Potential Griff 500 owner advice
Discussion
I've put a deposit down on a Griff 500 and will be going back this weekend to check it over once again, and all being well strike a deal.
I'm fairly car clued up so will be checking all the usual stuff, and what appear to be Griff/TVR particulars like over heating and out riggers.
I seem to get the impression that the alarms are a weak point. Its a 1994 car, so what should be fitted as standard and what features should it have (remote control, immobiliser etc). Will the insurance company accept the standard fitting as enough or should i budget for something new ? The car has a battery isolator, will the alarm need resetting if the power is completely removed often ?
On the 1st test drive, it kept cool on the gauge but smelt a bit warm on our return. No leaks anywhere were obvious, is this usual from a 5 litre lump ?
My girlfriend thinks it should have a roll hoop - what are the options here and can you still use the roof with one.
Naturally no power steering here, so its heavy at low speed. Out of interest how is the power steering on those that had it fitted, is it good, or like so many cars over assited and spoils the feel ? If required, is it a reto-fit option ? On the test drive it was heavy when turning about but felt good on the move.
what else should i be looking out for.
thanks for any help - hopefully will be visiting this forum regularly from the weekend !
I'm fairly car clued up so will be checking all the usual stuff, and what appear to be Griff/TVR particulars like over heating and out riggers.
I seem to get the impression that the alarms are a weak point. Its a 1994 car, so what should be fitted as standard and what features should it have (remote control, immobiliser etc). Will the insurance company accept the standard fitting as enough or should i budget for something new ? The car has a battery isolator, will the alarm need resetting if the power is completely removed often ?
On the 1st test drive, it kept cool on the gauge but smelt a bit warm on our return. No leaks anywhere were obvious, is this usual from a 5 litre lump ?
My girlfriend thinks it should have a roll hoop - what are the options here and can you still use the roof with one.
Naturally no power steering here, so its heavy at low speed. Out of interest how is the power steering on those that had it fitted, is it good, or like so many cars over assited and spoils the feel ? If required, is it a reto-fit option ? On the test drive it was heavy when turning about but felt good on the move.
what else should i be looking out for.
thanks for any help - hopefully will be visiting this forum regularly from the weekend !
Best advice DONT
but if like the rest of us you are now smitten , bitten and loking through rose tinted glasses then the following
Oil pressure when hot at idle 15 psi at 40 mph in 4th 30-35 psi
temp no higher than 92 C
bang knocks bumps and thumps from underneath all the bushes need changing
Ticking from the engine cam , followers , rockers etc should be nice and quiet
brake judder from high speed warped discs
damp carpets
check the drop down links if your car has ford and aft torsion bars
wood dash check the veneer for cracks
all the heater controls working
check the oil on the dip stick it should be clean, if its mobile one then like water
do all the instruments work
paint chips around the nose
the screen frame is the roll bar , not a very good one but the only one you need
ensure the fans cut in when stationary and up to temperature
no clunking when pulling away or reversing
get under the car and check the chassis for rust and oil leaks
dip the clutch while stationary with the engine running no horrible noises from the thrust race
put the car in 4th and with plenty of revs slowly pull away see if you have clutch slip
don't buy a bog awful colour (yellow)
service history
rust on the top front wishbones the heat from the manifolds causes the powder coat to fall off
get medical help, but I doubt that will stop you from buying it
I could go on but I don't have a spare couple of hours
think of a grossly overpowered skoda and you get an idea of the build quality
design the body to be exactly the same as an aeroplane wing and the Griff has about the same take off speed as a cessna , its only that bloody great lump of under engineered alloy that keeps it on terra firma
good luck Steve
but if like the rest of us you are now smitten , bitten and loking through rose tinted glasses then the following
Oil pressure when hot at idle 15 psi at 40 mph in 4th 30-35 psi
temp no higher than 92 C
bang knocks bumps and thumps from underneath all the bushes need changing
Ticking from the engine cam , followers , rockers etc should be nice and quiet
brake judder from high speed warped discs
damp carpets
check the drop down links if your car has ford and aft torsion bars
wood dash check the veneer for cracks
all the heater controls working
check the oil on the dip stick it should be clean, if its mobile one then like water
do all the instruments work
paint chips around the nose
the screen frame is the roll bar , not a very good one but the only one you need
ensure the fans cut in when stationary and up to temperature
no clunking when pulling away or reversing
get under the car and check the chassis for rust and oil leaks
dip the clutch while stationary with the engine running no horrible noises from the thrust race
put the car in 4th and with plenty of revs slowly pull away see if you have clutch slip
don't buy a bog awful colour (yellow)
service history
rust on the top front wishbones the heat from the manifolds causes the powder coat to fall off
get medical help, but I doubt that will stop you from buying it
I could go on but I don't have a spare couple of hours
think of a grossly overpowered skoda and you get an idea of the build quality
design the body to be exactly the same as an aeroplane wing and the Griff has about the same take off speed as a cessna , its only that bloody great lump of under engineered alloy that keeps it on terra firma
good luck Steve
I've got a 94 500 Griff, here are a few things I'd check very hard if I bought one now.
Look out for a noisy gearbox and poor gear selection. It may well have the rover LT77S gearbox with reverse LEFT + FORWARD. They can have problems, take it from me, mines had 2 in 50K.
Make sure all the electrics work. Have a general look behind the carpet in the passenger foot well for water and poor electrical repairs.
Make sure it gets hot enough to start the cooling fans and make sure they keep the temp well out of the red. (Expect the Voltage to drop when the fans are on)
Outriggers you've mentioned. Also check the chassis rails under the exhaust manifold near the front top suspension arm mounts. Have a good look at the seat belt mounts in the rear wheel arches.
Chassis checks
I’ve never had any alarm problems and mine is standard. Has a fob and an override which fits in a small socket on the steering column. I use manning’s for insurance and they have never asked for any other security. It is garaged thou’
It will get hot in the cabin, especially if the heat shield on the inner wings is original because it will be like paper now. They get very hot under the bonnet so expect it to smell hot. Just make sure the temp stays under control and away from the red on the gauge.
Any questions, ask away.
Look out for a noisy gearbox and poor gear selection. It may well have the rover LT77S gearbox with reverse LEFT + FORWARD. They can have problems, take it from me, mines had 2 in 50K.
Make sure all the electrics work. Have a general look behind the carpet in the passenger foot well for water and poor electrical repairs.
Make sure it gets hot enough to start the cooling fans and make sure they keep the temp well out of the red. (Expect the Voltage to drop when the fans are on)
Outriggers you've mentioned. Also check the chassis rails under the exhaust manifold near the front top suspension arm mounts. Have a good look at the seat belt mounts in the rear wheel arches.
Chassis checks
I’ve never had any alarm problems and mine is standard. Has a fob and an override which fits in a small socket on the steering column. I use manning’s for insurance and they have never asked for any other security. It is garaged thou’
It will get hot in the cabin, especially if the heat shield on the inner wings is original because it will be like paper now. They get very hot under the bonnet so expect it to smell hot. Just make sure the temp stays under control and away from the red on the gauge.
Any questions, ask away.
Edited by raw-sewedge on Tuesday 19th September 19:59
thanks for the advice - I fear i'm too far gone to turn it down now !
It has the rover gearbox but no clonks or untoward noises but will listen harder at next road test. Engine and gearbox were out 500 miles ago as the current owner failed to notice the overheating due to leaky rad and cracked the block, so its got a new block and has been rebuilt with a receipt for £3500 to prove it !
there is some small corrosion on edges of chassis member, but has been waxoyled and i reckon a session with a wire brush and hammerite will stop any real damage occuring, its really light rust at this stage.
what triggers the alarm - the doors or is just an immobiliser when set ?
thanks
It has the rover gearbox but no clonks or untoward noises but will listen harder at next road test. Engine and gearbox were out 500 miles ago as the current owner failed to notice the overheating due to leaky rad and cracked the block, so its got a new block and has been rebuilt with a receipt for £3500 to prove it !
there is some small corrosion on edges of chassis member, but has been waxoyled and i reckon a session with a wire brush and hammerite will stop any real damage occuring, its really light rust at this stage.
what triggers the alarm - the doors or is just an immobiliser when set ?
thanks
Get oil & filter changed every 3000 or less and expect to pay £400 per year service plus
put a £1K away per year for other repairs
And enjoy every minute of the ride. There's no car like it for sight, sound and driving through the gears. Like riding a bike. A powerful one.
Get yourelf a tunnel and do it in 2nd & 3rd whenever possible
put a £1K away per year for other repairs
And enjoy every minute of the ride. There's no car like it for sight, sound and driving through the gears. Like riding a bike. A powerful one.
Get yourelf a tunnel and do it in 2nd & 3rd whenever possible
tgriff said:
... the screen frame is the roll bar , not a very good one but the only one you need
It's worth mentioning that the screen frame is absolutely not a roll over hoop on these cars - it is on the Tamora and Tuscan however. In my view the chance of turning it over is extremely slim due to the low centre of gravity but if it concerns you there are a few well engineered options available.
I've had 2 Griffs and in 6 years/50k miles have been rescued once when an ignition coil failed. This includes driving every day though 2 winters (before I took the hint!) and seven 3000 mile laps of Europe. They are not complex cars but need to be properly cared for so I would choose condition over everything, look for an enthusiast owner with a fully stamped specialist service book, stick a few quid in the bank in case you missed something expensive and get stuck in. Where can you by more performance and character for less?
dumbfunk
Edited by dumbfunk on Wednesday 20th September 09:38
My Griff is 94 (with the later T5 Gearbox) and I recently upgraded my alarm to the current META's to satisfy the insurer (some don't like the original Foxguard/Gemini pre '96) - I used the TVR alarm God AKA Carl Baker. This is my 4th Griff as I can't seem to get them out of my system! Good Luck.
I specified a roll hoop as an essential when buying my Griff and when I have driven with it removed definitely feel less secure. Having said that I drove around and even hill climbed in the V8s for five years without even giving it a thought.
Most of the obvious has been covered but based on my experience with a dealer prepared car :-
The first thing I would strongly suggest is to buy privately from a fussy, pedantic, picky enthusiast and not a dealer.
In addition to the outriggers, have a good look at the front wishbones as they can rot away in no time. Just because they are nicely painted doesn’t prove they are sound. If they are finished in a dull smooth grey paint then they have probably been replaced. Mine looked OK until I scraped off the paint and exposed loads of holes. New ones are not that expensive and not really a big deal to fit. Also in the same area look at the bushes. When they are worn the wishbones can creep away from the centre line and end up rubbing against the chassis leaving a tell tale mark. Again not a big deal to change, if the front bushes are shot then the rears probably are as well (mine were) Quite a few cars have had the rubber bushes replaced with poly ones.
Front bottom ball joints are a popular failure.
Lots of cars have had new dampers because most of the originals have given up by now. One of my rears was leaking. A good set of dampers transforms the handling.
Listen for any excessive noise from the Diff, this is fairly common problem and reasonably expensive to fix.
Sniff the carpets. If the car leaks then the carpets will pong which is very difficult to get rid of.
Engine mounts can fail and there have been some nasty, cheap, replacements around that fail even quicker.
Oh, and take it easy on a test drive, the back likes to be in front. Only plant the throttle in a straight line and in the dry. If it doesn’t feel outrageously quick in 1st 2nd and 3rd then there is something wrong with it.
Warning ! Once you have driven a good Griff there is no known cure for the resultant affliction other than actually owning one.
Most of the obvious has been covered but based on my experience with a dealer prepared car :-
The first thing I would strongly suggest is to buy privately from a fussy, pedantic, picky enthusiast and not a dealer.
In addition to the outriggers, have a good look at the front wishbones as they can rot away in no time. Just because they are nicely painted doesn’t prove they are sound. If they are finished in a dull smooth grey paint then they have probably been replaced. Mine looked OK until I scraped off the paint and exposed loads of holes. New ones are not that expensive and not really a big deal to fit. Also in the same area look at the bushes. When they are worn the wishbones can creep away from the centre line and end up rubbing against the chassis leaving a tell tale mark. Again not a big deal to change, if the front bushes are shot then the rears probably are as well (mine were) Quite a few cars have had the rubber bushes replaced with poly ones.
Front bottom ball joints are a popular failure.
Lots of cars have had new dampers because most of the originals have given up by now. One of my rears was leaking. A good set of dampers transforms the handling.
Listen for any excessive noise from the Diff, this is fairly common problem and reasonably expensive to fix.
Sniff the carpets. If the car leaks then the carpets will pong which is very difficult to get rid of.
Engine mounts can fail and there have been some nasty, cheap, replacements around that fail even quicker.
Oh, and take it easy on a test drive, the back likes to be in front. Only plant the throttle in a straight line and in the dry. If it doesn’t feel outrageously quick in 1st 2nd and 3rd then there is something wrong with it.
Warning ! Once you have driven a good Griff there is no known cure for the resultant affliction other than actually owning one.
thaanks for all the advice chaps - i'll let you know how the second and fuller inspection and drive goes.
I ride a ZZR1100 and race a historic formula ford so speed and tail slide action are no stranger to me. I have a feeling though that the griff will slide pretty readily and not be as easy to catch as the soft suspension on a historic car.
I aim to do the most of the servicing myself, I have good facilities and even some tilting ramps i think i can get the griff onto so i can get underneath.
Spark plus changes look entertaining but most of the rest of it looks ok - unless of course you experienced chaps know different....
thanks
I ride a ZZR1100 and race a historic formula ford so speed and tail slide action are no stranger to me. I have a feeling though that the griff will slide pretty readily and not be as easy to catch as the soft suspension on a historic car.
I aim to do the most of the servicing myself, I have good facilities and even some tilting ramps i think i can get the griff onto so i can get underneath.
Spark plus changes look entertaining but most of the rest of it looks ok - unless of course you experienced chaps know different....
thanks
FFMan said:
I have a feeling though that the griff will slide pretty readily and not be as easy to catch as the soft suspension on a historic car.
Being a fan of rear wheel steering, the Griff is a very predictable car to play with if you are experienced. It breaks away pretty smoothly and is pretty easy to hold out once there. 1st gear can snap back fairly violently if you ease off too quickly (I use 245/45 tyres). 2nd is an absolute hoot. Third is very exciting too. 4th I would save for the track and 5th you are just being plain crazy.
All this of course goes without saying that if it's wet, all it takes is a little bit of diesel mixed in with the rain and you'll be in a hedge. Take it easy the little buggers break out at 70 in a straight line if you are too clumsy.
Above all have fun
Cheers and hope to meet a fellow tail slider soon
Moose
Gassing Station | Griffith | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff