Discussion
it can be a symptom of worn dampers, but cars with new dampers do this .. mainly because the std damper is pretty poor, high nose force required to move the piston rod. also the top wishbone is too narrow to control the top of the rear upright and the whole rear upright and hub and wheel is very heavy so you have a very igh ratio of unpsrung t sprung mass. not alot you can do except get lighter wheels / tyres and go to better dampers. or fit traction control or be more delicate with your right foot.
Well I was going to make a comment about it being indicative of a heavy right foot and a warning to be a bit more careful when conditions are damp or you'll get bitten. However, I see from your profile that you've had the car since August 2002 so I guess that having survived a winter you are probably already wary of damp conditions.
I would, however, make the comment that if you're spinning the wheels enough to get juddering then all you're achieving is massive tyre wear and wear on your clutch, diff, CV joints, etc. You will accelerate faster by backing off the throttle a bit and allowing the tyres to 'hook up' and regain optimal grip.
>> Edited by JonRB on Wednesday 9th April 21:22
I would, however, make the comment that if you're spinning the wheels enough to get juddering then all you're achieving is massive tyre wear and wear on your clutch, diff, CV joints, etc. You will accelerate faster by backing off the throttle a bit and allowing the tyres to 'hook up' and regain optimal grip.
>> Edited by JonRB on Wednesday 9th April 21:22
You think you've got problems, try a V8S!
The bad news is, this is a transmission killer and you want to avoid it like the plague. It happens when the wheel is just on the point of slipping, in situations where the grip drops off rapidly as the tyre starts to slide. You get into a vicous cycle of grip/slide/grip/slide that puts huge forces into the suspension and transmission.
Wheel hop varies with all sort of factors. It varies with the weather, and will tend to be worse in slippery conditions. Even in ideal conditions you can't always eliminate it, but there are things that can make it a lot worse that are worth checking for. First off, bushes and dampers. Next, tread depth and tyre pressure. The more tread you have, the less susceptable they are to tramping. Also they are more likely to tramp if they are underinflated.
Assuming that's all OK and the car is sound, there are various things you can do to prevent it from happening. Obviously, don't spin the wheels, that's one! The fastest way away from the line is to avoid spinning the wheels. Secondly, if you're going to spin the wheels spin them a lot. Once you have enough wheelspin to stop the wheels from momentarily gripping, they will spin appily with no tramp. This may seem brutal but is much kinder to the car than tramping. The third thing is to pull away on a slight curve. If the car is turning slightly so the back of the car slides sideways slightly when the wheels pin, the sideways movement stops the tyres from gripping and it doesn't tramp. It only takes a fractional on the wheel just to provoke the back to slide sideways slightly, I'm not talking about donuts here! The final thing you can do, which is especially useful as a way to kill tramping stone dead if it happens, is to ride the clutch slightly. Not enough to make it slip so the revs rise, but just enough to take the snatch out of the transmission. If you find the car tramps from time to time, you should get into the habbit of doing this as a matter of course. Your transmission will thank you for it.
Cheers,
Peter Humphries (and a green V8S)
The bad news is, this is a transmission killer and you want to avoid it like the plague. It happens when the wheel is just on the point of slipping, in situations where the grip drops off rapidly as the tyre starts to slide. You get into a vicous cycle of grip/slide/grip/slide that puts huge forces into the suspension and transmission.
Wheel hop varies with all sort of factors. It varies with the weather, and will tend to be worse in slippery conditions. Even in ideal conditions you can't always eliminate it, but there are things that can make it a lot worse that are worth checking for. First off, bushes and dampers. Next, tread depth and tyre pressure. The more tread you have, the less susceptable they are to tramping. Also they are more likely to tramp if they are underinflated.
Assuming that's all OK and the car is sound, there are various things you can do to prevent it from happening. Obviously, don't spin the wheels, that's one! The fastest way away from the line is to avoid spinning the wheels. Secondly, if you're going to spin the wheels spin them a lot. Once you have enough wheelspin to stop the wheels from momentarily gripping, they will spin appily with no tramp. This may seem brutal but is much kinder to the car than tramping. The third thing is to pull away on a slight curve. If the car is turning slightly so the back of the car slides sideways slightly when the wheels pin, the sideways movement stops the tyres from gripping and it doesn't tramp. It only takes a fractional on the wheel just to provoke the back to slide sideways slightly, I'm not talking about donuts here! The final thing you can do, which is especially useful as a way to kill tramping stone dead if it happens, is to ride the clutch slightly. Not enough to make it slip so the revs rise, but just enough to take the snatch out of the transmission. If you find the car tramps from time to time, you should get into the habbit of doing this as a matter of course. Your transmission will thank you for it.
Cheers,
Peter Humphries (and a green V8S)
Hey, come on guys, lighten up, don't give me that be lighter with the right foot business - I've been driving this car everyday since August 2002 and have been very light footed, to the point of dawdling...I think 'scared' sums it up more accurately - have only just recently started playing a bit, must be the sunshine! I know wheelspinning isn't the fastest method of acceleration but that wasn't the objective!
Posted something a while back about not having got the tail out in 1st 6months of ownership and got an absolute slating from Phers for being too boring
.
Can't win here!
GreenV8S is right though, I have noticed it doesn't happen during a doughnut, ie with sideways slip too.
Cheers all - I'll go back to my sensible driving mode now then....
Thanks for replies....
Matt
Posted something a while back about not having got the tail out in 1st 6months of ownership and got an absolute slating from Phers for being too boring
. Can't win here!
GreenV8S is right though, I have noticed it doesn't happen during a doughnut, ie with sideways slip too.
Cheers all - I'll go back to my sensible driving mode now then....
Thanks for replies....
Matt
Day 10 of having Chim, first day in wet, discovered the "run-off" on the (non-road) side of a roundabout........ IN THE GROUNDS OF WORK!!! a bit embarrasing! 3 years later finally getting sideways without getting backwards (mostly!) when I want to! From track days I agree that spin massacres acceleration, but improves grip first corner (not enough to get starting place back!)
In my case and other it was shagging out the splines on the GKN drive shaft - mine was doing exactly this. Had to have drive shafts out inspected - and on one had to have the burrs grown off and repacted with grease - as good as new and no banging noises - just burning rubber - but evenetually the drive shafts will need replacing - expensive £200+vat each side + labour - think end of £600.
Best to get the car roling about 15 - 20 in second dip the clutch build up to 4- 5k revs ( while rolling) and dump clutchand keep accelerating - in a 500 you will have to have fast reflexes to catch it swinging each way while lighting them up - but HUGE FUN - and less strain on drive shafts as traction is broken easier.
Have fun - don't call when you end up in a ditch or have shagged DS's.
Jon
Best to get the car roling about 15 - 20 in second dip the clutch build up to 4- 5k revs ( while rolling) and dump clutchand keep accelerating - in a 500 you will have to have fast reflexes to catch it swinging each way while lighting them up - but HUGE FUN - and less strain on drive shafts as traction is broken easier.
Have fun - don't call when you end up in a ditch or have shagged DS's.
Jon
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Axle Tramp
A form of wheel hop that occurs on cars with live axles. Axle tramp is caused by the axle repeatedly rotating slightly with the wheels and then springing back.
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Don't think this is that as presumably you don't have live axels. This is probably just down to slightly dubious suspension setup.
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