49cc 'ped with pillion and no "L" plates
Discussion
Hi guys,
Bit of advise needed please. 19 yr old lad on 49cc ped with no "L" plates and has a pillion passenger. He passed his CBT when he was 16 and was riding around with "L" plates until he passed his car test when he was 18. He now has a full car licence with "p" entitlement. The question is: at the time he was stopped was he commiting any offences? He and his mother say no and BiB still looking into this one.
Local RP skipper says, "We believe that he commits an offence because his car licence only entitles him to ride a moped on a provisional licence basis, therefore he can not carry a pillion. I understand he passed his car test too recently to have ‘Grandfather’ rights thus automatically having full moped entitlement through holding a full car licence". Can anyone add anything?
Bit of advise needed please. 19 yr old lad on 49cc ped with no "L" plates and has a pillion passenger. He passed his CBT when he was 16 and was riding around with "L" plates until he passed his car test when he was 18. He now has a full car licence with "p" entitlement. The question is: at the time he was stopped was he commiting any offences? He and his mother say no and BiB still looking into this one.
Local RP skipper says, "We believe that he commits an offence because his car licence only entitles him to ride a moped on a provisional licence basis, therefore he can not carry a pillion. I understand he passed his car test too recently to have ‘Grandfather’ rights thus automatically having full moped entitlement through holding a full car licence". Can anyone add anything?
When you pass your CBT you will be issued with a DL196. This validates your moped entitlement for 2 years. Within 2 years you have to either pass the theory & practical test, or pass your car test, otherwise it expires.
If you pass the car test within the 2 years, then the DL196 ceases to expire for mopeds (but still only remains valid for motorcycles for 2 years).
His licence should show his provisional & full categories held.
Has he got the DL196 ?
Has he got code 122 on his licence ?
If you pass the car test within the 2 years, then the DL196 ceases to expire for mopeds (but still only remains valid for motorcycles for 2 years).
His licence should show his provisional & full categories held.
Has he got the DL196 ?
Has he got code 122 on his licence ?
i'm assuming he passed the car test within 2 years from the CBT date (as you give 2 ages rather than time elapsed)...
I was curious about vh's reply as I recently did direct access so I looked here: www.direct.gov.uk/Motoring/LearnerAndNewDrivers/RidingMotorcyclesAndMopeds/RidingMotorcyclesAndMopedsArticles/fs/en?CONTENT_ID=4022430&chk=QSZwT5
...which seems to imply that you only retain provisional moped entitlement rather than it converting to full moped entitlement - under "Certificate of completion (DL 196)", the first point says "DL196 certificate validating a provisional moped or provisional motorcycle entitlement" followed by the second point (about keeping moped entitlement) referring only to "entitlement" and that the "certificate is not subject to expiry". That certificate is only for provisional entitlement, no...?
In addition there is the later comment "Once you have your certificate you are advised to take additional training to pass your theory and practical tests and qualify for a motorcycle or moped licence." which would seem to imply that you must take a test to qualify for a full moped licence.
It's not very clear, i'll give it that...
I was curious about vh's reply as I recently did direct access so I looked here: www.direct.gov.uk/Motoring/LearnerAndNewDrivers/RidingMotorcyclesAndMopeds/RidingMotorcyclesAndMopedsArticles/fs/en?CONTENT_ID=4022430&chk=QSZwT5
...which seems to imply that you only retain provisional moped entitlement rather than it converting to full moped entitlement - under "Certificate of completion (DL 196)", the first point says "DL196 certificate validating a provisional moped or provisional motorcycle entitlement" followed by the second point (about keeping moped entitlement) referring only to "entitlement" and that the "certificate is not subject to expiry". That certificate is only for provisional entitlement, no...?
In addition there is the later comment "Once you have your certificate you are advised to take additional training to pass your theory and practical tests and qualify for a motorcycle or moped licence." which would seem to imply that you must take a test to qualify for a full moped licence.
It's not very clear, i'll give it that...
Grandfather rights? Huh, surely that's an illegally ageist term under the government's nanny state laws? If they live by claptrap they can die by it.
On the same nannying principles the law was changed at some point so that those who get a full car licence do NOT get the right to ride a moped without L plates or carry pillion passengers, no idea what the cut-off year was though. Benefits of (not) being a grandfather now include scooting around with various members of the family hanging on for dear life - their fear, not my riding, honest.
On the same nannying principles the law was changed at some point so that those who get a full car licence do NOT get the right to ride a moped without L plates or carry pillion passengers, no idea what the cut-off year was though. Benefits of (not) being a grandfather now include scooting around with various members of the family hanging on for dear life - their fear, not my riding, honest.
looking at my licence - which i got in the last 8 years... full car licence - which has provisional for Class A - and from looking into it - would have to pass CBT & hold a car licence before riding without L plates or allowed to carry pillion
from www.thinkroadsafety.gov.uk/advice/motorcycling02.htm
So you want to ride a moped
If you hold a full car licence but passed your test on or after 1 February 2001 you will need to:
Complete CBT
Your CBT certificate will last for the life of your driving licence.
You can ride without L-plates and carry a pillion passenger.
But if he wanted to get a motorbike: with a full car licence with provisional Class A (and under 21)
You can now ride a learner motorcycle (up to 125cc and power output not exceeding 11kW) on the road while displaying L-plates. You may not ride on motorways or carry a pillion passenger.
from www.thinkroadsafety.gov.uk/advice/motorcycling02.htm
So you want to ride a moped
If you hold a full car licence but passed your test on or after 1 February 2001 you will need to:
Complete CBT
Your CBT certificate will last for the life of your driving licence.
You can ride without L-plates and carry a pillion passenger.
But if he wanted to get a motorbike: with a full car licence with provisional Class A (and under 21)
You can now ride a learner motorcycle (up to 125cc and power output not exceeding 11kW) on the road while displaying L-plates. You may not ride on motorways or carry a pillion passenger.
When i took my CBT prior to my bike test i was told i must always display L plates and i can't carry a pillion and this would only change when i took a full bike test.
So the fact he had a car licence is irrelevant as that carries no entitlement for bikes any more and as such he was breaking the law on both counts not displaying L plates and also carrying a pillion
So the fact he had a car licence is irrelevant as that carries no entitlement for bikes any more and as such he was breaking the law on both counts not displaying L plates and also carrying a pillion
Silent1 said:
When i took my CBT prior to my bike test i was told i must always display L plates and i can't carry a pillion and this would only change when i took a full bike test.
So the fact he had a car licence is irrelevant as that carries no entitlement for bikes any more and as such he was breaking the law on both counts not displaying L plates and also carrying a pillion
So the fact he had a car licence is irrelevant as that carries no entitlement for bikes any more and as such he was breaking the law on both counts not displaying L plates and also carrying a pillion
Quoted from above site.
The Full car licence
If you passed a car test before 1 February 2001, you are automatically entitled to ride a moped without L-plates and without taking CBT (although it is recommended that you do take the course). If you passed a car test on or after that date, you will still receive full moped entitlement but will need to complete CBT before riding on the road. The CBT certificate issued to you is then valid for the duration of your car driving licence while riding a moped only.
Your full car licence also gives you provisional motorcycle entitlement. If you did not apply for provisional (category A) motorcycle entitlement at the time you applied for your car licence your driving licence may not show this provisional entitlement. In that case you will need to obtain a new licence from DVLA (using form D1) before taking CBT and riding on the roads for the first time. After you have completed CBT you may ride a learner motorcycle with L-plates. You MAY NOT carry pillion passengers or use motorways. For larger machines the Direct Access accompanying rider rules apply (see below)
Or if you prefer completing the CBT on a Full Car Licence entitles you to a Full Moped licence.
My understanding of the whole process is that if he passed his CBT & passed his car test within two years of that, it should result in a full moped entitlement, but his licence should show that. If it doesn't did the CBT expire before he took the car test ?
In which case he wouldn't be covered, he would have had to have done the CBT again.
In which case he wouldn't be covered, he would have had to have done the CBT again.
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