F1 to become a hippy showcase?
Discussion
So Max has decided to freeze engine development to focus on recovering power from braking, etc.
I don't mind him introducing rules to allow that alongside the current rules, but F1 is supposed to be a pinnacle of motorsport, not an environmental showcase. And how does this idea sit with his plans to make F1 more about racing teams, less about manufacturers with big budgets? Only a car manufacturer is going to want to blow £millions a year on new technology that might or might not work and has no non-F1 racing use. F1 cars and road cars have very rarely been linked at all, particularly since high-tech was mostly banned (eg active suspension). F1 cars are race cars, leave them to it! Make the engined smaller and limit testing miles to reduce costs and emmissions if you must, but let them focus on power and performance for a given engine size, please.
It all seems like a crock to me.
I don't mind him introducing rules to allow that alongside the current rules, but F1 is supposed to be a pinnacle of motorsport, not an environmental showcase. And how does this idea sit with his plans to make F1 more about racing teams, less about manufacturers with big budgets? Only a car manufacturer is going to want to blow £millions a year on new technology that might or might not work and has no non-F1 racing use. F1 cars and road cars have very rarely been linked at all, particularly since high-tech was mostly banned (eg active suspension). F1 cars are race cars, leave them to it! Make the engined smaller and limit testing miles to reduce costs and emmissions if you must, but let them focus on power and performance for a given engine size, please.
It all seems like a crock to me.
Mosley's daddy and mummy were outspoken and active supporters of Hitler and the Fascist movement, the essence of which was in part that a small body of superior creatures had the natural right - indeed, the duty - to compel the rest of us slobs to run our lives as they saw fit.
Before he got involved with the FISA/FOCA/FIA nonsense, as I understand it, Maxey seriously considered running for Parliament.
It's pretty obvious that he presumes in his bones that he knows better than common people do how we should live, and he's trying in any way available to him to impose his will upon us.
Before he got involved with the FISA/FOCA/FIA nonsense, as I understand it, Maxey seriously considered running for Parliament.
It's pretty obvious that he presumes in his bones that he knows better than common people do how we should live, and he's trying in any way available to him to impose his will upon us.
pablo said:
the best rule F1 could introduce would be a maximum fuel limit for a weekend and then let people do what they want.
And tyres, give them 7 or 8 sets and tell them '1 hour qualifying, no lap limit'. Like they do in MotoGP....or even give them as many tyres as they want.
I still like the spoof ITV-F1 advert idea when during a race pitstop the driver has to get out of the car and then spun round 5 times by his mechanics before getting back into the car
In respect to the Max & Bernie show, didn't Bernie mention we was looking at getting a Grand Prix in the Lebanon, Beirut to be exact.
Found a reference, well actually there were quite a few. This one from 2001 - www.racingone.com/article.asp?artnum=4969
Now that would spice up the race, Massa dodging Israeli air attacks whilst driving as tail end charlie to Schumacher M.
Found a reference, well actually there were quite a few. This one from 2001 - www.racingone.com/article.asp?artnum=4969
Now that would spice up the race, Massa dodging Israeli air attacks whilst driving as tail end charlie to Schumacher M.
You could argue that developing energy regenerating devices is at the cutting edge of technology. Like the ironic side-effect of war, F1 has helped bring on technological advances and solutions that can help in the real world is no bad thing.
Remember, Max needs to look at the bigger picture, something that can't be done by teams competing for largely short-term advantage. Right now we have a frankly ludicrous situation where teams are spending 10 minutes of a qualifying session wasting fuel - how does this sit in today's world where leaving aside global-warming speculation, there is only a finite resource and with the current situation with the Middle East deteriorating daily, pointless burning of fuel which could easily be legislated out of the sport does no favours whatsoever. If there's a vacancy in F1 PR, I'd be amazed if they've received any CVs...
Remember, Max needs to look at the bigger picture, something that can't be done by teams competing for largely short-term advantage. Right now we have a frankly ludicrous situation where teams are spending 10 minutes of a qualifying session wasting fuel - how does this sit in today's world where leaving aside global-warming speculation, there is only a finite resource and with the current situation with the Middle East deteriorating daily, pointless burning of fuel which could easily be legislated out of the sport does no favours whatsoever. If there's a vacancy in F1 PR, I'd be amazed if they've received any CVs...
flemke said:
Mosley's daddy and mummy were outspoken and active supporters of Hitler and the Fascist movement, the essence of which was in part that a small body of superior creatures had the natural right - indeed, the duty - to compel the rest of us slobs to run our lives as they saw fit.
Before he got involved with the FISA/FOCA/FIA nonsense, as I understand it, Maxey seriously considered running for Parliament.
It's pretty obvious that he presumes in his bones that he knows better than common people do how we should live, and he's trying in any way available to him to impose his will upon us.
Before he got involved with the FISA/FOCA/FIA nonsense, as I understand it, Maxey seriously considered running for Parliament.
It's pretty obvious that he presumes in his bones that he knows better than common people do how we should live, and he's trying in any way available to him to impose his will upon us.
I didn't know that. Much as I find the whole of Formula 1 a bit tiresome these days, possibly because of Max, I think I'd rather live with F1 being screwed up than the whole country.
Equally I think that F1 needs something a bit radical, and whilst this energy conservation is radical, I'm not sure it's quite the thing.
Why can't the teams be allowed to just do anything they want for a bit? The sort of thing I'm thinking of is to say whatever you like to the teams, but it must be open wheels, and less than a certain weight. I'm thinking that the weight limit might be half what it currently is, but dry weight only.
Instead of controlling things like tyres and driver aids, engines and trnsmissions to keep the speed down; As the cars get faster, tell them to do the same thing with less dry weight.
Edited to add;
Bring on the 400mph gokarts!
Further edited to add;
I just think that making a car that works reasonably well has just become to easy. I honestly believe that something needs to be injected that doesn't blurr the focus of the traditional racing formula (power/weight), but makes it more difficult to achieve the ratio. Let the engineers do whatever they want, but make it so that it's quite hard for them to make a car that actually works at all.
Further edited to add;
I am aware that this isn't necassarily the best control, I'm thinking motorbikes now. I suppose what I'm trying to get at is; It should be the same, but not with arseache for the designer, with real problems. Maybe this business of the regenerative systems might work in that respect. What it doesn't do is make the scale of the car smaller, allowing more privateers.
Edited by dilbert on Monday 17th July 20:21
Jungles said:
Alternative energies development is a pretty good idea, IMHO.
Instead of turbochargers, etc., they could use alternative energy sources for extra power boost, eg. Lexus GS450h, as well as conserving fuel.
Good idea as in "technically interesting", "could have road car applications", etc., or good idea as in "the little know-it-all dictator should impose it mandatorily upon all competitors in the world's premier racing series"?Instead of turbochargers, etc., they could use alternative energy sources for extra power boost, eg. Lexus GS450h, as well as conserving fuel.
Jungles said:
Alternative energies development is a pretty good idea, IMHO.
Instead of turbochargers, etc., they could use alternative energy sources for extra power boost, eg. Lexus GS450h, as well as conserving fuel.
Instead of turbochargers, etc., they could use alternative energy sources for extra power boost, eg. Lexus GS450h, as well as conserving fuel.
Tell the F1 engineers and engine manufacturers to use energy efficient (I know it's an oxymoron) electric motors since that seems to be the "eco-thing", then they can add whatever engine sound they like over the top, V12, V8, V16 their choice
dilbert said:
I didn't know that. Much as I find the whole of Formula 1 a bit tiresome these days, possibly because of Max, I think I'd rather live with F1 being screwed up than the whole country.
OT annotation: Mosley parents were "aristocrats" who founded the British Union of Fascists in the '30s. They were pals of Hitler's and spent a good bit of time with him, including in July of 1939. (Max Mosley was born approximately 9 months later in April, 1940: interesting coincidence...
) About a month after wee Max came into this world, his parents were imprisoned in Britain, and were kept inside for the duration of the war.
Edited by flemke on Tuesday 18th July 19:24
flemke said:
dilbert said:
I didn't know that. Much as I find the whole of Formula 1 a bit tiresome these days, possibly because of Max, I think I'd rather live with F1 being screwed up than the whole country.
OT annotation: Mosley parents were "aristocrats" who founded the British Union of Fascists in the '30s. They were pals of Hitler's and spent a good bit of time with him, including in July of 1939. (Max Mosley was born approximately 9 months later in April, 1940: interesting coincidence...
) About a month after wee Max came into this world, his parents were imprisoned in Britain, and were kept inside for the duration of the war.
Edited by flemke on Tuesday 18th July 19:24
Spooky!
I have to say that, although I couldn't really forward a reasonable, seminal solution to the woes of F1 racing, I ultimately agree dictating how things should be isn't right.
I thought that the point of the thing in the first place was for the racing to refine the ideal solution. O.K. so that's been done now, but the trouble is that there is no room for a genuinely, out of the box, innovative solution.
O.K. so the teams can possibly experiment within the scope of fuel efficiency, but I'd have thought that it would be better for the designers of the cars to come up with their own ideas. When was the last time in F1 that two teams were achieving the same thing, completely different ways?
So, allright the cars don't have interchangeable parts..... But they all have the same basic arrangement and type of parts, and that's the thing, in my mind.
Much as I hate to bring it up here, this is the particular reason why I have so much affection for the porsche marque. At a time when european motorsport was quite entrenched, they eventually blitzed the field with an approach that everybody else said was wrong.
All the time that the scope is defined by the likes of Max, anyone with an outsider of an idea is rejected before they have a chance to try.
Edited to add;
Unless of course it's Max in an attempt to save the world by harvesting the talent of F1 motorsport.
Edited by dilbert on Tuesday 18th July 19:51
flemke said:
dilbert said:
I didn't know that. Much as I find the whole of Formula 1 a bit tiresome these days, possibly because of Max, I think I'd rather live with F1 being screwed up than the whole country.
OT annotation: Mosley parents were "aristocrats" who founded the British Union of Fascists in the '30s. They were pals of Hitler's and spent a good bit of time with him, including in July of 1939. (Max Mosley was born approximately 9 months later in April, 1940: interesting coincidence...
) About a month after wee Max came into this world, his parents were imprisoned in Britain, and were kept inside for the duration of the war.
Plus Hitler was a guest at Max's mum & dads wedding which was held in Joseph Goebbels house.
Gassing Station | General Motorsport | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff