Wrong way up the motorway - but stuck to the limit
Discussion
Could this be an illustration of why speed has little to do with safety 
On a serious note, thank the appropriate deity that nobody met their maker.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/le
Extract follows:
The motorist apparently stuck to the 70mph speed limit during the trip.
Highways Agency officers set up a rolling road block to slow traffic down but the Ford Fiesta overtook the patrol despite its flashing amber lights.
Other motorists ignored electronic motorway signs which warned them about the oncoming vehicle and asked them to slow to 20mph.
Does this show us what happens when motorists are faced with what appears to be a stupidly low limit, although I would obviously agree that 20 mph in this case was a sensible limit.
Nice to see that the public is getting the idea though isn't it? If you are within the speed limit, you are safe
On a serious note, thank the appropriate deity that nobody met their maker.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/le
Extract follows:
The motorist apparently stuck to the 70mph speed limit during the trip.
Highways Agency officers set up a rolling road block to slow traffic down but the Ford Fiesta overtook the patrol despite its flashing amber lights.
Other motorists ignored electronic motorway signs which warned them about the oncoming vehicle and asked them to slow to 20mph.
Does this show us what happens when motorists are faced with what appears to be a stupidly low limit, although I would obviously agree that 20 mph in this case was a sensible limit.
Nice to see that the public is getting the idea though isn't it? If you are within the speed limit, you are safe
Edited by 711 on Wednesday 9th August 19:31
bbc said:
Highways Agency officers set up a rolling road block to slow traffic down but the Ford Fiesta overtook the patrol despite its flashing amber lights.
They set up a rolling road block going the wrong way on a motorway? 
How does one overtake a rolling road block anyway? Surely it's only a road block if it covers all three lanes? If it didn't it begs the question how many people wouldn't overtake a Highways Agency patrol with amber lights flashing? (Apart from those dosy eejits who think it's the BiB 
). The only other amber flashing lights I can think of me "caution - I'm here and moving slowly" - nothing at all would suggest that it was supposed to mean "do not pass".Speed and road training are different things...
There is plenty of pensioners who bimble about at 25mph causing dangerous overtakes etc...pulling out of junctions without looking properly and generally display a poor standard of driving...
It is possible to speed and be a safe motorist too remember...there is just a time and a place...
A swift well judged drive is to me a better real world standard of driving than 25mph with your attention directed elsewhere other than the road..
20mph motorway speed signs are rarely adhered to..
There is plenty of pensioners who bimble about at 25mph causing dangerous overtakes etc...pulling out of junctions without looking properly and generally display a poor standard of driving...
It is possible to speed and be a safe motorist too remember...there is just a time and a place...
A swift well judged drive is to me a better real world standard of driving than 25mph with your attention directed elsewhere other than the road..
20mph motorway speed signs are rarely adhered to..
vonhosen said:
The telling quote is
Probably something to do with the fact that these signs are usually several hours out of date when I pass them. Either that or the queues they warn about are clearly being caused by the signs showing low numbers and warning of queues.from link said:
Other motorists ignored electronic motorway signs which warned them about the oncoming vehicle and asked them to slow to 20mph
vonhosen said:
The telling quote is
Other motorists ignored electronic motorway signs which warned them about the oncoming vehicle and asked them to slow to 20mph
from link said:
Other motorists ignored electronic motorway signs which warned them about the oncoming vehicle and asked them to slow to 20mph
Edited by vonhosen on Wednesday 9th August 19:45
I agree - it's very telling. Telling that the temporary speed warnings used on motorways are now ignored because they can be left on for days at a time, when the reason they were originally put on was cleared up in 10 minutes.
I know it's no excuse, but I for one get thoroughly hacked off with being a good little driver and taking twice as long to do a 10 mile stint down the motorway, only to find that there was no reason for it at all.
And before anyone tells me of the unseen hazards that might or might not have existed and been a reason for the temp. restriction, Cobblers is what I say. They are turned on as and when needed but they only get turned off when someone spots they've been on a week and a half - which is probably the next patrol car now they aren't needed due to "safety cameras"
I stopped someone doing this a few months ago. It was at J17 of the M6 where the sliproads come to a T rather than a roundabout, at about 1am. I was coming off southbound and just as I was getting to the top of the sliproad a white golf turned into the sliproad heading towards me... cue much flashing, horning and swerving from me and he stopped, waved and reversed back up. Mad as a hatstand.
vonhosen said:
The telling quote is
from link said:
Other motorists ignored electronic motorway signs which warned them about the oncoming vehicle and asked them to slow to 20mph
Edited by vonhosen on Wednesday 9th August 19:45
Yep, it tells us that motorists have completely lost faith in the ability of policy and government to set a speed limit that is sensible.
I'm sure we all remember the fable about crying wolf? Now when we have a real wolf, nobody listens.
vonhosen said:
It tells us people think it doesn't apply to them because they live in the belief it won't happen to them only others, because they think they are a special case.
I think we'll have to agree to disagree on this one Von, as we are both interpreting this same "fact" in a different way and we can only post it as we see it.
Anybody who ignores an explicit warning of an oncomer on the wrong side of a DC or motorway with a request to slow to a speed as slow as 20mph (as reported), simply on the off chance that the sign may have forgotten to have been turned off, needs their head tested.
They clearly are driving in the belief it's not going to happen/doesn't apply to them, just leaving their fate to luck.
They clearly are driving in the belief it's not going to happen/doesn't apply to them, just leaving their fate to luck.
Edited by vonhosen on Wednesday 9th August 22:04
vonhosen said:
Anybody who ignores an explicit warning of an oncomer on the wrong side of a DC or motorway with a request to slow to a speed as slow as 20mph (as reported), simply on the off chance that the sign may have forgotten to have been turned off, needs their head tested.
They clearly are driving in the belief it's not going to happen/doesn't apply to them.
They clearly are driving in the belief it's not going to happen/doesn't apply to them.
Edited by vonhosen on Wednesday 9th August 21:54
I have to admit that in this case, a 20 limit would have been ringing alarm bells with me as it's way below what the matrix signs usually say. Thankfully, I've never seen a sign saying "oncomer on wrong side" and if I did I would be tempted to either leave the motorway immediately or slow to the advisory or less.
The point I was originally making is that drivers are loosing faith in the speed limit system, and new lowered limits will only make this worse. Obviously, if there is an explicit sign saying "you are about to die in a head on collision with some nutter on the wrong side of the motorway, please slow to 20" this would change ones perspective of the limit posted at that time
And if someone that cannot comprehend that if you lie to someone 499 times, they aren't going to believe you on the 500th time you tell them obviously it's not worth continuing the debate.
A road I used to drive down regularly had a "FOG" warning sign, with speed reduction usually to 30mph, cant remember the exact timeframe, but I believe it was on the 9th or 10th totally clear day I asked a policeman if it was likely to be turned back off at some point, so I could be saved the sudden needless braking by people coming across it. Really improved road safety that did...
A road I used to drive down regularly had a "FOG" warning sign, with speed reduction usually to 30mph, cant remember the exact timeframe, but I believe it was on the 9th or 10th totally clear day I asked a policeman if it was likely to be turned back off at some point, so I could be saved the sudden needless braking by people coming across it. Really improved road safety that did...
davi said:
And if someone that cannot comprehend that if you lie to someone 499 times, they aren't going to believe you on the 500th time you tell them obviously it's not worth continuing the debate.
A road I used to drive down regularly had a "FOG" warning sign, with speed reduction usually to 30mph, cant remember the exact timeframe, but I believe it was on the 9th or 10th totally clear day I asked a policeman if it was likely to be turned back off at some point, so I could be saved the sudden needless braking by people coming across it. Really improved road safety that did...
A road I used to drive down regularly had a "FOG" warning sign, with speed reduction usually to 30mph, cant remember the exact timeframe, but I believe it was on the 9th or 10th totally clear day I asked a policeman if it was likely to be turned back off at some point, so I could be saved the sudden needless braking by people coming across it. Really improved road safety that did...
It's your life you are gambling with though & possibly others.
With a warning such as this case I'll go for a show of caution & preservation of life everytime thanks. I'm willing to sacrifice the progress for that.
And if someone can't comprehend that, then I agree, there really is nothing more to be said on the matter.
Edited by vonhosen on Wednesday 9th August 22:20
I saw an articulated lorry do this!!!
And a big 4x4 towing a large caravan.
If a motorway sign gave a reduced speed I'd assume that there was an evens chance that there was actually an incident ahead and I'd instantly be on the look out. I'd also be watching my speed a bit more even if I didn't slow down to the posted limit. Often the posted speed bears little relation to the actual danger. I've seen a 20 posted once when some tyres had fallen off a trailer and were rolling back down the motorway with cars swerving to avoid them, it was like the dogems and 20 was perfectly justified.
And a big 4x4 towing a large caravan.
If a motorway sign gave a reduced speed I'd assume that there was an evens chance that there was actually an incident ahead and I'd instantly be on the look out. I'd also be watching my speed a bit more even if I didn't slow down to the posted limit. Often the posted speed bears little relation to the actual danger. I've seen a 20 posted once when some tyres had fallen off a trailer and were rolling back down the motorway with cars swerving to avoid them, it was like the dogems and 20 was perfectly justified.
vonhosen said:
davi said:
And if someone that cannot comprehend that if you lie to someone 499 times, they aren't going to believe you on the 500th time you tell them obviously it's not worth continuing the debate.
A road I used to drive down regularly had a "FOG" warning sign, with speed reduction usually to 30mph, cant remember the exact timeframe, but I believe it was on the 9th or 10th totally clear day I asked a policeman if it was likely to be turned back off at some point, so I could be saved the sudden needless braking by people coming across it. Really improved road safety that did...
A road I used to drive down regularly had a "FOG" warning sign, with speed reduction usually to 30mph, cant remember the exact timeframe, but I believe it was on the 9th or 10th totally clear day I asked a policeman if it was likely to be turned back off at some point, so I could be saved the sudden needless braking by people coming across it. Really improved road safety that did...
It's your life you are gambling with though & possibly others.
With a warning such as this case I'll go for a show of caution & preservation of life everytime thanks. I'm willing to sacrifice the progress for that.
And if someone can't comprehend that, then I agree, there really is nothing more to be said on the matter.
Edited by vonhosen on Wednesday 9th August 22:20
Well I don't drive these with ignorance, I decrease speed, I adjust driving pattern and distances and make sure there are no distractions, I am simply explaining to you why no-one else does, and unfortunatley the lack of willingness to recognise the reasons no one else does makes it my problem, which is why I get so pissed off with it. I think the closest I have come to an accident on the motorway in recent years is nearly being rear ended by someone because I was travelling 50mph below the speed of everyone else, in accordance with the signage (well not quite in accordance, but close)
vonhosen said:
Anybody who ignores an explicit warning of an oncomer on the wrong side of a DC or motorway with a request to slow to a speed as slow as 20mph (as reported), simply on the off chance that the sign may have forgotten to have been turned off, needs their head tested.
They clearly are driving in the belief it's not going to happen/doesn't apply to them, just leaving their fate to luck.
They clearly are driving in the belief it's not going to happen/doesn't apply to them, just leaving their fate to luck.
(my bold)
Von' - usually you talk a lot of sense (even if I disagree...) - but how have you come to the conclusion that an explicit warning was shown? All I can see is that there was a 20mph limit imposed, which people ignored (not an advisory, or a warning but a LIMIT). Oh, and the small matter of a Highways agency vehicle adding to the danger by also going the wrong way, something I believe even a police pursuit isn't allowed to do(ever)!?! IMHO the HATO would have been much better off trying to slow the other traffic, and the matrix signs should have effectively CLOSED the M1 for a short while (not that people realise that an X is equivalent to a red light, thou shalt not pass...although I don't think that 15 mile stretch of the M1 has overhead gantrys with matrix signs on...just one's in the middle).
Can't believe that this driver wasn't arrested though...would love to know more details about why the police don't consider 15 miles the wrong way down a motorway as DWDC (if not worse)?
tigger1 said:
vonhosen said:
Anybody who ignores an explicit warning of an oncomer on the wrong side of a DC or motorway with a request to slow to a speed as slow as 20mph (as reported), simply on the off chance that the sign may have forgotten to have been turned off, needs their head tested.
They clearly are driving in the belief it's not going to happen/doesn't apply to them, just leaving their fate to luck.
They clearly are driving in the belief it's not going to happen/doesn't apply to them, just leaving their fate to luck.
(my bold)
Von' - usually you talk a lot of sense (even if I disagree...) - but how have you come to the conclusion that an explicit warning was shown? All I can see is that there was a 20mph limit imposed, which people ignored (not an advisory, or a warning but a LIMIT). Oh, and the small matter of a Highways agency vehicle adding to the danger by also going the wrong way, something I believe even a police pursuit isn't allowed to do(ever)!?! IMHO the HATO would have been much better off trying to slow the other traffic, and the matrix signs should have effectively CLOSED the M1 for a short while (not that people realise that an X is equivalent to a red light, thou shalt not pass...although I don't think that 15 mile stretch of the M1 has overhead gantrys with matrix signs on...just one's in the middle).
Can't believe that this driver wasn't arrested though...would love to know more details about why the police don't consider 15 miles the wrong way down a motorway as DWDC (if not worse)?
The article says
article said:
Other motorists ignored electronic motorway signs which warned them about the oncoming vehicle and asked them to slow to 20mph
How do you read that ?
I read it as advisory warning & advisory limit.
Edited by vonhosen on Wednesday 9th August 23:09
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