Which coil packs ?

[steve-v8s]

When ditching the Dizzy and fitting wasted spark coil packs, what coils are you lot using and where do you mount them ?

Initially would rather like to keep the old system intact, so I can see the benefit of mounting a pair of double ended 2 coil packs close to the Dizzy cap then I can simply transfer the leads over. Another possibility is Coil On Plug and firing two coils at the same time. I have seen some very neat ones fitted to a Renault, they are about the size of a marker pen and compared to BMW ones are very small and light. They are probably too long to fit directly to the plugs so would have to retain the Vauxhall extenders and support them in some way.

I have a two coil double ended pack that is I believe from a Peugot 205 but it is quite big and heavy. There must be something small and neat. Ideally with four double ended coils in one pack.

A related silly question :- When running wasted spark which cylinders share the coil pack. In other words when RH bank cyl 1 is on the compression stroke which one is on exhaust. See that proves I don’t know what I am doing.

[mongoose]

If you want to run a wasted spark system,then the P38 coil pack from a rangie are ideal.They are already designed to fit on your engine of course,so it makes for a very neat install,they just bolt in place behind the plenum.You can remove the dizzy on a serp engined car,without any problem,and my neighbour turned me a very nice 'o' ringed bung to fill the gap neatly.If you have a pre serp,then i believe you have to retain the drive of the dizzy for the oil pump.
What ECU are you going to run Steve?

[steve-v8s]

Thanks for that Mike, Fairly obvious really I should have thought of looking at a Landy. Do the standard leads fit ? Ultimately I will probably go down the Emerald route to map both fuel and sparks but was considering having a go at doing my own ignition only box to start with as it seems fairly simple.

[mongoose]

steve-v8s said:

Thanks for that Mike, Fairly obvious really I should have thought of looking at a Landy. Do the standard leads fit ? Ultimately I will probably go down the Emerald route to map both fuel and sparks but was considering having a go at doing my own ignition only box to start with as it seems fairly simple.

The standard leads will fit,with a little adaptation(i had to shorten one for neatness).of course you can easily get a set for a P38 Rangie that are designed to fit perfectly.I would think long and hard about the economics of adding the ignition only box to be honest.The trouble is it'll cost a lot to map the Lucas ecu and the ignition ecu together,and the price of an Emerald ecu makes it hard to justify going down this route,it'll be good fun though,if you just want to do your own ignition mapping and leave it at that.

[topsparks]

Make sure that you use the early p38 coil packs,as Land Rover changed the induction and engine mangement from he GEMS to BOSCH in about 2000 MY cars,which use different coil packs.The later ones don't fit behind the manifold.

[dnb]

Here's a couple of pics of my installation while it was in progress - It's based on custom parts I made and coils from 034 Motorsport. Note that I have 8 coils and can run fully sequential. The ECU is currently configured as wasted spark so it fires 2 coils at once so thet I don't need to use a cam trigger.





I agree with Mike - don't bother with just the ignition. Do the fuelling side too, then you aren't duplicating sensors etc and you'll end up with a MUCH better and more maintainable solution. The Lucas setup is hopeless compared to a good modern system.

Edited by dnb on Saturday 28th October 21:16

[steve-v8s]

I agree that ultimately a proper fully mapped system is the best solution. But I like to do things incrementally and fixing the ignition side of things will ready the car for a box that does both. As far as I can see I only need to fit a crank sensor, four double ended coil packs and a bit of electronics to decide when to fire the plugs. Initially I would try to exactly emulate the mechanical system (apart from the jitter). The Lucas box has already been mapped by MA for the cam and induction mods, and I am led to believe changing the ignition timing won’t change the fueling requirement.

Ok on mounting the coil packs atop the rocker cover. That is one possibility I was considering, but with one two coil pack each side.

Does anybody have a picture of the P38 coils in place so I can see where they go ?

Still a bit unsure which cylinders share the coils in wasted spark. Please could someone clarify that.

[mongoose]

steve-v8s said:

Does anybody have a picture of the P38 coils in place so I can see where they go ?

Still a bit unsure which cylinders share the coils in wasted spark. Please could someone clarify that.

Coil 1 fires cyl's 2+3,coil 2 fires cyl's 4+7,coil 3 fires cyl's 8+5 and coil 4 fires cyl's 6+1
I'll take a picture of the coil packs in situ for you,later on.

[GreenV8S]

steve-v8s said:

Still a bit unsure which cylinders share the coils in wasted spark. Please could someone clarify that.

Firing order is 18436572

Pair up the cylinder which are exactly out of phase with each other i.e.

1 + 6
8 + 5
4 + 7
3 + 2

After you've spent a few days trouble shooting this you will be able to call them out in your sleep!

[markh]

steve-v8s said:

I agree that ultimately a proper fully mapped system is the best solution. But I like to do things incrementally and fixing the ignition side of things will ready the car for a box that does both. As far as I can see I only need to fit a crank sensor, four double ended coil packs and a bit of electronics to decide when to fire the plugs. Initially I would try to exactly emulate the mechanical system (apart from the jitter). The Lucas box has already been mapped by MA for the cam and induction mods, and I am led to believe changing the ignition timing won’t change the fueling requirement.

Ok on mounting the coil packs atop the rocker cover. That is one possibility I was considering, but with one two coil pack each side.

Does anybody have a picture of the P38 coils in place so I can see where they go ?



Still a bit unsure which cylinders share the coils in wasted spark. Please could someone clarify that.

Here is an alternative P38 installation if its of interest, between the heads

[pic]www.esnips.com/doc/9d59f4e4-095b-4cd2-b56e-225b0527a6ea/DSC_0097.jpg[pic]

Edited by markh on Monday 13th November 14:28

Edited by markh on Monday 13th November 14:30

[ricardo bertone]

Markh

Only seeing little red crosses.

Ricardo

[markh]

Ricardo, sorry it seems to work for me, maybe try again

www.esnips.com/doc/9d59f4e4-095b-4cd2-b56e-225b0527a6ea/DSC_0097.jpg

good luck

ricardo bertone said:

Markh

Only seeing little red crosses.

Ricardo