Discussion
Adam B said:
ballcock said:
You're not alone in your thinking!!
.. However , I've yet to hear of 997 engine issues ..
I have already read about RMS in a 997, what 996TT engine issues are you referring to?
You misrepresent me!! .. I'm not referring to tt issues , but to the fact that split liners / intermediate shaft problems (from some n/a 996's) haven't been reported on the 997 as yet(to my knowledge).It's possibly a bit presumtuous to decide on a tt purely because you feel it's going to fare better in the engine department.
Having said that , I would also lean towards tt rather than 997 at the moment , hence the 'You're not alone in your thinking' bit.
I don't think that 13k miles a year is much if you consider that the 997 would have been used as a daily runner. Isn't that what lots of people who buy new cars do (my car is for weekends as it is just a toy so i do very low miles but i do 15k a year in my company car just to and from work.
If you want a cheap car it will be cheap for a reason. In this case its' mileage and colour. If you use a car such as this as a weekend car the mileage will soon be averaged out, and I think a 997 in red is very nice, it would be my preferance over silver/grey/blue, and looks the dogs danglies with black wheel centres and GT3 aerokit.
If you want a cheap car it will be cheap for a reason. In this case its' mileage and colour. If you use a car such as this as a weekend car the mileage will soon be averaged out, and I think a 997 in red is very nice, it would be my preferance over silver/grey/blue, and looks the dogs danglies with black wheel centres and GT3 aerokit.
singh911 said:
Lots of RMS issues about in 997s - you need a friendly opc tech to tell you the truth!
Ajit.
Ajit.
yep I have heard the same.
OPC will tell you there are no problems, but then you get to talking to their service department and hey presto.
it seems the problem stems from an inherent fault with the bottom end of the engine and in particular very slight vibration from the crankshaft which, over time, makes the seal leak.
I suspect the issue will never be fully cured until the entire engine is completely redesigned, and that isnt going to happen any time soon, although you would have thought with the billions profit pork made last year they could afford it......
singh911 said:
Lots of RMS issues about in 997s - you need a friendly opc tech to tell you the truth!
Ajit.
Ajit.
Maybe it's just me , but I couldn't give a fiddler's about RMS issues .. It's the 'engine go bang' stuff that'd keep me awake at night.
This is purely personal stuff here , but I believe the rms thing to be highly subjective .. Some people can happily live with a car dribbling oil as long as they can pour it in faster .. Others hear their seal's got a bit of perspiration and they need to get the thing changed .. I'd also bet there are OPC's that push for cars to have their seals done at the drop of a hat , while others see a sweating seal as normalcy .
It seems fairly clear at this stage that RMS issues have very little (or even none) of the disasterous effects that say liners or shaft bearing issues have , here's hoping that none of the latter appear on the 997 motor as time passes.
Having said all that , I'm with you on this one Ajit ..
The tt makes much more sense to me too .In every way it's the superior car , no doubt , but let's just be careful not to throw doubt on the 997 engine while it still seems to be doing the business.
Edited by ballcock on Friday 24th November 10:11
ballcock said:
singh911 said:
Lots of RMS issues about in 997s - you need a friendly opc tech to tell you the truth!
Ajit.
Ajit.
Maybe it's just me , but I couldn't give a fiddler's about RMS issues .. It's the 'engine go bang' stuff that'd keep me awake at night.
This is purely personal stuff here , but I believe the rms thing to be highly subjective .. Some people can happily live with a car dribbling oil as long as they can pour it in faster .. Others hear their seal's got a bit of perspiration and they need to get the thing changed .. I'd also bet there are OPC's that push for cars to have their seals done at the drop of a hat , while others see a sweating seal as normalcy .
It seems fairly clear at this stage that RMS issues have very little (or even none) of the disasterous effects that say liners or shaft bearing issues have , here's hoping that none of the latter appear on the 997 motor as time passes.
Having said all that , I'm with you on this one Ajit ..
The tt makes much more sense to me too .In every way it's the superior car , no doubt , but let's just be careful not to throw doubt on the 997 engine while it still seems to be doing the business.
Edited by ballcock on Friday 24th November 10:11
You're right on all counts.
imho, and probably in the opinion of the motoring press (tho probably never tested that way) 996TT is in a different league to 997 C2S. Other than on price, its being unfair to compare the two for the 997 - fairer comparison would be 997 C2S v 996 C2 - and for that matter 996TT vs 997 TT. A straight 996 v 997 comparison like for like would be a clear win for 997 each time.
But thats ignoring what bargains our friend the used car market throws up for us - in that we can consider 997C2S v 996TT. You're into a higher league of motoring for the same money if you don't mind not having the latest shape...
997 engines - yes, lots of RMS issues about. Bothers some people, not others. To my mind, the racebred and developed bottom end dry sump engine in the 996 TT (and GT3s) is in a different league. The only reason it isnt (and wasnt) in the 997 and 996 respectively is cost. They still race the dry sump version, theyve not raced the wet sump.
All great cars, my 0.02 and only my point of view.
Ajit.
Edited by singh911 on Friday 24th November 11:51
jjr1 said:
I have driven the 996TT and found it boring, uninvolving and barge like. Feel free to think it is a great car if you like straight lines but for some of us the C2S is what a proper 911 should be.
Fair enough jjr, but i've driven many 996TTs and none of them were anything but sensational around corners and not barge like at all - but then i'm probably a bad judge of finesse in a car so just my opinion.
My preference is for normally aspirated engines too. But i think the "996TT is boring" mantra written in the magazines is utter tosh. The same mags didn't say that when the 996TT got accolade upon accolade, was winning tests against cars costing much more. Yes they aren't the most involving 911s compared with the very best RSs/GT3s, but compared to all others, they are a brilliant car.
Ajit.
ballcock said:
[
You misrepresent me!! .. I'm not referring to tt issues , but to the fact that split liners / intermediate shaft problems (from some n/a 996's) haven't been reported on the 997 as yet(to my knowledge).
You misrepresent me!! .. I'm not referring to tt issues , but to the fact that split liners / intermediate shaft problems (from some n/a 996's) haven't been reported on the 997 as yet(to my knowledge).
Not misrepresenting you just misunderstanding! not hard to see why
when you imply 997 is more reliable in a comparison of 996TT v 997C2S but you are referring n/a 996 whichh is irrelevant surely?ballcock said:
Maybe it's just me , but I couldn't give a fiddler's about RMS issues .. It's the 'engine go bang' stuff that'd keep me awake at night.
This is purely personal stuff here , but I believe the rms thing to be highly subjective .. Some people can happily live with a car dribbling oil as long as they can pour it in faster ..
This is purely personal stuff here , but I believe the rms thing to be highly subjective .. Some people can happily live with a car dribbling oil as long as they can pour it in faster ..
Agreed although RMS is a PITA and frustrating that Porsche can't fix it and publically deny its an issue. My car had RMS leak but it was tiny and would not have bothered me at all as it was so slight I never had to top up oil between services. That said it is a financial pain when you sell it on as either a) an OPC will bid you £1k less to fix it on PX or b) most private buyers get a 11 which reveals it with the same result.
Answer = warranty of course. I actually value the warranty for the cover of the inevitable (IMHO) RMS cost as much as I do peace of mind of the costly but rare shaft failure.
Adam B said:
ballcock said:
[
You misrepresent me!! .. I'm not referring to tt issues , but to the fact that split liners / intermediate shaft problems (from some n/a 996's) haven't been reported on the 997 as yet(to my knowledge).
You misrepresent me!! .. I'm not referring to tt issues , but to the fact that split liners / intermediate shaft problems (from some n/a 996's) haven't been reported on the 997 as yet(to my knowledge).
Not misrepresenting you just misunderstanding! not hard to see why
when you imply 997 is more reliable in a comparison of 996TT v 997C2S but you are referring n/a 996 whichh is irrelevant surely?
.. Yeah you're right .. I reckon I had about three thoughts there but only wrote down one of them .. Time for another coffee me thinks.ballcock said:
singh911 said:
Lots of RMS issues about in 997s - you need a friendly opc tech to tell you the truth!
Ajit.
Ajit.
Maybe it's just me , but I couldn't give a fiddler's about RMS issues .. It's the 'engine go bang' stuff that'd keep me awake at night.
This is purely personal stuff here , but I believe the rms thing to be highly subjective .. Some people can happily live with a car dribbling oil as long as they can pour it in faster .. Others hear their seal's got a bit of perspiration and they need to get the thing changed .. I'd also bet there are OPC's that push for cars to have their seals done at the drop of a hat , while others see a sweating seal as normalcy .
Edited by ballcock on Friday 24th November 10:11
totally agree. mine is "sweating" and i will do absolutely nothing about it until a) the drip turns into a puddle or b) i need a new clutch
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