General opinions about engineering in a TVR

[lazyitus]

Whats the general opinion of the engineering side of TVR?

Just curious - I'm not technically minded or gifted but I know (as a layman) that Mercedes Benz for example, are engineered to very high standards.

I just wondered what you technically brained car enthusiasts thought about the general engineering that goes into our TVR's. Is it to a high standard, are the manufacturing standards actually higher than reliability issues suggest? Are there exacting standards going into the production of modern day TVR's? Do they use high tech, modern day tooling and computers for example?

Open debate..

[rs mexico]

Over engineered under developed.

[the pits]

Mercedes can't afford to over engineer their cars like they used to. Economic forces have changed the way the germans build their cars across the board. A ten year old E-class will be around long after the current one has fallen to bits. And stories of build quality deterioration are everywhere. Most people reckon Audi have the best build quality. It certainly used to be mercedes.

I don't know much about engineering but I think TVR have achieved miracles on what must be a tiny budget with my Sagaris. I think the build quality inside is actually very good. All the stitching is neat and there are absolutely no squeaks or rattles inside. Very impressive and benefits from using a tried and dested design that first appeared in the Tamora. The design itself is imaginative, largely intelligent and very pleasing to use, while it continues to work flawlessly. The way the air con is routed behind the glove box giving in effect and air conditioned glove box. The neat buttons behind the steering wheel to operate the multi function screen. The way you can remove a seat cushion for more headroom and support on trackdays. All simple well thought out, usable stuff. I also love the hidden door buttons and lack of exterior door handles and again as long as they continue to perform then great. If they start playing up, not so great.

Given the Sagaris is just a prototype you can buy the only bit that feels like it should have been developed further, to me, is the bonnet design. I know they've fully revised it now but I can't believe that they didn't have problems with the prototypes as the design of the catches just isn't robust enough. Given the importance of a rock solid bonnet on a very fast car, this should have been addressed. I have to add that mine has never come off but it does move around too much at high speed. Probably purely psychological but that's all it takes to persuade someone to go for that obvious Cayman choice.

The fundamentals of the engineering are sound though and to my eyes far superior to a Porsche 911. By this I'm talking about a front-mid longitudinal engine set into a stiff backbone chassis, clothed in lightweight body work. The gearbox, pedals and brakes are among the best available anywhere. The car is a joy to drive and genuine wonder how so much power can be put in such a small, light car with no electronic nannying and be so usable. The long travel throttle and relative lack of low down torque are a big part of this and all as TVR intented. The long travel throttle means you can't simply floor the car and that the power is can be metered out with precision. It works brilliantly.

Edited by the pits on Wednesday 30th August 18:59

[lazyitus]

Interesting reading ThePits.

[rev-erend]

Some of the engineering is good, under developed - definately as they used to build something, it seemed OK - so they sold it to customers.. they then improved the design as they went on.

I personally think a lot of recent problems have been due to complex body shapes (Tuscan / Sagaris) with TVR's production methods with glassfibre - this takes a lot of man hours to get right.. I think this has hit their price pretty hard of late.

They also lag behind in safety .. it's not even an option
(not that I'd tick the box)..

[benojir]

Hi all,

I was at factory a few years ago, and worked in Accident Repair on one of the Swordfish cars, which- i was told- was built by Development, as opposed to the production line. This Tuscan definitely seemed better finished than a production line one. Everything form paintwork, to how well the interior was put together, to how it felt wholst driving (not many rattles etc)

I personally think the cars are well engineered, but not necessarily manufactured to the spec they are intended to be. The develpoment team can obviously spend a few weeks building one great car, but the production line is another story- so cost/time of production takes effect.

just my 2 cents

ben

[rs mexico]

Are these the development staff who road test cars with no oil in the diff and gearbox and go of the road backwards?I wouldn,t have gone round the block in one of the swordfish cars as one was made out of a fire damaged right off.As for being better screwed together my arse.

[rs mexico]

I was on about the swordfish cars not being better built than production models.

[rs mexico]

The movie cars .The problem with the mk1 tuscan was it was produced on 5 seperate lines thus 5 seperate standards.

[rs mexico]

It could have killed the modle if left unchecked.The difference in some cases was like night and day.

[gomark]

rs mexico said:

It could have killed the modle if left unchecked.The difference in some cases was like night and day.

Hi rs mexico. Interested in your recent posts. About to buy a Tuscan so am filling my boots with knowledge!!

Obviously you have inside knowledge. How long had this issue been going on for? Was it rectified at a certain point in time? What were the spectrum of differences between on production line and the other?

Interested to hear your divine knowledge!!

[rs mexico]

Check out my profile for one.The main production went from two lines to seven when the tuscan came onto line and the Chim and griff were being fazed out which resulted in production staff having to perform multiple tasks which they had never done before. This transition was a painful and a long process.After much arguments and discussions with senior management the lines were amalgamated and eventually went down from seven to five to four to three to two again. This resulted in the tuscans being produced on one line and resulting in one standard, which should have been the bench mark from day one when bringing a new model into production. xx

[gomark]

V. Interesting!!

And when were the production lines streamlined to handle one model rather than multiple ones?

[rs mexico]

I left 1 year before PRW sold up.

[rs mexico]

one line made cerbs five lines made tuscans and the seventh line tamoras and final run of chims .I still have a list of all the tuscan made on my line which ended being the tuscan line .

[rs mexico]

Cheers LA. wrighting was on the wall long before that,and it was a the most painfull descision of my life so far.

[gomark]

With this knowledge in mind, would you say that Tuscs built after a certain point had a better / more consistancy of build after a x date - say Mid 2002?

[rs mexico]

left tvr october 2003 so 12 months before that.

[rs mexico]

That be the s6 unit plus factory up grades,tvr to me wasn,t just the cars but the people who made them who in my eyes don,t get the recognition some of them deserve.

[rs mexico]

As for the people who worked there i'd like to mention one in particular who sadly passed away this week. He worked for TVR when Martin Lilly owned the company up until present day ,to one and all he was known as fat Bob the body shop foreman .Bob was a nice a man as you could ever meet who was respected by all who worked in his department .To me its a shame that avid tvr fans don,t know the names of people that made tvr what it is and what it was and it.