Clutch problem

[100SRV]

Before I take the engine out of my Dad's Land Rover to get at the clutch assembly I'd appreciate confirmation that I'm diagnosing a problem correctly:

When the engine / transmission is cold depressing the clutch pedal fully allows easy selection of a gear.

But when the engine / transmission is warmed up, depressing the clutch pedal fully does not allow easy selection of a gear - almost as though the clutch is incorrectly adjusted. Quite often the only way to get a gear from stationary is to "surprise" the gearbox by grabbing a high gear (either 3rd or 4th) and then shifting to 1st or 2nd. My Dad finds this stressful to do in traffic so the Land Rover is retired at the moment!

I think that the first motion shaft is binding on the spigot bush in the flywheel - does this sound right?

The vehicle is a 1958 Series One with a mechanical clutch linkage that is correctly adjusted and operates the release sleeve correctly (I took the inspection cover off to check). I have tried to get WD40 into the bearing in the hope it will free it up but it hasn't made any difference.

cheers
100SRV

[wildoliver]

Until you mentioned it was mechanical I would have said air bubble in pipe and getting hot.

I think its unlikely to be spigot bearing, is it howling at all when the clutch is in? they tend to scream, to test start engine, press clutch engage gear. there is no way the 1st motion shaft could bind on to the bearing and the bearing in to crank without it creeping as it would be like the clutch being up, if however it was just dry and taking up a slight amount of load then it will also scream when you do that test.

It could be the synchro's that are worn, and with cold oil they are grabbing well but whn it gets hot then its too slippery, try a gearbox oil drop and see how much cr@ps in it.

It could be that the mechanism is correctly adjusted but there is play elsewhere, most likely in the pedal to rod link, wiggle the pedal with your hand gently and see how much play before the rods move, and work down the system till you get to the release bearing, bet it all adds up to a lot of play, BUT whether that would really cause this problem I'm not sure, but it is a lot easier to repair than pulling the gearbox out and rebuilding it.

[100SRV]

Thanks Wildoliver,
There is no noise when trying to release the clutch. The first linkage from the pedal to the rod that actually moves the release fork is pretty much new - the shaft and bushes that the pedal runs on are new and there is very little play there. However, the cross-shaft that runs through the chassis to the clutch release fork (via a couple of splined flexi joints) does have quite a bit of play when actuated. Perhaps I'll replace the bushes and cross shaft first and try a gearbox oil change as you suggest. There are no synchros on first and second but my previous Series One didn't suffer from this problem.

Thanks again
100SRV

[steve_d]

Much of what I was going to say has been covered by WO.
The bearing would not be binding without emitting a howl.
Try also posting this on the Landrover forum as those guys may not venture over here.

Steve

[incorrigible]

1958 !! there's no synchro on first IIRC you should always do as you describe and put it in another gear before first

[Matthew-TMM]

incorrigible said:

1958 !! there's no synchro on first IIRC you should always do as you describe and put it in another gear before first

Nor second. Unless a later box (i.e. series 3 or later) has been fitted. However, putting it into 3rd or 4th isn't going to speed up the input shaft enough, double declutching is the order of the day .

[wildoliver]

Absolutely didn't realise it was a non synchro 1st and second box, to get in to first it should be leaned against 3rd or fourth, and double declutched really.

Not surprised it wont go in!

[100SRV]

Hi all,
thanks for the responses, the gearbox is original. The problem generally occurs when the vehicle has been stationary in neutral and the driver attempts to get a gear - gnasher is the word! Double declutching works fine on the run but as the vehicle is stationary then the only gears revolving should slow down onece the clutch is disengaged. With my previous Series One (again an original gearbox) I could depress the clutch when stationary, select second then move to first before setting off - no gnahsing of teeth.

Day of truth today - I will change the gearbox oil, fit teh replacement cross shaft and bushes and give it a test drive.

Update> There is definitely an groaning noise with the clutch pedal depressed, even after replacing the bushes. There was no debris in the oil so the engine will be coming out so I can sort the problem.

cheers 100SRV

Edited by 100SRV on Monday 8th January 13:24