Spun my 944 ....

[pcn1]

Getting a little bit to cocky on Saturday, its raining and I'm "testing" the balance of the car on a few mini roundabouts on the way home. First time a quick stab of the right foot and the back end steps out a bit and corrects itself. Wow I'm thinking these cars really are as good as they say !! Next time im coming of the roundabout at 25mph, a little right foot and it steps out, but to much, I over correct and out she goes the other way and does a 180 and stops. No damage done but I leave the sceen and go home gently to give myself a good talking to
Lesson learnt, its a good car but I'm not such a good driver.

[GravelBen]

At least you learnt the easy way...

[lsb]

No dents, bar may be a small one to your ego - could have been worse !

[Fidgits]

yeah, better to do it on an empty roundabout in the rain than a busy on at high speed!

[rs666]

I'd get yourself on a Drift Day or course. I've been using the Drift Day's at Oulton Park to practice this skill, much safer

[ph123]

If I were you, I wouldn't be too hard on yourself.
None of the 924/944/968 family actually 'like' traveling sideways, even on snow. There do have low moments of inertia, so spin quickly once they do let go and quite difficult to 'read'. And 'collect' come to that.
It's trickier to play this game on the road, than a circuit because the available grip level is so inconsistent.
There will be a few Boxster owners too who lulled by their superlative road behavior, will be caught by surprise by just how suddenly they breakaway and how difficult they are to catch when prodded on the wrong surface. Doubt whether they'll admit it though.
Interesting discussions in 'Advanced Driving' right now about skid-pans and better driving courses. (I think everyone should get on a skid pan).
Sports cars chassis are all pretty similar in this respect which is why they are sports cars (i.e., low weight/good power/athletic suspension).

[logie]

Yea, 944 grip/handling is superb. I dont think i've come close to lossing it, it did get a bit light on a bumpy slip road.

But road conditions to vary alot. 2 months ago i was driving in the rain, decide to test the car on a roundabout and it was happy at 55mph, i could feel the grip through my fingers.

Then, going to Golf turned a corner doing 10mpg and had bad understeer?

When my Step Dad drives it (Previous owner for 16 years) he does things in it i cant dream, but then again he is a former Rally Driver...

[paul968]

ph123 said:

None of the 924/944/968 family actually 'like' traveling sideways, even on snow. There do have low moments of inertia, so spin quickly once they do let go and quite difficult to 'read'.

I have to disagree with that statement - all of that family have a transaxle gearbox, putting weight at the back of the car, which gives them quite a high polar moment compared to other front engined sports cars. The car should not snap on you like a Boxster (which has a much lower moment). This is what gives them a reputation for forgiving handling. The problem is that this high polar moment needs a fair amount of skill to control if you let the tail go too far, in much the same way (although to a lesser degree) as a 911.

The bit people get wrong in most cases is knowing when to wind off the opposite lock they put on to catch the first slide. This is the part you really need to practice on a skid pan.

[ph123]

High or low, half full or half empty?
Point is they are less easy to slide than say a BMW.
968 with it's 3 litres does make it easier. Which means you need to provoke the smaller engined cars harder; with the obvious drawbacks of doing so.
Thank you for your corrections though.

[pcn1]

I have been wondering if the amount of rain water on the road resulted in "aqua-planing". In thruth I've never experienced this before, and assumed it was only something that happened in a straight line and not sideways ?
However this year I will get myself on a novice trackday and start to improve my driving skills, and have some fun !!!!!

[ph123]

Aquaplaning has purely to do with standing water on a road surface and the speed at which you hit it. Your tyres maybe unable to cut through the water, dependant on a few factors, but principally speed.
So it's unlikely that you aquaplaned at a roundabout.
(Unless you had completely bald tyres, even then unlikely).
Occasionally at roundabouts there are diesel fuel spillages which are extremely dangerous, like suddenly hitting ice, and worse when wet.
All adds to the fun ...

[davyboy]

Do you have an LSD?

Without an LSD I would not attempt this sliding and drifting lark.

[wildoliver]

paul968 said:

ph123 said:

None of the 924/944/968 family actually 'like' traveling sideways, even on snow. There do have low moments of inertia, so spin quickly once they do let go and quite difficult to 'read'.

I have to disagree with that statement - all of that family have a transaxle gearbox, putting weight at the back of the car, which gives them quite a high polar moment compared to other front engined sports cars. The car should not snap on you like a Boxster (which has a much lower moment). This is what gives them a reputation for forgiving handling. The problem is that this high polar moment needs a fair amount of skill to control if you let the tail go too far, in much the same way (although to a lesser degree) as a 911.

The bit people get wrong in most cases is knowing when to wind off the opposite lock they put on to catch the first slide. This is the part you really need to practice on a skid pan.

No I agree with the O/P. Particularly 924/944 take a long time to break and then due partly to the fairly neutral weight differential front to rear and partly to the much higher speed of breaking away make them a bugger to catch if being pushed very hard.

If you find it easy to catch your obviously pushing it out on the throttle which although fun with a capital F doesn't make for quick times.

[paul968]

I was disagreeing with the polar moment statement - 924/944/968s do not have low polar moments. The fact that they break away at high speeds is a different issue entirely, but applies to most sports cars these days as the grip levels have gone up.

[kik1.6se]

I'd recomend a drift day at, such as the ones held at Oulton Park. I was on the one on saturady in my 924 (until one of the heater hoses split ). It's a really good way to find the limit of the car without too much risk of damage. Even without an LSD I was starting hold on to some pretty good slides. I did spin a few times as well though.

There was a guy with a really nice yellow 911 drifting as well.

Drifting/trackday threads:

www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?t=342561&f=18&h=0

www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&f=116&t=342301&p=1

Edited to added:

As Paul968 said above, I did spin a few times at first when the car snapped the other way after trying to correct the slide, but after Practicing for a while I was starting to get the hang of winding the lock off ready for the car coming back. It's great when you get it right.

Kirk

Edited by kik1.6se on Monday 8th January 15:21

Edited by kik1.6se on Monday 8th January 15:22

[wildoliver]

In a 9d4 and certainly early 944 you have negative roll radius steering, that can be a lot of fun to play with if you can get on to an airfield or grass field.

Power in to a slide, let go of wheel, car will bring itself back round, grab wheel.

Or you can manage some lovely figure of 8's very easily.

[911wise]

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