Wrong Car, Wrong Car !
Discussion
Did anybody watch Right Car, Wrong Car last night ? The punter's got £30K to spend so the young trendy one offers him 3 new cars, an Elise, a Z3 M (I think) and a Scooby. He loves the Elise but it sounds like a Viva, the BMW sounds nice but won't go round corners and he loves the Scoob but his girlfriend won't let him buy it 
, apparently she's gonna be driving the car as well.
The little bald one then offers him 3 used cars, a one year old Griff 500, an NSX and the bald one's personal favourite, a Boxster. Now I didnt clock the plate so I don't know whether it was a 2.5 or a 2.7 but it definitely wasn't an S. I would have thought he could have got an S for that money or a RHD 993 or even my LHD 996 (see classifieds) :endofshamelessplug:. Age was no barrier as the NSX was 10 years old.
Anyway, he didnt like the nasty Jap interior of the NSX, he loved the Griff but managed to lose it going round a wet bend at about 20
and hated the Boxster. It was his first drive of a Porsche and he said he expected so much more.
In the end he chooses the Griff. I just hope they go back to him in a year and ask how he got on. So Dave, your £30K TVR is now worth £20K and you've only just about paid off the interest on your finance, you've had to get it serviced twice, you were driving a Nissan Micra for 6 weeks while the engine was replaced under warranty and your girlfriend won't go above 30 for fear of wrapping it round a tree. Are you pleased with it ?
If you Tiv boys just think I'm bitter because you won, you're damn right
, apparently she's gonna be driving the car as well. The little bald one then offers him 3 used cars, a one year old Griff 500, an NSX and the bald one's personal favourite, a Boxster. Now I didnt clock the plate so I don't know whether it was a 2.5 or a 2.7 but it definitely wasn't an S. I would have thought he could have got an S for that money or a RHD 993 or even my LHD 996 (see classifieds) :endofshamelessplug:. Age was no barrier as the NSX was 10 years old.
Anyway, he didnt like the nasty Jap interior of the NSX, he loved the Griff but managed to lose it going round a wet bend at about 20
and hated the Boxster. It was his first drive of a Porsche and he said he expected so much more. In the end he chooses the Griff. I just hope they go back to him in a year and ask how he got on. So Dave, your £30K TVR is now worth £20K and you've only just about paid off the interest on your finance, you've had to get it serviced twice, you were driving a Nissan Micra for 6 weeks while the engine was replaced under warranty and your girlfriend won't go above 30 for fear of wrapping it round a tree. Are you pleased with it ?
If you Tiv boys just think I'm bitter because you won, you're damn right
I only saw glimpses of the program & the last few minutes,where the guy walked stright past the Elise to the TVR.
Good luck to him his heart ruled his decision & what ever happens he will have fulfilled a dream.
For excitement can you possibly compare a brief drive in a Boxster to a 5 litre Grifiths?? The Boxster may get better as time goes on,but the guy would clearly be wondering what it would have been like to have some real power.
Good luck to him his heart ruled his decision & what ever happens he will have fulfilled a dream.
For excitement can you possibly compare a brief drive in a Boxster to a 5 litre Grifiths?? The Boxster may get better as time goes on,but the guy would clearly be wondering what it would have been like to have some real power.
It was his first drive of a Porsche and he said he expected so much more.
If you Tiv boys just think I'm bitter because you won, you're damn right
....I think his exact words were "The Boxster was totally uninspiring" + "it reminds me of my mother".
They never even got as far as mentioning the clutch (!) because by that time he had driven the Tiv and had a serious hard on !!!!
Better luck next time
The bloke was buying with his heart and his ears - not his head. Also - a brief test drive in a Boxster is not going to bring out its qualities which are subtle frankly.
Also: 26K. His budget was 30! For that extra 4K they could have put up a significantly newer Boxster or possibly even found an early S.
The Porsche did not get a fair crack - but even if it HAD he wouldn't have bought it. That guy wanted the Griff the moment he saw it. And why not? Sounds brilliant and goes like stink. He will either love it and gladly deal with the issues of owning a Tiv or he'll lose patience with it rapidly.
To my mind he looked like a newbie enthusiast. Hope he enjoys the car...
Also: 26K. His budget was 30! For that extra 4K they could have put up a significantly newer Boxster or possibly even found an early S.
The Porsche did not get a fair crack - but even if it HAD he wouldn't have bought it. That guy wanted the Griff the moment he saw it. And why not? Sounds brilliant and goes like stink. He will either love it and gladly deal with the issues of owning a Tiv or he'll lose patience with it rapidly.
To my mind he looked like a newbie enthusiast. Hope he enjoys the car...
I'd have thought for £30k they would have looked at a more powerfull 911 instead of the boxster. Nothing against the Boxster (I'd love one) but the 911s are generally more powerfull and thats what this guy wanted.
Maybe a 993 or 964RS ? For sure he could have lost it coming off a roundabout in the wet with a 911 or boxster.
I was curious to hear not a dicky bird about servicing or reliability uttered by either presenter. Hmmm.. £30k now and bank on another £1k every six months for repair/maintenance, plus depreciation, so over a 5 year period thats.... etc etc
Maybe a 993 or 964RS ? For sure he could have lost it coming off a roundabout in the wet with a 911 or boxster.
I was curious to hear not a dicky bird about servicing or reliability uttered by either presenter. Hmmm.. £30k now and bank on another £1k every six months for repair/maintenance, plus depreciation, so over a 5 year period thats.... etc etc
911newbie said:
I was curious to hear not a dicky bird about servicing or reliability uttered by either presenter. Hmmm.. £30k now and bank on another £1k every six months for repair/maintenance, plus depreciation, so over a 5 year period thats.... etc etc
Absolute rubbish. Servicing cost depends on mileage and will not cost him anything like £2,000 a year. Repairs will cost him nothing as 1) Griffs are pretty reliable and 2) that car will come with a warranty.
You are perfectly entitled to your opinion and life would be very dull if everyone had the same opinions. But do try and get the factual stuff correct
:wandersoffshakinghisheadsadly:
N17 TVR said:
My point exactly! The Boxster was NEVER going to appeal to that bloke. He got the right car for him. The Boxster is a MUCH subtler experience and he needed something upfront and in-yer-face.
I can't think of a better car than the Griff for that.
And its true that the Griff would be under warranty - the Boxster he was shown would not have been. Wrong Boxster IMHO.
But hey..if everyone got off on Porsches TVRs wouldn't sell...and that would be very sad indeed.
I used to have an M Roadster and test drove a 2.7 Boxster an S and a Griff as its replacement.
Whilst the standard Boxster felt more planted on the road than my M, it lacked outright acceleration and a sense of fun. The S was much much better, but I still felt it was lacking in the fun department. I remember thinking that if I wanted a car to drive fast from A to B, I'd choose the S, if I wanted to drive just for the fun of it, I'd take the M. I have little doubt that the S handled much better than the M, but there was something about the M that meant you had to focus and really drive it. I think its called crude rear suspension!
I then drove a Griff and that was even more extreme and really appealed to me. Again, I have little doubt that the S is a faster car round corners, is better screwed together and generally handles better, BUT, for me the Griff is more fun because of its old fashioned handling characteristics.
To give another example, on a track I really enjoy powersliding out of corners and generally letting the tail hang out. It is by no way the fastest way round
the track, but it is great fun. And that's what I feel about the S versus the Griff. The S is a quicker car, but, for me, the Griff is more fun.
It always used to amuse me that on Subaru trackdays all people ever used to talk about was the difficulty in getting their cars to oversteer, yet at the same time they looked down their noses at 'inferior' rear wheel drive cars.
Interestingly on the programme last night they went round a roundabout a couple of times in the M trying to provoke oversteer, and complained that it would only understeer. Then they mentioned they had the traction control on!!
The great thing is there are now all these (reasonably affordable) cars with such different traits and we have the choice.
Most Pistonheads applaud the existence of all performance cars, and a bit of light hearted banter aside, refrain from childish 'my car's better than your car' jibes....
Whilst the standard Boxster felt more planted on the road than my M, it lacked outright acceleration and a sense of fun. The S was much much better, but I still felt it was lacking in the fun department. I remember thinking that if I wanted a car to drive fast from A to B, I'd choose the S, if I wanted to drive just for the fun of it, I'd take the M. I have little doubt that the S handled much better than the M, but there was something about the M that meant you had to focus and really drive it. I think its called crude rear suspension!
I then drove a Griff and that was even more extreme and really appealed to me. Again, I have little doubt that the S is a faster car round corners, is better screwed together and generally handles better, BUT, for me the Griff is more fun because of its old fashioned handling characteristics.
To give another example, on a track I really enjoy powersliding out of corners and generally letting the tail hang out. It is by no way the fastest way round
the track, but it is great fun. And that's what I feel about the S versus the Griff. The S is a quicker car, but, for me, the Griff is more fun.
It always used to amuse me that on Subaru trackdays all people ever used to talk about was the difficulty in getting their cars to oversteer, yet at the same time they looked down their noses at 'inferior' rear wheel drive cars.
Interestingly on the programme last night they went round a roundabout a couple of times in the M trying to provoke oversteer, and complained that it would only understeer. Then they mentioned they had the traction control on!!
The great thing is there are now all these (reasonably affordable) cars with such different traits and we have the choice.
Most Pistonheads applaud the existence of all performance cars, and a bit of light hearted banter aside, refrain from childish 'my car's better than your car' jibes....
griff2be said:
It always used to amuse me that on Subaru trackdays all people ever used to talk about was the difficulty in getting their cars to oversteer
????? On fast corners both the Scoobies I have had would oversteer naturally, on slower corners they just need a slight lift/left foot brake.
The only time I ever had a problem with understeer, was when my front tires needed changing....
Coming from an Audi S3 I can't help but think he will get a shock at TVR build quality, running costs etc. Presenters would definately have done him a favour if they had added these 'facts' to his choices.
I love TVR's, but (and it is a but based on all the general cries for help and advice on this site from TVR drivers who have just suffered another 'problem'), I think he may find the ownership experience a bit trying. Also; TVR was outside his budget of £26, so what happened to the budget when he went for the TVR? £30 would have got him into a broader/newer choice of cars. (especially as the Griff was up for £32K).
OK, had my say, off to lunch in the Lexus 400 now!
Igg
I love TVR's, but (and it is a but based on all the general cries for help and advice on this site from TVR drivers who have just suffered another 'problem'), I think he may find the ownership experience a bit trying. Also; TVR was outside his budget of £26, so what happened to the budget when he went for the TVR? £30 would have got him into a broader/newer choice of cars. (especially as the Griff was up for £32K).
OK, had my say, off to lunch in the Lexus 400 now!
Igg
CraigAlsop said:
griff2be said:
It always used to amuse me that on Subaru trackdays all people ever used to talk about was the difficulty in getting their cars to oversteer
On fast corners both the Scoobies I have had would oversteer naturally, on slower corners they just need a slight lift/left foot brake.
The only time I ever had a problem with understeer, was when my front tires needed changing....
Did you have the Prodrive suspension settings? Because otherwise the Scoob was set up to, and does, understeer. Most people were not good enough drivers to actively think about the balance of the car, mid corner, on a track - and lift off to promote oversteer then get back on the throttle to keep it out there. I certainly wasn't!
clubsport said:
For excitement can you possibly compare a brief drive in a Boxster to a 5 litre Grifiths?? The Boxster may get better as time goes on,but the guy would clearly be wondering what it would have been like to have some real power.
No doubt about the Griff's startling credentials but I always found the sheer driveability of a boggo MkI Elise eminently satisfying, even when it shared it's four poster with a top hole Cerbera.
In other words, the argument about TVR grunt overcoming all other planes of automotive enjoyment is simply flawed.
At the end of the day, as has been oft cited by worthier wheelmen on this very forum, the overall balance of a 16v MkII Golf GTi, for example, provides a dynamic experience few might superficially give much credence to.
There is simply no car in production today that gives somebody looking for daily/main car credentials PLUS a real driver's edge, quite the package offered by a Boxster - even if it's not an 'S.'
And surely that's the point here? Of course, a quick twist of the key will seduce most who sample Tivdom for the first time but frankly, any vaguely objective analysis of the Boxter's repertoire will reveal that there's always more than one way to skin a cat!
igg said: Coming from an Audi S3 I can't help but think he will get a shock at TVR build quality, running costs etc. Presenters would definately have done him a favour if they had added these 'facts' to his choices.
I love TVR's, but (and it is a but based on all the general cries for help and advice on this site from TVR drivers who have just suffered another 'problem'), I think he may find the ownership experience a bit trying. Also; TVR was outside his budget of £26, so what happened to the budget when he went for the TVR? £30 would have got him into a broader/newer choice of cars. (especially as the Griff was up for £32K).
OK, had my say, off to lunch in the Lexus 400 now!
Igg
I agree - it wasn't at all clear if he went into TVR ownership with his eyes open. I find the TVR ownership experience very rewarding, but I did a lot of research before hand and knew what to expect. Had I not I may have had a few unpleasant surprises if I had tried to treat the Griff as just another mass produced car.
That said, I had more problems with my BMW than I have had with the Griff - and the Griff problems were caused by the (now-ex) TVR dealer working on it.
Derestrictor...I agree that the Grunt will not alone overcome all automotive flaws...But for this guy who seemed to put his main criteria for buying a car down to marque prestige & noise,it was a no brainer for him.
In fact how on earth did they stretch this program out to 30 minutes ??
Personally i would have had an Elise 111s for the money as I feel it would be more rewarding & with some good training I would get more value out of it with my type of driving.
In fact how on earth did they stretch this program out to 30 minutes ??
Personally i would have had an Elise 111s for the money as I feel it would be more rewarding & with some good training I would get more value out of it with my type of driving.
Errr wrong acutually. Our Griff, purchased 18 months ago has depreciated by about £500 - no more. They seem to be holding their value very well at the moment now the factory have stopped producing them.
I just hope they go back to him in a year and ask how he got on. So Dave, your £30K TVR is now worth £20K and you've only just about paid off the interest on your finance,
Firstly, N17, if you're only going to take the piss, then please leave. Your childish comments are not welcome in this post. The fact you've only got a spent clutch to bang on about speaks volumes. Where do you start with TVR reliability?
Secondly, why the hell didn't they find him an S? We both thought the 2.7 was okay but when we drove an S, well, that was it. Plus Emm uses it everyday, so she had to be able to open the doors and so forth.
I was shouting at the screen.
Secondly, why the hell didn't they find him an S? We both thought the 2.7 was okay but when we drove an S, well, that was it. Plus Emm uses it everyday, so she had to be able to open the doors and so forth.
I was shouting at the screen.
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