Herald 13/60 convertible

[mightydquinn]

I just bought one who knows all about them on here then ????

[vitesse boy]

I have had my 13/60 convertable since 1987. Not braggin, but I know every nut and bolt on it! What do you need to know?

[ARH]

I have a GT6 which over the last year I have built from a box of bits, It is pretty much the same but with a bigger engine and smaller body. I will probably be able to help a bit.

[mightydquinn]

Thanks.
I have just taken delivery of this 68, convertible.

The bonnets a bit damaged but It comes with a replacement metal bonnet.
The bottoms of the door stick out about Half inch?

It appears to drive ok but when selecting first it goes into reverse and crunches into 3rd.

I am going to see a bodyshop over the weekend to get a price

Do I need to check anything or is it every thing.

Thanks Dave Q

[ARH]

The gearbox is mostprobably the linkages, they wear I'm told. the clutch is hydrolic so that may need new seals or just bleeding.

Yes check everything, it is old so some stuff is bound to be worn, trunions probbaly. Grease everywher as you check it as well becauseb that sort of stuff is forgotten these days.

enjoy

[mightydquinn]

Grease??
I thought that was a film..

Going to have a look at it tomorow to see where to start.

[//j17]

OK, first off get to Halfords and buy a bottle of EP90 oil (GL4 spec ONLY - NEVER use a GL5 oil) and a grease gun and OIL your front trunnions.

These are often neglected or, just as bad pumped full of grease. They should be topped up with oil ever 3,000 miles.

[fenderbender]

//j17 said:

OK, first off get to Halfords and buy a bottle of EP90 oil (GL4 spec ONLY - NEVER use a GL5 oil) and a grease gun and OIL your front trunnions.

These are often neglected or, just as bad pumped full of grease. They should be topped up with oil ever 3,000 miles.

Absolutely correct. If you do not use oil (specified in the workshop manual incidentally - but to most grease monkeys a grease nipple is for grease, not oil )what happens is that the king pin corrodes where it enters the trunnion and will /can eventually shear. It happened to me in 1979 at 80mph in my GT6. Luckily the wheel collapsed up into the huge wheel arch and the bodywork kept the wheel travelling in a straight line so I could slow down and stop safely. That's why I can sit typing this today.

All this is because certain sections of the British motor industry thought it a good idea to build suspension components where movement took place on a threaded component. Worst example was MG Midget / AHS lower wishbones. Just rubbish design, Im afraid... but failure can be kept at bay by lots of proper preventative maintenance.

[mightydquinn]

I will do that.
What's trunions???
I Have a lot of learning to do.

I bought it as it ws differant and looked nice.

Its a bit slower than my Rs2000.

[//j17]

fenderbender - very unusual for a trunnion to fail at speed. They normally fail during low speed turns (when the change in suspension geometry puts the greatest load on the vertical link/trunnion point).

mightydquinn - OK, a simple and simplified description of the Triumph front suspension...

At the front if you take the wheel off (makes things easier to see) you will have the hun the wheel bolts too sticking out the side. Behind this and bolted to it is the brake disk, running through the brake caliper.

You can't see this bit unless you take the hub off is a length of metal bar sticking out parallel to the road. This is the stub axel. The inboard end of this is bolted in to the middle of the vertical link. This is the vertical bit that, un-orrigonally links the upper and lower wishbones (the bits that attach thevertical link to the chassis).

At the bottom of the vertical link (and after you have cleaned off 30 years of crud) you will find a lump of brass that the lower wishbone bolts to and the vertical link sticks out of. This is the trunnion.

Should you take it all appart (probably a good idea so you know what condition everything is in, but screw it for now - wait till what passes for good weather is done for the year ^_^) you will find the brass lump has a female thread inside of it and the bottom of the vertical link has a male screw thread.

Now 1/4 the weight of the car sits on these screw threads, which is why Triumph specify EP90 oil (Extream Pressure 90 oil). If you use grease it's too thick and just sits at the bottom. As I said before, make sure it's an EP90 oil to GL4 spec. Modern GL5 spec EP90 oils have additives that eat brass - not good. Thankfully GL4 oil tends to be cheaper and is the same stuff you need for your gearbox/rear dif.

[yertis]

I thought that EP90 went out of favour yonks ago. I've always used the appropriate lithium grease and my trunnions are in excellent shape (or were last time I checked).

[mightydquinn]

Thanks For the idiot guide.
The next time I get it out of the garage I will have a look.
My other cars a ford Escort so its a bit differant.

The car has been rebuilt and has had loads of work done so I would presume these will have been changed.

Talk about looks.They just stop and stare at you. I will have to get some sunglasses so I domt get recognised.

[//j17]

yertis said:

I thought that EP90 went out of favour yonks ago. I've always used the appropriate lithium grease and my trunnions are in excellent shape (or were last time I checked).

Nope - lithium grease bad, EP90 good.

Grease (any grease) is only designed for low pressure lubrication - wheel bearings, steering racks, etc.

Each trunnion is taking about 186Kg static load on a thread contact area of what...500mm x 5mm or 0.0025 sq meters - a force of 74400 Kg/sq m.

The most common problem with using grease is that the top of the thread gets dry, the dust cover goes dry and doesn't seal and so water gets in to the top of the thread on the vertical link. This starts to rust and weaken, then one day your turning right at a junction on the wheel falls off with a failed vertical link.

[fenderbender]

//j17 said:

fenderbender - very unusual for a trunnion to fail at speed. They normally fail during low speed turns (when the change in suspension geometry puts the greatest load on the vertical link/trunnion point).

True enough. Years ago you'd see them beached halfway round T-junctions with one wheel at a strange and unusual angle. In my case I had been caning it a bit round some tight bends immdiately before and may have hit a pothole - cannot remember the details other than the ensuing laundry bill...

[fenderbender]

mightydquinn said:

I will do that.
What's trunions???
I Have a lot of learning to do.

I bought it as it ws differant and looked nice.

Its a bit slower than my Rs2000.

A Trunnion is item 41 on the diagram below. have fun!

[SimonIG10]

Hi all, I have also just recently bought a Herald 13/60 Convertible. Couple of questions... can you use any grease gun for the EP90 oil? Just wondered as obviously a lot less viscous than the grease you normally put in them. Also does anyone know the size of the grease nipples you need? I see on Ebay you can get them in packs. I wondered if it was easier just to fit them to all the relant points rather than keep screwing them in and out as the manual suggests. Looking at what is round the bottom of my trunnions I suspect grease has been used. Gonna strip all the suspension in the winter so should last a few more weeks of decent weather. What do people think on the Poly bushes? Is it worth fitting to all the suspension and steering?

[//j17]

You can use any grease gun, but I'd recommend you buy a dedicated one for the job as it's going to end up in a state (due to the lower viscosity). The key criteria for this grease gun should be price - the cheapest piece of junk you can find

The advantage of using blanking plugs is that your nipples don't get covered in crap. That said I leave mine in place - just make sure there is enough room (greaseable universal joints can't have nipples left in place - well, not for more that 1/2 a revolution )

Polybushes work wonders. If your on origonal runner ones they will be shot after 30+ years. If your on more recent after-market rubber, they seem to be shot after 5 - 10 years. Polybushes seem to be easier to fit, tighten up the suspension nicely and seem to last a lot better.

Edited by //j17 on Monday 18th September 10:43