HATOs to take over all trafpol duties
Discussion
My colleague has a son who is 'batman' for one of our CCs and I had an interesting chat with him. It seems HATOs are indeed to take over all trafpol duties including talivan ops, speed traps, traffic violation etc. Technology is going to include tamperproof in car trackers and average speed camera networks. Apparently this is to catch the hoardes of twocers in our inner city scum areas and protect us from speeders. I suggested that, if this was the case, that the first thing these people will learn is to disable any kind of tracking device in a car which will result in the poor owner getting a NIP through his letter box. Average speed camera networks will use ANPR technology to then find the car (Which by now will have some ther poor innocents number plate resulting in him getting an NIP through the letterbox. Stuck for an answer he kind of conceded that the whole shooting match is nothing more than a very efficient and expensive revenue collection system with the more sinister aspect of being able to control people.
I'm still, therefor, of the opinion that anyone who supports any form of speed detection device is part of this revenue collection system (SCP etc) or stupid.
I'm still, therefor, of the opinion that anyone who supports any form of speed detection device is part of this revenue collection system (SCP etc) or stupid.
apache said:
My colleague has a son who is 'batman' for one of our CCs and I had an interesting chat with him. It seems HATOs are indeed to take over all trafpol duties including talivan ops, speed traps, traffic violation etc.
Biggest load of bollox that I've seen on this forum yet! that must be the best "Chinese whisper" yet. Either that or some-ones winding someone up!!!
There is no expanse of powers, there is expanse of area's covered, ie. soon the main TRUNK roads will be covered.
You are all panicing because the HATO drives around in a vehicle that looks like a police vehicle.
The HATO is not there for enforcement, the main job of the HATO is traffic congestion. Keeping the roads as safe as possible by either removing debris, vehicles etc. organising the various speciallist services when needed, performing rolling blocks for whatever. assisting motorist get recovered when broken down.
Passing onto the media network information about problems as soon as it's know roughly how long a problem will last. I'll bet you all are aware nowadays how much more traffic news you get, that information comes from the HATO's.
Nothing at all about enforcement......it's not their job, that's why they are doing what they are doing to allow the police patrols to do proper traffic policing.
You are all panicing because the HATO drives around in a vehicle that looks like a police vehicle.
The HATO is not there for enforcement, the main job of the HATO is traffic congestion. Keeping the roads as safe as possible by either removing debris, vehicles etc. organising the various speciallist services when needed, performing rolling blocks for whatever. assisting motorist get recovered when broken down.
Passing onto the media network information about problems as soon as it's know roughly how long a problem will last. I'll bet you all are aware nowadays how much more traffic news you get, that information comes from the HATO's.
Nothing at all about enforcement......it's not their job, that's why they are doing what they are doing to allow the police patrols to do proper traffic policing.
gafferjim said:
There is no expanse of powers, there is expanse of area's covered, ie. soon the main TRUNK roads will be covered.
You are all panicing because the HATO drives around in a vehicle that looks like a police vehicle.
The HATO is not there for enforcement, the main job of the HATO is traffic congestion. Keeping the roads as safe as possible by either removing debris, vehicles etc. organising the various speciallist services when needed, performing rolling blocks for whatever. assisting motorist get recovered when broken down.
Passing onto the media network information about problems as soon as it's know roughly how long a problem will last. I'll bet you all are aware nowadays how much more traffic news you get, that information comes from the HATO's.
Nothing at all about enforcement......it's not their job, that's why they are doing what they are doing to allow the police patrols to do proper traffic policing.
Watch this space. You are all panicing because the HATO drives around in a vehicle that looks like a police vehicle.
The HATO is not there for enforcement, the main job of the HATO is traffic congestion. Keeping the roads as safe as possible by either removing debris, vehicles etc. organising the various speciallist services when needed, performing rolling blocks for whatever. assisting motorist get recovered when broken down.
Passing onto the media network information about problems as soon as it's know roughly how long a problem will last. I'll bet you all are aware nowadays how much more traffic news you get, that information comes from the HATO's.
Nothing at all about enforcement......it's not their job, that's why they are doing what they are doing to allow the police patrols to do proper traffic policing.
"We have no plans to..."
"We cannot foresee..."
Usually followed by new plans and unforeseen things.
hmmmm, re original post, at the moment I suspect this is over the top in allegations re current situation. However gafferjim neglects to mention that key roles for HATOs include "high profile patrols," "education of the driving public."
Presumably a high profile patrol included one unit sat at night on a perch on the M42 recently. They appeared to have deliberately manouevred half off the perch and up the bank to hide behind bushes so that their livery appeared 'suddenly,' or at least suddenly to anyone insufficiently observant to notice the waves of flaring brake lights ahead.
There is NO doubt in my mind that there WILL be an extension of responsibilities. The comments made above regarding the cynical use of phrases such as "no plans to" "we have no intention of" and the like is very pertinent.
Finally, I refer to Highways Agency / Association of Chief Police Officers Report 2003 and in particular to the discussion of on road activity, "High Profile Patrols" by HA staff, the difficulty of MoP recognising and understanding the HA brand and the thinly veiled proposal to use the countrywide recognised "Police Brand" and "consistent use of vehicle livery."
Not my choice of words btw.
Presumably a high profile patrol included one unit sat at night on a perch on the M42 recently. They appeared to have deliberately manouevred half off the perch and up the bank to hide behind bushes so that their livery appeared 'suddenly,' or at least suddenly to anyone insufficiently observant to notice the waves of flaring brake lights ahead.
There is NO doubt in my mind that there WILL be an extension of responsibilities. The comments made above regarding the cynical use of phrases such as "no plans to" "we have no intention of" and the like is very pertinent.
Finally, I refer to Highways Agency / Association of Chief Police Officers Report 2003 and in particular to the discussion of on road activity, "High Profile Patrols" by HA staff, the difficulty of MoP recognising and understanding the HA brand and the thinly veiled proposal to use the countrywide recognised "Police Brand" and "consistent use of vehicle livery."
Not my choice of words btw.
So would one of our resident BiBs clarify for me please, as I'm arriving back in the UK on Monday for a short visit.
As far as I can see by what is written here, HATOs have NO powers, only advisory, cannot stop anyone, cannot "enforce" anything, can't stop anyone for "speeding", in other words we can actually ignore them??? i.e pretend police?
Not that I would in a traffic accident or motorway clearance situation....
As far as I can see by what is written here, HATOs have NO powers, only advisory, cannot stop anyone, cannot "enforce" anything, can't stop anyone for "speeding", in other words we can actually ignore them??? i.e pretend police?
Not that I would in a traffic accident or motorway clearance situation....
Would it be a bad thing?
police are freed up from catching speeders and can get on with the real business of hunting down scum (not car drivers as they can be easily confused)
While the HATOs get to wander round in there nice easily spotted cars instead of the unmarked cars that plod uses.
It would mean that when we see the BiB we no longer see folk who are only interested in speeding.
Also if you do get caught by these numpties then i am sure being badly trained they are more likely to make mistakes therefore easier to get off on technicalities
Also being cheaper then they can have more of them so more eyes open to bad driving and there will not be the pressure to remove them from traffic duties and put them on the beat for looks.
So if you keep your eyes open and don't drive like a idiot then i see no reason to be bothered.
Only a thought
Though of course i can see it going down the same route as parking has done in englandshire with hundreds hiding behind bushs waiting for you to go 0.0000001 over the limit
Though if anyone knows the company that will run speed enforcement when it does finally get privatized please tell me as want to buy shares
police are freed up from catching speeders and can get on with the real business of hunting down scum (not car drivers as they can be easily confused)
While the HATOs get to wander round in there nice easily spotted cars instead of the unmarked cars that plod uses.
It would mean that when we see the BiB we no longer see folk who are only interested in speeding.
Also if you do get caught by these numpties then i am sure being badly trained they are more likely to make mistakes therefore easier to get off on technicalities
Also being cheaper then they can have more of them so more eyes open to bad driving and there will not be the pressure to remove them from traffic duties and put them on the beat for looks.
So if you keep your eyes open and don't drive like a idiot then i see no reason to be bothered.
Only a thought
Though of course i can see it going down the same route as parking has done in englandshire with hundreds hiding behind bushs waiting for you to go 0.0000001 over the limit
Though if anyone knows the company that will run speed enforcement when it does finally get privatized please tell me as want to buy shares
I agree that the HATO's will likely soon assume an enforcement role. Their current role doesn't seem to be very good "value for money" (the current buzz phrase in Whitehall). Considering the amount of cash that's been shelled out to establish the service, they don't really do that much. Not that I think it's not a useful service, I just can't see the DfT signing off on a business case with that kind of expenditure and no form of recovering costs.
As for the first post, I'm afraid it seems to be mostly scaremongering nonesense.
As for the first post, I'm afraid it seems to be mostly scaremongering nonesense.
Mmnn, interesting responses. As for scaremongering I am only reporting what was said, however it ties in with my own beliefs and Vonhosen etc has already alluded to the increasing roles for HATO.
The technology is a current hot potoato and we shall have to wait and see where it leads, there are definite movements towards a GPS monitoring system and it has been discussed here many times, as has the miles of cable being laid for average time measurement.
It would be enlightening to have some BiB comments about this
The technology is a current hot potoato and we shall have to wait and see where it leads, there are definite movements towards a GPS monitoring system and it has been discussed here many times, as has the miles of cable being laid for average time measurement.
It would be enlightening to have some BiB comments about this
apache said:
Technology is going to include tamperproof in car trackers and average speed camera networks....
...I suggested that, if this was the case, that the first thing these people will learn is to disable any kind of tracking device in a car which will result in the poor owner getting a NIP through his letter box.
...I suggested that, if this was the case, that the first thing these people will learn is to disable any kind of tracking device in a car which will result in the poor owner getting a NIP through his letter box.
There wouldn't need to be cameras - GPS in the car (which we're all getting for sure - it's an EU 'safety' thing) could track your position and compare that with a speed database and just send you a ticket.
However, an easy step (and being actively worked on by Leeds Uni and several others around Europe) is speed control. So you can't exceed the speed limit as the car will control its own maximum speed.
I guess that'll never happen as the revenue impact would be huge, and all the Scamera people will be out of a job!
JMGS4 said:
So would one of our resident BiBs clarify for me please, as I'm arriving back in the UK on Monday for a short visit.
As far as I can see by what is written here, HATOs have NO powers, only advisory, cannot stop anyone, cannot "enforce" anything, can't stop anyone for "speeding", in other words we can actually ignore them??? i.e pretend police?
Not that I would in a traffic accident or motorway clearance situation....
As far as I can see by what is written here, HATOs have NO powers, only advisory, cannot stop anyone, cannot "enforce" anything, can't stop anyone for "speeding", in other words we can actually ignore them??? i.e pretend police?
Not that I would in a traffic accident or motorway clearance situation....
Regardless of whether they have the powers, there are enough stupid/uninformed people on the road who panic and crawl past these guys at +1 mph (ie 61) thus providing a nice rolling roadblock for a good mile behind. Got stuck in two snarlups this evening on the M25 (J4 to J6, way less than 20 miles) and both times it was because there was a HATO in the inside line doing 60 and everyone else would not pass him ...
JMGS4 said:
So would one of our resident BiBs clarify for me please, as I'm arriving back in the UK on Monday for a short visit.
As far as I can see by what is written here, HATOs have NO powers, only advisory, cannot stop anyone, cannot "enforce" anything, can't stop anyone for "speeding", in other words we can actually ignore them??? i.e pretend police?
Not that I would in a traffic accident or motorway clearance situation....
As far as I can see by what is written here, HATOs have NO powers, only advisory, cannot stop anyone, cannot "enforce" anything, can't stop anyone for "speeding", in other words we can actually ignore them??? i.e pretend police?
Not that I would in a traffic accident or motorway clearance situation....
Seeing as no-one else is volunteering to answer here is my response.
No they cannot stop you for speeding etc but they do have certain powers re traffic control in the examples you mention eg accident, road clearance, large loads, special events and so on.
In those cases they have the same powers as a constable to request you to stop and obey their directions, and if you do not comply there is the possibility that you will be reported and stuck on.
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