Refusal to carry out a reasonable request
Discussion
Sorry if this is a bit long and involved.....
I have a driver that is basically lazy. He is very self centred and not a team player at all. Recently he came to me saying he had been to his 'specialist' (note, not GP) and was suffering from anxiety and stress - but not severely enough to be on any form of counselling or happy pills. He basically wanted me to give him all the easy day shifts and get the other drivers to accomodate him. I told him there was no such thing as light duties in driving a taxi, and had he been advised to stay off work, to which he replied no. He has long hated working nights and has tried every trick in the book to avoid them. He only works two, Wednesday and Sunday which historically are the quietest. When I say nights, he works from 4pm to 11pm so lates would be a better description.
So there's the background, here's the problem....
This Sunday, we have a pick up at Gatwick airport at 9.30pm. He has told me this morning that he isn't going to do it because a) He doesn't like night driving (news to me) b) He doesn't like working nights (despite working until 3am NYE and 2am a Saturday just before Christmas) c) We are still going to need some cover locally - So I pay him an hourly rate to sit around and do nothing or sneak off home whilst yours truly is pounding the motorway - yeah, right!
We are not exactly busy right now, so I think it is reasonable to expect him to do Gatwick and I will cover any work locally. His hours in his contract are not stipulated save for a guarantee of 40/wk. So his finish time would be around 12/1am instead of 11pm. I would be happy for him to start later on Monday morning to compensate for this.
Do I....
a) Tell him he has to go, end of conversation
b) Tell him he doesn't have to go, get someone else to go and tell him he can have the night off unpaid
c) As b but get him to swap a shift (nights preferably) with the other driver, so no loss of earnings
d) Roll over and let the tail wag the dog and go myself?
In reality I'd like to tell him to collect his P45 and feck off (because he's a disruptive influence generally) but think I will be forced to settle for B or C
Any advice gratefully received!
I have a driver that is basically lazy. He is very self centred and not a team player at all. Recently he came to me saying he had been to his 'specialist' (note, not GP) and was suffering from anxiety and stress - but not severely enough to be on any form of counselling or happy pills. He basically wanted me to give him all the easy day shifts and get the other drivers to accomodate him. I told him there was no such thing as light duties in driving a taxi, and had he been advised to stay off work, to which he replied no. He has long hated working nights and has tried every trick in the book to avoid them. He only works two, Wednesday and Sunday which historically are the quietest. When I say nights, he works from 4pm to 11pm so lates would be a better description.
So there's the background, here's the problem....
This Sunday, we have a pick up at Gatwick airport at 9.30pm. He has told me this morning that he isn't going to do it because a) He doesn't like night driving (news to me) b) He doesn't like working nights (despite working until 3am NYE and 2am a Saturday just before Christmas) c) We are still going to need some cover locally - So I pay him an hourly rate to sit around and do nothing or sneak off home whilst yours truly is pounding the motorway - yeah, right!
We are not exactly busy right now, so I think it is reasonable to expect him to do Gatwick and I will cover any work locally. His hours in his contract are not stipulated save for a guarantee of 40/wk. So his finish time would be around 12/1am instead of 11pm. I would be happy for him to start later on Monday morning to compensate for this.
Do I....
a) Tell him he has to go, end of conversation
b) Tell him he doesn't have to go, get someone else to go and tell him he can have the night off unpaid
c) As b but get him to swap a shift (nights preferably) with the other driver, so no loss of earnings
d) Roll over and let the tail wag the dog and go myself?
In reality I'd like to tell him to collect his P45 and feck off (because he's a disruptive influence generally) but think I will be forced to settle for B or C
Any advice gratefully received!
Deep Breath long response: -
I also run a private hire business and can empathise with regard to employees wanting their bread buttered both sides.
Recently we have seen off the last of the drivers who create a bad influence and good riddance.
An employee such as this must be brought into line completely otherwise they will spread their poison and you quickly find half your drivers suffering his second hand apathy. Licensing new drivers is getting harder all the time but losing half your present workforce is worse.
Every job in the world has aspects that people don't like, but most accept it as par for the course. When I interview people I now make it clear that drivers are required to do all types of shift as it is the only fair way, we have a rota system which means every week can be similar but not identical. I no longer accept new drivers that only work specific days of the week it leads to too many problems, "I always do that shift." and "I never do that shift." When these types are on holiday or ill then it comes down to you.
We do accept reasonable requests for time off and drivers are encouraged to swap shifts with another driver so that they can be owed a favour, everyone is entitled to a life outside of work but we run a demand responsive, flexible business and employess must match up.
It all depends how watertight your contracts are. We were taken to the Employment Tribunal in 2006 and won, but only after our contracts were scrutinised thoroughly by the panel. I'm lucky as I have legal training. Despite this I have found the easiest way is to squeeze them out slowly.
This process turns discrimination back on itself by ensuring you treat every driver EXACTLY THE SAME. The trouble makers will either fall foul of your rules or eventually just give up. You must not give in and allow him to pick and choose, it is a slippery slope, your other drivers will soon realise what is going on and before you know it you have a list of demands as long as your arm from everyone!
IN SUMMARY!
Don't give in on this or any other occasion it's a slippery slope.
Force him to clarify his position medically.
Insist that if he wants to change shift after they have been assigned he must swap with another driver (with your approval)
Tighten up on all your rules and policies, the good employees can see that rules are there for fairness, the bad employees will rebell and make their situation worse so that they get fed up and leave, or you end up with more than enough to fire them.
I also run a private hire business and can empathise with regard to employees wanting their bread buttered both sides.
Recently we have seen off the last of the drivers who create a bad influence and good riddance.
An employee such as this must be brought into line completely otherwise they will spread their poison and you quickly find half your drivers suffering his second hand apathy. Licensing new drivers is getting harder all the time but losing half your present workforce is worse.
Every job in the world has aspects that people don't like, but most accept it as par for the course. When I interview people I now make it clear that drivers are required to do all types of shift as it is the only fair way, we have a rota system which means every week can be similar but not identical. I no longer accept new drivers that only work specific days of the week it leads to too many problems, "I always do that shift." and "I never do that shift." When these types are on holiday or ill then it comes down to you.
We do accept reasonable requests for time off and drivers are encouraged to swap shifts with another driver so that they can be owed a favour, everyone is entitled to a life outside of work but we run a demand responsive, flexible business and employess must match up.
It all depends how watertight your contracts are. We were taken to the Employment Tribunal in 2006 and won, but only after our contracts were scrutinised thoroughly by the panel. I'm lucky as I have legal training. Despite this I have found the easiest way is to squeeze them out slowly.
This process turns discrimination back on itself by ensuring you treat every driver EXACTLY THE SAME. The trouble makers will either fall foul of your rules or eventually just give up. You must not give in and allow him to pick and choose, it is a slippery slope, your other drivers will soon realise what is going on and before you know it you have a list of demands as long as your arm from everyone!
IN SUMMARY!
Don't give in on this or any other occasion it's a slippery slope.
Force him to clarify his position medically.
Insist that if he wants to change shift after they have been assigned he must swap with another driver (with your approval)
Tighten up on all your rules and policies, the good employees can see that rules are there for fairness, the bad employees will rebell and make their situation worse so that they get fed up and leave, or you end up with more than enough to fire them.
Red Cabbage - exactly my thoughts. How would you suggest I clarify his medical condition? Physically he's fine, plays golf at every opportunity.
Just dug out his contract:
"Hours of Work - Your precise hours of work will be detailed in accordance with the particular requirements of the business. Your contracted hours will be 40 per week excluding meal breaks.
You will be required to work at weekends and on public holidays. the length of the working day and number of working days per month may vary. You may volunteer to work additional hours in excess of your contracted hours, where the operational need exists. Any hours worked in excess of your contracted hours will be paid at the appropriate flat basic rate."
Think that pretty much clears up whether he goes to Gatwick or not.
Just dug out his contract:
"Hours of Work - Your precise hours of work will be detailed in accordance with the particular requirements of the business. Your contracted hours will be 40 per week excluding meal breaks.
You will be required to work at weekends and on public holidays. the length of the working day and number of working days per month may vary. You may volunteer to work additional hours in excess of your contracted hours, where the operational need exists. Any hours worked in excess of your contracted hours will be paid at the appropriate flat basic rate."
Think that pretty much clears up whether he goes to Gatwick or not.
Plotloss said:
Has he been with you less than 12 months?
If so, get shot, plain and simple.
If so, get shot, plain and simple.
Yes, but only because I bought the company in May 2006. Up until that point the drivers had had no contracts at all! One of his first bleats was that he had no contract - and was the last to sign his.
So in essence he has been with the company over 12 months and I think I would be in hot water to just get shot.
Tyre Smoke said:
Just dug out his contract:
...
Think that pretty much clears up whether he goes to Gatwick or not.
...
Think that pretty much clears up whether he goes to Gatwick or not.
Sounds reasonable...and if he refuses you are within rights to start going down the disciplinary route with him. But above all, as has been said, stick to the rules. Play it by the book and he'll stuff himself, I reckon.
I have a theory that's served me well. There are four sorts of employees:
1) Nice people who are non-productive
2) Irritating people who are productive
3) Irritating people who are not productive
4) Nice people who are productive
Basically, get rid of 1, 2 & 3 and keep 4. And it's not easy ridding yourself of the 1s and 2s.
1) Nice people who are non-productive
2) Irritating people who are productive
3) Irritating people who are not productive
4) Nice people who are productive
Basically, get rid of 1, 2 & 3 and keep 4. And it's not easy ridding yourself of the 1s and 2s.
I also inherited employees when I bought the business and introduced contracts - hence the clearout. Only the bad stuff mind!
Your contract sounds well worded but nothing is 100%.
Agreeing with others here, following your disciplinary process (within the law) is essential.
Any potential Tribunal will look for evidence of a genuine effort to resolve issues so make sure you are covered from the start. They will also question whether this individual has been 'railroaded' out of the business, so make sure you can refer to other applications of your contract policies as examples.
If he is smart he will know when he is snookered and clear off, if not you will be safe at a Tribunal.
My own experience similar to this resulted in the employee leaving over a very small matter rather than the big problem. I think he knew his pride would be left intact that way!
PUT EVERYTHING IN WRITING.
With regard to his medical condition you need to request clarification of his condition so that you can 'help him deal with it in relation to his work'. This can be done verbally but give him a copy of the request in writing as well and request a response in writing from him or his GP or specialist.
Look up HSE and DWP websites for information on dealing with problems in the workplace such as mental health, alcohol etc.
Your contract sounds well worded but nothing is 100%.
Agreeing with others here, following your disciplinary process (within the law) is essential.
Any potential Tribunal will look for evidence of a genuine effort to resolve issues so make sure you are covered from the start. They will also question whether this individual has been 'railroaded' out of the business, so make sure you can refer to other applications of your contract policies as examples.
If he is smart he will know when he is snookered and clear off, if not you will be safe at a Tribunal.
My own experience similar to this resulted in the employee leaving over a very small matter rather than the big problem. I think he knew his pride would be left intact that way!
PUT EVERYTHING IN WRITING.
With regard to his medical condition you need to request clarification of his condition so that you can 'help him deal with it in relation to his work'. This can be done verbally but give him a copy of the request in writing as well and request a response in writing from him or his GP or specialist.
Look up HSE and DWP websites for information on dealing with problems in the workplace such as mental health, alcohol etc.
You have a duty of care, but under the access to medical records act 1988 you have a right to request access to medical records.
The employee has a right to refuse, which you can basically say "Because I don't know what's wrong with you I can't employ you as I might be putting your health and customers life's at risk"
If you get consent you can then
a) sack them for lying.
b) sack them because they are not fit for work.
I've got a couple of people who have given me notes from GP asking for NO shift work or sitting down work. I put one guy back on shifts 3 years after he recovered from a heart bypass and he's collapsed in the canteen one night and had to be rushed to Casualty, turns out he's suffering from Nervous Exhaustion due to his wife dieing and his dog having some illness, but Hey How guilty did I feel when I thought I'd done it to him ? (Not at all )
The employee has a right to refuse, which you can basically say "Because I don't know what's wrong with you I can't employ you as I might be putting your health and customers life's at risk"
If you get consent you can then
a) sack them for lying.
b) sack them because they are not fit for work.
I've got a couple of people who have given me notes from GP asking for NO shift work or sitting down work. I put one guy back on shifts 3 years after he recovered from a heart bypass and he's collapsed in the canteen one night and had to be rushed to Casualty, turns out he's suffering from Nervous Exhaustion due to his wife dieing and his dog having some illness, but Hey How guilty did I feel when I thought I'd done it to him ? (Not at all )
As others have said, if you have someone who is genuinely obstructive or lazy you have to weight up:
1) How much money they are making you and how difficult they would be to replace against
2) The cost of the damage he is doing financially and to your and your employees standing in the business.
In the long term on the face of it it is obvious you should get rid. To be frank it does seem that the 'sick note' is a bit of a diversion to the fact that he doesnt like working nights. I am sure the 'specialist' has not specifically said that he cannot work nights!?
Your contract is good. It is also quite reasonable in the industry you are in. If his 'illness' means that he physically cannot perform his contract although you may like to show how you have bended over backwards for him then this *can* be dismissable as any other breach - but as that road is long and complicated I wouldnt jump to go down that route.
I would go down the line of confirming his contract with him and showing that everyones contract is the same and you are in charge of making sure that the rotas and shifts are fair for *everyone*. By giving him easier shifts you are basically discriminating against other staff who are in the same position.
I would explain that you are unable to do this is it would put your business at risk, and this will be the situation from now on.
As of the way to give the 'ultimatum' - at the moment you are the one worrying about the best way forward and as such he has the power as he is calling the options. I would let him choose his own fate from the options *I* choose. These would be:
1) Complete his fair rota like everyone else - that includes going to Gatwick when necessary, now and in the future.
2) If he really cannot/doesnt like doing night shifts offer to renegotiate his contract and reduce his hours to 30 or 20 so that 'pro rata' he has less night shifts. Tell him you will have to do this so you can afford to get in staff to cover the night shifts he wont be doing any more.
Obviously the secret third option is that he looks for another job which he will know of and will save you a lot of hassle!
By doing this you can show that not only have you tried to help him but he is given the appearance that he is choosing his own fate and will therefore be more happy with the outcome.
1) How much money they are making you and how difficult they would be to replace against
2) The cost of the damage he is doing financially and to your and your employees standing in the business.
In the long term on the face of it it is obvious you should get rid. To be frank it does seem that the 'sick note' is a bit of a diversion to the fact that he doesnt like working nights. I am sure the 'specialist' has not specifically said that he cannot work nights!?
Your contract is good. It is also quite reasonable in the industry you are in. If his 'illness' means that he physically cannot perform his contract although you may like to show how you have bended over backwards for him then this *can* be dismissable as any other breach - but as that road is long and complicated I wouldnt jump to go down that route.
I would go down the line of confirming his contract with him and showing that everyones contract is the same and you are in charge of making sure that the rotas and shifts are fair for *everyone*. By giving him easier shifts you are basically discriminating against other staff who are in the same position.
I would explain that you are unable to do this is it would put your business at risk, and this will be the situation from now on.
As of the way to give the 'ultimatum' - at the moment you are the one worrying about the best way forward and as such he has the power as he is calling the options. I would let him choose his own fate from the options *I* choose. These would be:
1) Complete his fair rota like everyone else - that includes going to Gatwick when necessary, now and in the future.
2) If he really cannot/doesnt like doing night shifts offer to renegotiate his contract and reduce his hours to 30 or 20 so that 'pro rata' he has less night shifts. Tell him you will have to do this so you can afford to get in staff to cover the night shifts he wont be doing any more.
Obviously the secret third option is that he looks for another job which he will know of and will save you a lot of hassle!
By doing this you can show that not only have you tried to help him but he is given the appearance that he is choosing his own fate and will therefore be more happy with the outcome.
Easiest and probably the cheapest (in the long term) and less stressfull is just to give him his P45.Don't bother with 'correct procedures' etc
OK you might get a small unfair dismissal claim against you,all the paper talk of large payouts are rare.
Think of the advantages
1.No more problems with said employee
2.No grief
3.No lost time having meetings etc
4.You can replace him with somebody who will help take YOU business forward
For further advice contact TVR management
OK you might get a small unfair dismissal claim against you,all the paper talk of large payouts are rare.
Think of the advantages
1.No more problems with said employee
2.No grief
3.No lost time having meetings etc
4.You can replace him with somebody who will help take YOU business forward
For further advice contact TVR management
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