs pretty warm and the keyboard takes some getting used to. The trackpad also has a different feel to it which I'm not so sure I like. It's only marginally heavier than the G4, but feels a whole lot heavier as the weight is in a different place.
I will say this though - the new glossy screen is fantastic for home use.
The trouble is I'm really attached to my old 12" 133 Mhz G4. The packaging of the machine is superb, it weighs next to nothing and is great for just surfing and stuff. Given the choice, I still find myself using the old machine, the other half has seemed to have claimed the Macbook as hers, so I've spent a grand on yet more Apple kit just because it's Apple
I'd be interested if anyone else has bought one of the new machines as an upgrade to an older Mac and been disappointed overall. I've been a Mac user for about 15 years and love them, but I feel standards have certainly slipped, although performance has gone through the roof now they've switched to the Intel CPU. I run a large Windows network in work and wish that the Wintel platform was as nice as Apple's. I've been looking at Vista over the last week and think it's awful - hopefully if Apple better integrates the Bootcamp technology with the core OS there'll be a lot of corporate 'switchers'.
Cheers
Phil.
I recently bought a 13" 2Ghz Core Duo Macbook and am honestly a little disappointed with it. The performance is great with native apps, I filled it up with 2Gb of RAM and a 120 HDD which really gives it a kick in the pants. Front Row and all the other new i-apps are great too, it's just the hardware that isn't as well finished as my old faithful iBook G4. The machine is nowhere near as tactile, there are sharp-ish edges all round the perimeter, it runs pretty warm and the keyboard takes some getting used to. The trackpad also has a different feel to it which I'm not so sure I like. It's only marginally heavier than the G4, but feels a whole lot heavier as the weight is in a different place.
I will say this though - the new glossy screen is fantastic for home use.
The trouble is I'm really attached to my old 12" 133 Mhz G4. The packaging of the machine is superb, it weighs next to nothing and is great for just surfing and stuff. Given the choice, I still find myself using the old machine, the other half has seemed to have claimed the Macbook as hers, so I've spent a grand on yet more Apple kit just because it's Apple
I'd be interested if anyone else has bought one of the new machines as an upgrade to an older Mac and been disappointed overall. I've been a Mac user for about 15 years and love them, but I feel standards have certainly slipped, although performance has gone through the roof now they've switched to the Intel CPU. I run a large Windows network in work and wish that the Wintel platform was as nice as Apple's. I've been looking at Vista over the last week and think it's awful - hopefully if Apple better integrates the Bootcamp technology with the core OS there'll be a lot of corporate 'switchers'.
Cheers
Phil.
Hmm, interesting comments! I've been considering picking a Macbook up to replace my iMac G5. I want to lose the desk in my living room that it stands on (to be repalced with a drinks cabinet...), and I was thinking of going the 13" Macbook route as, on paper at least, it ticks all the boxes. At home I generally surf the interweb and work from home ocassionally, so not having a desktop PC wouldn't be that much of a burden.
I've heard about the fact they get pretty warm and I've also read that the glossy screen is a complete 'mare to look at when you're outdoors (thoughts?), but I guess that to knock them out at such a good price point they had to cut corners somewhere.
Whaddya reckon then? Would you recommend it or should I stick with the G5?
I've heard about the fact they get pretty warm and I've also read that the glossy screen is a complete 'mare to look at when you're outdoors (thoughts?), but I guess that to knock them out at such a good price point they had to cut corners somewhere.
Whaddya reckon then? Would you recommend it or should I stick with the G5?
paulie-mafia said:
Hmm, interesting comments! I've been considering picking a Macbook up to replace my iMac G5. I want to lose the desk in my living room that it stands on (to be repalced with a drinks cabinet...), and I was thinking of going the 13" Macbook route as, on paper at least, it ticks all the boxes. At home I generally surf the interweb and work from home ocassionally, so not having a desktop PC wouldn't be that much of a burden.
I've heard about the fact they get pretty warm and I've also read that the glossy screen is a complete 'mare to look at when you're outdoors (thoughts?), but I guess that to knock them out at such a good price point they had to cut corners somewhere.
Whaddya reckon then? Would you recommend it or should I stick with the G5?
I've heard about the fact they get pretty warm and I've also read that the glossy screen is a complete 'mare to look at when you're outdoors (thoughts?), but I guess that to knock them out at such a good price point they had to cut corners somewhere.
Whaddya reckon then? Would you recommend it or should I stick with the G5?
Well I've bought a couple of 20" Intel iMacs for work, and they're every bit as good as the G5 they replace and there's certainly no build quality issues with them. I've also got an Intel Mini as a test box in my office, and that's great too although the bits you actually 'interface' with i.e the keyboard and mouse are the same Apple products they've used on all the recent-ish machines. Based on experiences so far, I'd certainly recommend the Intel iMacs and Minis, just make sure you put more memory in them. I buy all machines at the base spec and upgrade them myself, it's cheaper to do it that way but be aware that if the machine arrives as a 512mb it'll contain 2x 256 SODIMMS so you will have to junk all the factory RAM. I've got quite a collection of spare Apple RAM now! Also, the Mini is even more of a pain to get to the giblets of than the old one, you have to do a significant dissection to get to the memory.
Going back to the Macbook, I haven't used it outside yet, I'll try and give it a shot this evening if the sun is still out when I get home. The contrast is superb and blacks look very black indeed and I do think that it's by far the best LCD screen I've ever used. It's also surprising how much brighter it is than the old G4's screen, it goes about a third as bright again. Boot time (from cold with 2gb RAM) is about 25 seconds but that goes down to about 15 seconds for a restart. From sleep, I think the G4 is quicker to wake and be usable, it's ready to go right away whereas the 'book takes a couple of seconds before the Airport hooks onto the network. Temperature wise, I downloaded a utility that lets you look at the CPU speed and temperature and it seems to fluctuate between 65* and 85* depending on how hard you are working it. You may also have read about the 'Mooing' noise they make as the fan constantly cycles, mine will do it occasionally but only when running off the mains but not on battery. I see that Apple have released an update for the Pro machines that cure both the 'Mooing' and the temperature presumably by keeping the fan running all the time instead of cycling - no doubt this will be applied to the Macbook too in time.
There are two other redeeming features of the new Macbook, albeit small things but it's the details that matter
The damned sleep light that was more like a lighthouse on the G4 is now very much smaller so I no longer have to throw something over it at night, and the Magsafe power connector is excellent and again, they've only put a tiny LED there this time so the whole connector no longer lights up. As Magic Torch says, I'd probably wait for a second revision in all honesty - but I was buying with my heart, not my head (as is so often the case with Apple kit...!)
Phil.
I'm really happy with my black Macbook. I've had none of the issues it appears many have.
I went from a 1.33GHz 17" Powerbook to a 13" black Macbook (2GB RAM) and haven't looked back
Incidentally, if you recently updated to 10.4.7 you should check out: www.apcstart.com/site/tgaden/2006/07/563/do-you-need-to-update-to-os-x-1047-again
I went from a 1.33GHz 17" Powerbook to a 13" black Macbook (2GB RAM) and haven't looked back
Incidentally, if you recently updated to 10.4.7 you should check out: www.apcstart.com/site/tgaden/2006/07/563/do-you-need-to-update-to-os-x-1047-again
Interesting. I had a look at the macbooks instore, and was not at all impressed by the keyboard. I found it extremely difficult to hit the enter key every time, and I wasn't too sure about the general feel of it. Having used (but never owned) a few g4 ibooks, I was very taken by the way they felt. However the screens are very nice, and the black one is oh so sexy (but why the stupid premium? - black ipods are the same price as white..)
Have you seent the stuff on Barefeats www.barefeats.com about the Black MacBook, for some reason it massively outperformed the white one.
Phil, the Mac mini and iMac haven't needed the internal redesign the portables have.
Phil, the Mac mini and iMac haven't needed the internal redesign the portables have.
I've yet to see a laptop that was a joy to use outside in sunlight. I strongly suspect there are no LCDs that shine (no pun intended) in this environment.
And my G4 Powerbooks always ran hot. Not surprised the new Intel machines do.
Agree that standards seem to bee slipping though.
Not sure what advantage there would be to running Windows on a Mac. It's not just the design of the box that's a step above (or used to be), but the stability of the OS. Though even here we seem to be getting updates every 5mins and I've had a number of glitches with software in the last 6mths that I never had in the first 6yrs of using Macs. Nothing a quick unix session in terminal can't cure, but it never used to be this way.
Perhaps they're just getting lazy at Apple...?
That said, my latest addition to the fold is a Mini connected to a Pioneer 43" plasma. It forms the centre of my home entertainment set up and I reckon it blows the socks off any Media Centre PC in terms of performance.
Can't see me buying another Mac laptop for some time yet (have had my current one around 2yrs now, and still have the original titanium PB as a back up/disk/print/scan server). They need to get back to being head and shoulders above the competition in design terms and performance (will never go back to Windows though).
And my G4 Powerbooks always ran hot. Not surprised the new Intel machines do.
Agree that standards seem to bee slipping though.
Not sure what advantage there would be to running Windows on a Mac. It's not just the design of the box that's a step above (or used to be), but the stability of the OS. Though even here we seem to be getting updates every 5mins and I've had a number of glitches with software in the last 6mths that I never had in the first 6yrs of using Macs. Nothing a quick unix session in terminal can't cure, but it never used to be this way.
Perhaps they're just getting lazy at Apple...?
That said, my latest addition to the fold is a Mini connected to a Pioneer 43" plasma. It forms the centre of my home entertainment set up and I reckon it blows the socks off any Media Centre PC in terms of performance.
Can't see me buying another Mac laptop for some time yet (have had my current one around 2yrs now, and still have the original titanium PB as a back up/disk/print/scan server). They need to get back to being head and shoulders above the competition in design terms and performance (will never go back to Windows though).
An update...
After spending more time with the Macbook, although I loved the screen the keyboard was something I could not get used to, so I've ended up chopping it in for a 15" Macbook Pro 2.16. The Pro feels more like an Apple of old, there are no sharp edges and it's got a proper keyboard. OK so the machine is a lot bigger than I'd originally wanted, but it's superb - the extra screen space makes such a difference. It does run even warmer to the touch than the Macbook did though, although the Core Duo Temp application says the CPU is only running at 62*c, the outer case gets very warm indeed.
Whereas I found I was going back to the G4 when I was using the Macbook, since I've had the 'Pro the old faithful 12" iBook hasn't had a look in at all so I've at last convinced myself to sell it. What's a boxed 12" 1.33 G4 iBook with 1gb Ram worth?
After spending more time with the Macbook, although I loved the screen the keyboard was something I could not get used to, so I've ended up chopping it in for a 15" Macbook Pro 2.16. The Pro feels more like an Apple of old, there are no sharp edges and it's got a proper keyboard. OK so the machine is a lot bigger than I'd originally wanted, but it's superb - the extra screen space makes such a difference. It does run even warmer to the touch than the Macbook did though, although the Core Duo Temp application says the CPU is only running at 62*c, the outer case gets very warm indeed.
Whereas I found I was going back to the G4 when I was using the Macbook, since I've had the 'Pro the old faithful 12" iBook hasn't had a look in at all so I've at last convinced myself to sell it. What's a boxed 12" 1.33 G4 iBook with 1gb Ram worth?
PJ said:
I'd be interested if anyone else has bought one of the new machines as an upgrade to an older Mac and been disappointed overall.
Yes! We have recently replaced an old iBook with a new MacBook at work. Everything you say about it is spot on, except for one thing. Yes, it doesn't feel as good, yes it's heavier, yes it is wonderfully quick etc ... but ... IMO, the glossy screen is truly awful. I absolutely HATE any reflection on a screen and these things are like mirrors.
I will be replacing my own Powerbook G4 later this year with a MacBook Pro and I am really glad that the hardware is still pretty much the same (bar internals of course). I will naturally be specifiying the NON-glossy screen
mefoster said:
Yes! We have recently replaced an old iBook with a new MacBook at work. Everything you say about it is spot on, except for one thing. Yes, it doesn't feel as good, yes it's heavier, yes it is wonderfully quick etc ... but ... IMO, the glossy screen is truly awful. I absolutely HATE any reflection on a screen and these things are like mirrors.
I will be replacing my own Powerbook G4 later this year with a MacBook Pro and I am really glad that the hardware is still pretty much the same (bar internals of course). I will naturally be specifiying the NON-glossy screen
You forgot that some of us don't like the ZX Spectrum-esq keyboard.
I found the keys on the Macbook felt too far apart, although in reality I don't think the spacing was much, if any different from a normal keyboard. The keys' lack of profile was what made it feel odd.
The Macbook Pro keyboard has taken me some time to get used too as well though, as there is a lot of chassis round the keyboard. I keep finding my hands are offset and I keep striking the chassis rather than the outer keys, but it's just because on the iBook there was virtually nothing between the end of the keyboard and the edge of the machine. I'm getting used to it fast. I don't regret for one moment buying the 'Pro though, it's an awesome (if hot) machine
The Macbook Pro keyboard has taken me some time to get used too as well though, as there is a lot of chassis round the keyboard. I keep finding my hands are offset and I keep striking the chassis rather than the outer keys, but it's just because on the iBook there was virtually nothing between the end of the keyboard and the edge of the machine. I'm getting used to it fast. I don't regret for one moment buying the 'Pro though, it's an awesome (if hot) machine
I have both a 2.16 MBP and a Black MacBook sitting here in front of me. The BlackBook has become my default client-site machine purely because of its greater portability.
I actually really like the keyboard of the BlackBook - I use one 8+ hours a day so the keyboard has to be decent. The MBP has a nice keyboard (like all the Powerbooks I used before) but it's too heavy and big for me to enjoy carrying it into London and back every day.
The main problem with the BlackBook is the shoddy graphics - I use multiple screens as a matter of course and the limited graphics RAM stutters to a halt when using an secondary monitor alongside the built-in LCD.
The MBP has no such problem with its 256 MB of graphics RAM, predictably enough.
The keyboard on the original G4 iBook was so crap that I'm surprised you prefer it. My favourite machine of all time was the 12" Powerbook (why, oh why, Apple, please make us a 12" MBP...) and the 13" BlackBook is the closest I'll get to this for some time.
There's no way I'll go back to a G4 machine now purely for productivity and performance reasons. Even the fastest one I had (last model G4 1.67 15"
was dog slow compared to the Intel dual-cores.
If Apple bring out a discrete-graphics BlackBook or a 12" MBP then I'm first in line, however
I actually really like the keyboard of the BlackBook - I use one 8+ hours a day so the keyboard has to be decent. The MBP has a nice keyboard (like all the Powerbooks I used before) but it's too heavy and big for me to enjoy carrying it into London and back every day.
The main problem with the BlackBook is the shoddy graphics - I use multiple screens as a matter of course and the limited graphics RAM stutters to a halt when using an secondary monitor alongside the built-in LCD.
The MBP has no such problem with its 256 MB of graphics RAM, predictably enough. The keyboard on the original G4 iBook was so crap that I'm surprised you prefer it. My favourite machine of all time was the 12" Powerbook (why, oh why, Apple, please make us a 12" MBP...) and the 13" BlackBook is the closest I'll get to this for some time.
There's no way I'll go back to a G4 machine now purely for productivity and performance reasons. Even the fastest one I had (last model G4 1.67 15"
was dog slow compared to the Intel dual-cores. If Apple bring out a discrete-graphics BlackBook or a 12" MBP then I'm first in line, however
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