Brake upgrade for fast road use ?
Discussion
What the best value for money option for fast road use.Can I do a disc and pad upgrade and keep the std calipers and fit braided hoses ? Or am i better off getting new calipers aswell ?Just do the fronts or do the rears need doing aswell ?I have new Gaz suspension and drop links and 17 and 18 inch wheels ready to fit and am currently talking to V8 racing about a 5.4 upgrade so need something to compliment this lot without breaking the bank.Any contact names / no.s much apprieciated.
Before you spend any money, be clear in your own mind why you are doing the upgrade.
If you think that your brakes will suffer from overheating, find out whether they do and if so fix the problem - which may be with the brakes, or the driver. Braking performance can drop off dramatically if you have the wrong pads, pads/brakes not bedded in correctly, defective calipers, or knackered fluid and/or hoses. If you have any of these problems then simply bringing the brakes back up to good working order will make a bi difference and may be all you need.
If the brakes are in good condition and still overheating, you need to know how severe the problem is in order to decide how far you need to upgrade them. If you are driving the car on public roads it is extremely unlikely that you will fade the original brakes if you are driving sensibly. If you're going on track and able to push the car hard enough to fade the brakes then you have the option of fitting harder pads and grooved pads, and fitting cooling ducts and fresh fluid with a high temperature rating.
If this still doesn't do it then you need to know which brakes are overheating and how badly. It'll probably be the fronts that go first, but you need to know. If you are in this situation you will probably find that a standard big brake upgrade on the front is enough to sort the problem. I suggest you avoid any front upgrade bigger than 285mm, and any upgrade that involves replacing the front calipers, and any upgrade that involves any changes at all to the rear calipers, if at all possible.
If you think that your brakes will suffer from overheating, find out whether they do and if so fix the problem - which may be with the brakes, or the driver. Braking performance can drop off dramatically if you have the wrong pads, pads/brakes not bedded in correctly, defective calipers, or knackered fluid and/or hoses. If you have any of these problems then simply bringing the brakes back up to good working order will make a bi difference and may be all you need.
If the brakes are in good condition and still overheating, you need to know how severe the problem is in order to decide how far you need to upgrade them. If you are driving the car on public roads it is extremely unlikely that you will fade the original brakes if you are driving sensibly. If you're going on track and able to push the car hard enough to fade the brakes then you have the option of fitting harder pads and grooved pads, and fitting cooling ducts and fresh fluid with a high temperature rating.
If this still doesn't do it then you need to know which brakes are overheating and how badly. It'll probably be the fronts that go first, but you need to know. If you are in this situation you will probably find that a standard big brake upgrade on the front is enough to sort the problem. I suggest you avoid any front upgrade bigger than 285mm, and any upgrade that involves replacing the front calipers, and any upgrade that involves any changes at all to the rear calipers, if at all possible.
I'd say it depends on how often, if at all, you'll use the car on track. And whether you want big shiny discs behind those new wheels! I have a near standard engine and have standard sized drilled & grooved discs, DS2500 pads, braided hoses and 5.1 fluid (oh, and R888 toyos). Plenty powerful enough but I do get some overheating problems - never fades but the pads and discs have a fairly short life.
GreenV8S said:
I suggest you avoid any front upgrade bigger than 285mm, and any upgrade that involves replacing the front calipers, and any upgrade that involves any changes at all to the rear calipers, if at all possible.
Why? I've got four pots on the front and 2 pots on the rear of mine and it pulls up just nicely.
groucho said:
Why? I've got four pots on the front and 2 pots on the rear of mine and it pulls up just nicely.
Because if you change the calipers you need to recalculate the line pressures front/rear to get the right static balance and then correct the bias valve to suit - if you just space the front calipers out then you know that you're safe and the effects on the balance are small and in the right direction.
I didn't say I did it myself.Cheers GV8S.Brakes don't feel as good as I think they should.Highlighted that fact at last service but apart from deglazing the pads they came back with a clean bill of health.Never suffered with brake fade but could do with something with a bit more feel and bite especially as I may be moving a bit quicker with the engine upgrade and I'd rather spend money on a caliper upgrade with matching discs /pads first time around rather than changing discs and pads then finding that they still don't offer enough bite and having to spend money again to do another upgrade.But if a 285mm disc upgrade with some decent pads and braided hoses is going to make a world of difference I don't really want to be wasting money on caliper upgrades.
Decisions, decisions.
Decisions, decisions.
Hi Scorcher, I upgraded to EBC red stuff pads, turbo groove discs and braided hoses all round and the difference is superb, a huge improvement on my standard setup. Like everything I think it depends on how much you want to spend. I hillclimb my Griff and for the money this was a great upgrade!!
See this link for more info...
www.pistonheads.co.uk/gassing/topic.asp?t=251913&f=9&h=0&hw=red+stuff
Lig.
See this link for more info...
www.pistonheads.co.uk/gassing/topic.asp?t=251913&f=9&h=0&hw=red+stuff
Lig.
I'm another one that firmly believes the later standard stuff, in good order, will rarely provide insufficient stopping power. But, the calipers are agricultural in appearance and construction despite functional ability and on grounds of weight and aesthetics alone, I'll have no aversion to evicting mine to make way for some Wilwoods as soon as funds allow (and maybe before). Having just fitted a set to a chum's Elan, very very impressed with the quality, design and effectiveness.
Did those Wilwoods have seals? Most of them don't, which in theory makes them unsuitable for road use. And I know people who've changed to aftermarket alloy calipers and had terrible problems with them flexing causing brake judder.
My Wilwoods have been in daily use and also tracked heavily and I've never had the slightest trouble with them, just pointing out that sometimes changing things like this can cause more problems than they cure. I certainly wouldn't advise making this sort of change unless you're sure you need it.
My Wilwoods have been in daily use and also tracked heavily and I've never had the slightest trouble with them, just pointing out that sometimes changing things like this can cause more problems than they cure. I certainly wouldn't advise making this sort of change unless you're sure you need it.
GreenV8S said:
Did those Wilwoods have seals? Most of them don't, which in theory makes them unsuitable for road use. And I know people who've changed to aftermarket alloy calipers and had terrible problems with them flexing causing brake judder.
My Wilwoods have been in daily use and also tracked heavily and I've never had the slightest trouble with them, just pointing out that sometimes changing things like this can cause more problems than they cure. I certainly wouldn't advise making this sort of change unless you're sure you need it.
My Wilwoods have been in daily use and also tracked heavily and I've never had the slightest trouble with them, just pointing out that sometimes changing things like this can cause more problems than they cure. I certainly wouldn't advise making this sort of change unless you're sure you need it.
It's true these ones didn't although I know others in the range do now offer seals and that did concern me... the owner has been told that regular maintenance will be needed (time will tell). The design didn't strike me as being likely to be anything other than completely rigid but, again, experience will be the test. Alloy calipers are the norm in the bike world and judder is not a regular issue even though rotors and mountings are much less massive (I know the loads are pretty different).
Pads are 'std'.(whatever that is )and the fluid was changed on the last service for 5.1 according to my invoice.People seem to be getting good results with grooved discs and uprated pads and hoses so will probably go this route once I've worked out what size my hubs are.If I'm still not happy I'll have to buy my missus some brake calipers for her xmas present.Sorted!
'Standard' pads could be just about anything. You need decent quality fast road pads, and it's important that they're bedded in properly following the manufacturers instructions. Sorry for banging on about this but you'd be amazed how many people seem to think that new pads just need to be driven gently for a while.
The Resso just couldnt out Brake us 
Ballistic Banana said:
Or keep up
Seasider said:
Grooved, dimpled, braided, Tyres!!!! I await FFG
Edited by Seasider on Tuesday 8th August 20:57
Sorry Del, bit slow.
Those R888's are unbeleivable. My neck is still sore where the seat belt gripped me. I'm surprised the cra didn't seprate from the chassis the braking power was that good. Will defo consider for Mac 2.
Had to replace them yet?
FFG
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