Mileage and Age
Discussion
I am looking for my 1st Griff (see the thread on Griff buyers guide) and was wondering what the considered wisdom is on age and mileage. Some cars need to be used and if left for long periods deteriorate badly. Others suffer high miles badly, so need to be cosseted. Which camp does the Griff fall into?
I have seen a couple of cars on PistonHeads that look interesting and with my budget of £15k I should be able to get a nice, later 500 (I hope). However I am wondering whether it is worth spending up to the maximum budget to get the latest and lowest mileage example, or whether I should consider all options and just buy on condition (ignoring mileage and age).
Thanks in advance guys
I have seen a couple of cars on PistonHeads that look interesting and with my budget of £15k I should be able to get a nice, later 500 (I hope). However I am wondering whether it is worth spending up to the maximum budget to get the latest and lowest mileage example, or whether I should consider all options and just buy on condition (ignoring mileage and age).
Thanks in advance guys
Alex Gurr said:
I am looking for my 1st Griff (see the thread on Griff buyers guide) and was wondering what the considered wisdom is on age and mileage. Some cars need to be used and if left for long periods deteriorate badly. Others suffer high miles badly, so need to be cosseted. Which camp does the Griff fall into?
I have seen a couple of cars on PistonHeads that look interesting and with my budget of £15k I should be able to get a nice, later 500 (I hope). However I am wondering whether it is worth spending up to the maximum budget to get the latest and lowest mileage example, or whether I should consider all options and just buy on condition (ignoring mileage and age).
Thanks in advance guys
I have seen a couple of cars on PistonHeads that look interesting and with my budget of £15k I should be able to get a nice, later 500 (I hope). However I am wondering whether it is worth spending up to the maximum budget to get the latest and lowest mileage example, or whether I should consider all options and just buy on condition (ignoring mileage and age).
Thanks in advance guys
Chassis condition
followed by
Condition, condition, condition
anything above 50k check for if the cam has been changed.
Edited by puffsorted2 on Wednesday 7th February 11:00
Alex Gurr said:
... I should consider all options and just buy on condition (ignoring mileage and age).
I'm guessing most would agree with that.
For reference, my 1992 430 has over 93,000 miles on it and runs like a dream*. It's had new shocks, cam shaft, wishbones, etc. during it's life but Dulford Automotive (who've just serviced it) said it's in good nick and was a good buy. A recent rolling road session also confirmed it's still running at full power!
So, imho, if the condition's good, don't worry overly about a lot of miles.
*touch wood!
I think you`ve got to take everything into consideration, if its a later car then the mileage obviously should be quite low, but it may have averaged more miles per year than a pre cat for example.
so long as the car has been lovingly cared for, hopefully with no expense spared you should be okay, if in doubt have you considered going through someone like Rob Ingleby, he will source a car for you and thoroughly check it over, but then again it is exciting to look around yourself, even though it can be a bit of a minefield.
not many people use these as everyday cars, so really the mileage should be on the low side, when I bought mine last year it was a 10 year old car with 42000 on the clock, so 4000`ish a year is low mileage.
good luck. you won`t look back
so long as the car has been lovingly cared for, hopefully with no expense spared you should be okay, if in doubt have you considered going through someone like Rob Ingleby, he will source a car for you and thoroughly check it over, but then again it is exciting to look around yourself, even though it can be a bit of a minefield.
not many people use these as everyday cars, so really the mileage should be on the low side, when I bought mine last year it was a 10 year old car with 42000 on the clock, so 4000`ish a year is low mileage.
good luck. you won`t look back
Agreed - condition all the way. Don't worry about mileage too much, provided there's service history to back it all up. These cars love to be used. Age was a little bit more of a concern to me (because I wanted a serpentine engine, T5 gearbox & PAS), but it was not nearly as important as condition.
There's 104k on mine now - original cam & everything. I admit it is currently off the road for some chassis fettling (& all those other little jobs not possible with the car in daily use), but there are many cars with half those miles on with a chassis in the same (or worse) condition...
There's 104k on mine now - original cam & everything. I admit it is currently off the road for some chassis fettling (& all those other little jobs not possible with the car in daily use), but there are many cars with half those miles on with a chassis in the same (or worse) condition...
Addendum:
If you're buying privately, I put a lot of store in evaluating the seller. I drove three hours each way to see one Griff 500 being sold by a well respected, well known PHer, but I soon decided he was respected and known for his driving reputation, nice guy, etc. NOT his car care - it was a shed! (IMHO - it has since been sold on PH and I've seen no complaints, so maybe I was wrong.
)
The guy I bought mine from was clearly a TVR nut and had spared no time nor expense bringing it up to spec and maintaining it - he also had £6,000 worth of bills to prove it - all in the preceeding 18 months. Having said that, he didn't have a service stamp for the time he owned it because he did it himself - but he knew what he was doing.
The first thing I did was get a 12,000 mile service done at a TVR specialist and they confirmed all is well*.
If you're buying privately, I put a lot of store in evaluating the seller. I drove three hours each way to see one Griff 500 being sold by a well respected, well known PHer, but I soon decided he was respected and known for his driving reputation, nice guy, etc. NOT his car care - it was a shed! (IMHO - it has since been sold on PH and I've seen no complaints, so maybe I was wrong.
) The guy I bought mine from was clearly a TVR nut and had spared no time nor expense bringing it up to spec and maintaining it - he also had £6,000 worth of bills to prove it - all in the preceeding 18 months. Having said that, he didn't have a service stamp for the time he owned it because he did it himself - but he knew what he was doing.
The first thing I did was get a 12,000 mile service done at a TVR specialist and they confirmed all is well*.
*Touch wood - again!
Note to self; stop tempting fate.
Note to self; stop tempting fate.
Although people say these cars need/love to be used etc, you can't escape the fact that a high mileage car has more wear to carpets, seats, steering wheel, bearings, ancilliaries etc, peppered paint, glass, lights - even if it has FSH and a new set of tyres. 40k miles is still a ****ing lot of use when you think about it - personally, with your budget, I'd look to keep the miles low. That said, sitting around for months on end doesn't do a Griff any good - but storage with the right environment and precautions can do no harm at all.
Alex,
Would agree with all of the comments above. Condition over mileage anyday. But - ask yourself how long you want to keep the car. Most potential buyers will want average mileage (4-5k per annum) and good condition - and it would be thee cars that sell fastest when the time comes.
Either way - buy wise and you'll never regret it.
Would agree with all of the comments above. Condition over mileage anyday. But - ask yourself how long you want to keep the car. Most potential buyers will want average mileage (4-5k per annum) and good condition - and it would be thee cars that sell fastest when the time comes.
Either way - buy wise and you'll never regret it.
Thanks guys,
I have been eyeing a couple of the cars in the classifieds. Those that are in my price range seem to be between 28,000 and 34,000 miles. So over 10 years they are doing a couple of thousand miles a year. Both look smart, but are stretching my already stretched budget.
I intend to keep the car for as long as it keeps me amused. This is my 1st venture into TVR's so I could be getting rid in a month or keeping it untill I die. Previously I had an Elise 111s, which I sold after 4 months and 1,000 miles. After that I had a Caterham, which had to be prised from my hands after 18,000 miles and 2 years (god I miss that car)
Anyway, I need to get out and start viewing some cars to get a better feel for what to expect. I have also mailed Rob ingleby to explore that avenue.
Thanks again
I have been eyeing a couple of the cars in the classifieds. Those that are in my price range seem to be between 28,000 and 34,000 miles. So over 10 years they are doing a couple of thousand miles a year. Both look smart, but are stretching my already stretched budget.
I intend to keep the car for as long as it keeps me amused. This is my 1st venture into TVR's so I could be getting rid in a month or keeping it untill I die. Previously I had an Elise 111s, which I sold after 4 months and 1,000 miles. After that I had a Caterham, which had to be prised from my hands after 18,000 miles and 2 years (god I miss that car)
Anyway, I need to get out and start viewing some cars to get a better feel for what to expect. I have also mailed Rob ingleby to explore that avenue.
Thanks again
Griffter said:
Although people say these cars need/love to be used etc, you can't escape the fact that a high mileage car has more wear to carpets, seats, steering wheel, bearings, ancilliaries etc, peppered paint, glass, lights
The stuff you list is either unlikely to give a problem or relatively easily sorted. The seats, steering wheel and carpets of my 106K Chimaera have very little wear on them, but OTOH the veneer on the radio panel has come off and cracked in several places - this is obviously not a function of the mileage but rather the age of the car.
Griffter said:
40k miles is still a ****ing lot of use when you think about it
Depends on how those 40K were accumulated. My MINI has seen double that in just over 30 months, and after a valet I think you'd be hard pressed to spot the difference with a brand new one. Another example of the breed may have had a 200+ lbs person slip in and out of the seat, kids and their stuff put in/extracted from the back et cetera four times a day for a grand total of 8 miles driven, and I reckon after the same amout of time it would look rather worse for wear.
Alex Gurr said:
Thanks guys,
I have been eyeing a couple of the cars in the classifieds. Those that are in my price range seem to be between 28,000 and 34,000 miles. So over 10 years they are doing a couple of thousand miles a year. Both look smart, but are stretching my already stretched budget.
I have been eyeing a couple of the cars in the classifieds. Those that are in my price range seem to be between 28,000 and 34,000 miles. So over 10 years they are doing a couple of thousand miles a year. Both look smart, but are stretching my already stretched budget.
Please bear in mind that even a seemingly spotless car will need servicing at £300-£500 p.a./6,000 miles even if nothing else needs doing, relatively high insurance (although your previous cars suggest you already know about that
), 15-20mpg. Please keep enough in reserve to enable you to enjoy it. 
Apologies if I'm telling me granny how to suck eggs...
LordGrover said:
Apologies if I'm telling me granny how to suck eggs...
Don't worry, my gran tought me how to suck eggs years ago
Perhaps I ought to compare techniques I know that the car will be relitivley pricey to run, but fortunatley that is no worry. The limit on budget is self imposed (well by me, but more importantly by my wife) to make sure I don't spend too much in the 1st place. I had budgeted on a yearly running cost of £1,500 - £2,000 (excluding fuel), which is more than my previous cars, but less than the Tuscan and Cerberas I was looking at previously.
keep the advice coming
Alex Gurr said:
keep the advice coming
Check the alarm - Meta systems sounders fail and arn't produced anymore, though an updated version can be fitted with some tinkering apparently. I managed to get an original from Ebay luckily.
7 Spoke 'Estoril' Alloys need to be in good to perfect condition complete with screw locking centre caps. Expensive to replace and rare as hens teeth.
Check hood and targa conditon - especially the leading targa edge on the passenger side. Storing the targa in the boot without using its protective bag with quickly lead to this area fraying. Material can be replaced quite cheaply but then could look at odds with the rest of the hood due to fading.
Check for power steering leaks at the rack - they are a TVR special. Leaks do occur under the reservior and at the U bend near the under the pump, this is quite normal and can be fixed cheaply - the rack is a different matter.
Check all the electrics, some of the componants are behind the dash and its a pig to remove.
And then check ever inch of the Chassis again - Rusty Wishbones are less of an issue as they can be replaced quite cheaply - a holed outrigger is a whole different kettle of fish.
puffsorted2 said:
Alex Gurr said:
keep the advice coming
And then check ever inch of the Chassis again - Rusty Wishbones are less of an issue as they can be replaced quite cheaply - a holed outrigger is a whole different kettle of fish.
Alex Gurr said:
I have also mailed Rob ingleby to explore that avenue.
Thanks again
Thanks again
If you PM me I'll be more than happy to give you my account and that of a few others I know about Mr Ingleby. I just feel it's worth giving a full account of his services since you can't negatively post on PH.
richb said:
puffsorted2 said:
Alex Gurr said:
keep the advice coming
And then check ever inch of the Chassis again - Rusty Wishbones are less of an issue as they can be replaced quite cheaply - a holed outrigger is a whole different kettle of fish.
Other place to check in detail is infront of the rear wheels at the base of the wheel arch is a rectangular plate with a bolt through it - this is the mounting for the base of the seat belt, not something you want to fail because its rotten when its put under strain - if you get my meaning. (bit of surface rust though is fine justs needs to TLC) see below for my before and after painting pics, you can see that the powder coating is coming off the seat belt mounting and the wishbones. Both just surface rust so no issues as long as it taken care of.
Edited by puffsorted2 on Thursday 8th February 15:11
Edited by puffsorted2 on Thursday 8th February 15:12
If your budget is £15k you should be looking at cars for sale at £13k to leave you with a couple of grand to fix any issues and tidy up anything that ticks you off.
Beyond that, I'd recommend you buy on condition AND the knowledge and experience of the owner. I'd buy a car much more confidently off one of the tinkerers here on PH than one which has just been serviced according to the schedule.
There are some well known owners on here who look after their car with the enthusiasm you usually only expect from the diehard classic car owner - these are the sort of guys and cars to look for IMHO.
Beyond that, I'd recommend you buy on condition AND the knowledge and experience of the owner. I'd buy a car much more confidently off one of the tinkerers here on PH than one which has just been serviced according to the schedule.
There are some well known owners on here who look after their car with the enthusiasm you usually only expect from the diehard classic car owner - these are the sort of guys and cars to look for IMHO.
puffsorted2 said:
richb said:
puffsorted2 said:
Alex Gurr said:
keep the advice coming
barreti said:
I'd buy a car much more confidently off one of the tinkerers here on PH than one which has just been serviced according to the schedule.
There are some well known owners on here who look after their car with the enthusiasm you usually only expect from the diehard classic car owner - these are the sort of guys and cars to look for IMHO.
There are some well known owners on here who look after their car with the enthusiasm you usually only expect from the diehard classic car owner - these are the sort of guys and cars to look for IMHO.
It has got to be said that you'll spend more time working on the car, in one way or another, than driving it, and that's not because they break down, but they're naturally high maintenance, if you want to keep them up to scratch.
Personally I find that's half the fun of owning a Griff, but I will qualify it in saying that I originally came from a motor trade background, and consequently can do all of the work needed (that doesn't require specialist equipment) myself.
Maybe if I was paying someone else to do the work, I wouldn't find it so much fun, or more than likely, just wouldn't have half of it done
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