Anyone successfully protected themselves from PCCB issues ?
Discussion
Waiting for a plate transfer before taking delivery of an '05 Turbo S Cab. with <5k miles on the clock. I have searched the forum for PCCB experiences and have been left unclear as to whether there is anything that I can/should do to help protect my wallet in the event of any PCCB issues.
Best suggestion so far seems to be to get the OPC to put it in writing that PCCB's are covered by warranty for all road use. I don't expect to use the car on the track, but will be using it for stop/start commuting (and a good old fashioned hoon out of town on my way home!). The commute will rack up the miles on the car/use of the brakes, so I need to ensure I am adequately covered.
Aside from advice to swap them for steel or avoid the car in the first place - is this the best I can hope for in terms of reassurance ?
Best suggestion so far seems to be to get the OPC to put it in writing that PCCB's are covered by warranty for all road use. I don't expect to use the car on the track, but will be using it for stop/start commuting (and a good old fashioned hoon out of town on my way home!). The commute will rack up the miles on the car/use of the brakes, so I need to ensure I am adequately covered.
Aside from advice to swap them for steel or avoid the car in the first place - is this the best I can hope for in terms of reassurance ?
DanH said:
You will never get an OPC to put something like that in writing.
My suggestion is to just use it and if they wear out you can swap them for steels or replace with ceramics if the costs have come done. Should be ok for miles on the road anyway.
What sort of mileage would you expect to get out of them for road use?
18k on my GT3 Mk2 with PCCB's (though only 3,000 miles done by me to date - on road only) and they seem fine. I inspected them carefully for pitting before buying but they were smoother than a babies bottom.
Issues seem mainly to arise with track use and personally I'd happily use them on track until an issue appeared, then swap for steels. Seems most GT3 track drivers here swap out the standard steel discs anyway for Alcons/Brembos so there's no extra cost unless you're replacing PCCB's with a new set of PCCB's. I don't think anyone has done that at their own expense, as it was about £10k last time I heard for new PCCB discs/pads all round.
Has anyone ordered a 997GT3 with PCCB's, asked their dealer out of curiousity/for laughs, what Porsche charge for a replacement set? I assume it's still an arm/leg.
Issues seem mainly to arise with track use and personally I'd happily use them on track until an issue appeared, then swap for steels. Seems most GT3 track drivers here swap out the standard steel discs anyway for Alcons/Brembos so there's no extra cost unless you're replacing PCCB's with a new set of PCCB's. I don't think anyone has done that at their own expense, as it was about £10k last time I heard for new PCCB discs/pads all round.
Has anyone ordered a 997GT3 with PCCB's, asked their dealer out of curiousity/for laughs, what Porsche charge for a replacement set? I assume it's still an arm/leg.
simonharrod911 said:
DanH said:
You will never get an OPC to put something like that in writing.
My suggestion is to just use it and if they wear out you can swap them for steels or replace with ceramics if the costs have come done. Should be ok for miles on the road anyway.
What sort of mileage would you expect to get out of them for road use?
I honestly don't know and there are a lot of variables, but I'd expect 30k+ I guess.
Not me. Brake wear is not covered under warranty for any brakes.
The issue for the PCCBS was that they wear out fast and cost the earth.
The best assurance is to buy the car with either steel brakes or get a discount for PCCB's -
Paying a premium for PCCB's and using the track is probably the worst case combination.
The issue for the PCCBS was that they wear out fast and cost the earth.
The best assurance is to buy the car with either steel brakes or get a discount for PCCB's -
Paying a premium for PCCB's and using the track is probably the worst case combination.
AL001 said:
Has anyone ordered a 997GT3 with PCCB's, asked their dealer out of curiousity/for laughs, what Porsche charge for a replacement set? I assume it's still an arm/leg.
The PCCBs on the new GT3 will incorporate a number of significant differences to the 996TT, so it's not possible to compare past experiences with the latest generation set ups.
Most of the manufacturers offering carbon ceramic brakes are quoting huge life expectancies.
If they work, they should have a lot of valuable benefits. If not, swap to steels.
CraigBruce said:
Waiting for a plate transfer before taking delivery of an '05 Turbo S Cab. with <5k miles on the clock. I have searched the forum for PCCB experiences and have been left unclear as to whether there is anything that I can/should do to help protect my wallet in the event of any PCCB issues.
Best suggestion so far seems to be to get the OPC to put it in writing that PCCB's are covered by warranty for all road use. I don't expect to use the car on the track, but will be using it for stop/start commuting (and a good old fashioned hoon out of town on my way home!). The commute will rack up the miles on the car/use of the brakes, so I need to ensure I am adequately covered.
Aside from advice to swap them for steel or avoid the car in the first place - is this the best I can hope for in terms of reassurance ?
Best suggestion so far seems to be to get the OPC to put it in writing that PCCB's are covered by warranty for all road use. I don't expect to use the car on the track, but will be using it for stop/start commuting (and a good old fashioned hoon out of town on my way home!). The commute will rack up the miles on the car/use of the brakes, so I need to ensure I am adequately covered.
Aside from advice to swap them for steel or avoid the car in the first place - is this the best I can hope for in terms of reassurance ?
The brakes wear out so obviously impossible to warranty. However the problems is that Porsche dropped a bollock when they first launched them and the booklet said that they were good for 100,000 miles, BIG MISTAKE! There were a number of owners, especially in the USA that hit Porsche with some very expensive claims by irrate owners.
The new version of PCCB have new compounds and improved ventilation. As ever Porsche will never admit, easily, to making a cock-up. Suprise, suprise they bring out a Mk2 version (eg Mk2 GT3) and the wrinkles have been ironed out.
So PORSCHE SUPERCUP use the latest PCCB's and get through two sets in a full season. How many miles is that, I don't know.
A friend who has just sold his 997 Turbo (after 3 months) rated the PCCB's very highly and was very impressed with their performance.
Cost - GT3 RS Front set of PCCB's £4,288 + vat + fitting EACH Rears £2,8867.99 + VAT + fitting EACH
Credit for exchange = £ £650.00 each disc
Labour 3 hours at £315.00 + VAT
So thanks Porsche, no guarantees, no guidance and a whopping great £17,000 bill for a full replacement set.
Avoid gravel traps and be very, very careful when you get a QWIKFIT fitter changing your tyres over. The OPC's actually have a jig especially for this job, did you know that?
Given the numerous amount of threads on this subject that all end in large numbers and bemoaning owners I really don't understand why folks go anywhere near the PCCB brakes. This also begs the question why OPC's still charge a premium for cars with these fitted given that at the first sign of a problem they need replacing with aftermarket steels, again at several thousand pounds.
For peace of mind I would still ask what the OPC regard as fair wear and tear on the PCCB's as there have been threads from owners who have gone nowhere near a track day and still had claims bounced by their dealers. Personally I can't see the point of buying a car at the sort of money we are talking here and knowing there is a strong chance of having to lay out several thousand more pounds in the not too distant future
Just my 2p worth.
Yex
For peace of mind I would still ask what the OPC regard as fair wear and tear on the PCCB's as there have been threads from owners who have gone nowhere near a track day and still had claims bounced by their dealers. Personally I can't see the point of buying a car at the sort of money we are talking here and knowing there is a strong chance of having to lay out several thousand more pounds in the not too distant future
Just my 2p worth.
Yex
Call me old fashioned or perhaps i can't add up.
£6000 to spec when new,then £17000 to replace,ehh.I'm sorry but who can justify on a road car spending that sort of money on brakes,i think Porsche are losing touch with reality and taking the p5ss.For that money buy a nice 964 for the track.
£6000 to spec when new,then £17000 to replace,ehh.I'm sorry but who can justify on a road car spending that sort of money on brakes,i think Porsche are losing touch with reality and taking the p5ss.For that money buy a nice 964 for the track.
I've spec'd PCCBs on my 997 GT3, which is currently in build.
The decision wasn't taken lightly, but I know two owners who run earlier generation PCCBs and hae been highly delighted. And, I was very attracted by the potential virtues of the system and the latest improvements.
So, I made my own enquiries and, based on the advice and assurances I have, I am confident that the extra £5600 initial cost is worthwhile. It's a postive bargain compared to the cost of adding them later.
In the worst case scenario I'd revert to the conventional steel system. But I'm not expecting that.
Incidentally, Porsche CCBs are lot less than Ferrari's.
The decision wasn't taken lightly, but I know two owners who run earlier generation PCCBs and hae been highly delighted. And, I was very attracted by the potential virtues of the system and the latest improvements.
So, I made my own enquiries and, based on the advice and assurances I have, I am confident that the extra £5600 initial cost is worthwhile. It's a postive bargain compared to the cost of adding them later.
In the worst case scenario I'd revert to the conventional steel system. But I'm not expecting that.
Incidentally, Porsche CCBs are lot less than Ferrari's.
Personally I'd spec the steels and push the pedal a little harder. Are you seriously going to tell me that the potential £17K replacement cost is worth every penny for road or occasional track use. I don't think so. In a 996 supercup car we did crack the discs every weekend but then they were getting very serious abuse. That said unless someone else was picking up the tab I'd still stick with the steels rather than foot the bill for the ceramics.
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